I'm beginning to think speed is the #1 asset in the MA

[Vudak]

I guess it all depends on what your style is.  If you're looking to dictate the terms of a fight, be able to disengage at will, and have a higher probability of landing, then yes, I suppose speed would be the #1 asset in the MA, much as it was in real life.

Those aren't really my priorities.  What I like is being able to fight under any terms dictated to me, to be able to stay engaged for an extended period of time, and I really don't care too much if I land or not.  For me, speed is just a useful tool for forcing a fight.

I'd say the most valuable assets for me are acceleration and climb rate...  I probably feel this way because I spend much of my time in a plane that lacks in both departments, the F4U-1A...

With acceleration and climb rate, I have the opportunity to regain energy that I spend flying like a guy with a deathwish.  My style does not usually require an excess of energy over my opponent, but just enough energy to be able to maneuver effectively.  In a Corsair, my maneuver window shrinks and shrinks as the fight progresses, and without sky beneath me, it is very hard to reverse that.

I find that I can stay alive longer when fighting multiple cons in something like an La7 or 109K4 than I do in a F4U1-A, despite the facts that I've spent most of my time trying to learn the 1A, and that I personally find the 1A a much better 1v1 knifefighter than either the 109 or La7.

Just look at the F4U-4...  It's universally regarded as a monster in this game, yet not because of its speed - all Corsairs are fast...  It is a monster because it can do all the things a regular Corsair can do, plus regain energy quicker with a much improved acceleration and climbrate.  Its maneuever window does not shrink nearly as quickly as its predecessors'.

[Stoney]

I was never a pure bnz cherrypicker though, my handle aside. It just seems like in the MA lately, any attempt at a sustained fight means you end up under a dogpile, which no amount of ACM can get you out of.

While I didn't agree with your "fly in a horde" comment earlier, I'll buy this for a dollar.  The problem is though, that your aforementioned horde is the problem, a Catch 22.  You use it to survive, but if there wasn't a horde, there'd be no need for a horde to defend against it.

Of course, as Trotter and Toonces know, I'm a little bitter on the MA these days...

[Odisseo]

In the Gliders world we say:

"altitude is money in the bank, speed is money in the poket"

greetz!

[Zazen13]

But, assuming a moderate environment, avoiding extremes of alt and energy, I think speed might be the best asset for a plane to survive engagements in the MA.  If you blow everything, this argument doesn't make sense.  But, if you fight sensibly, having the top end speed may be the biggest survival factor in the MA.

It's even more than that. Speed allows you to force an engagement upon others. If you're slow you can basically only engage those that choose to let you engage them. If you're fast, they don't have a choice, you're going to engage them whether they like it or not. Too many people in the MA only see the "speed = life" side of the coin. Speed is also the practically unlimited ability to attack at will when it's "convenient" for you and "inconvenient" for the bandit. That is really the the true "power" of speed. Slower planes are more or less powerless against a faster plane driven by a pilot who understands this. The best they can possibly hope for, if you enjoy a significant speed differential, is to force you to disengage.

[BnZ]

While I didn't agree with your "fly in a horde" comment earlier, I'll buy this for a dollar.  The problem is though, that your aforementioned horde is the problem, a Catch 22.  You use it to survive, but if there wasn't a horde, there'd be no need for a horde to defend against it.

Of course, as Trotter and Toonces know, I'm a little bitter on the MA these days...

Philosophically, I agree more with Trotter that the best and sometimes only way to get a dogfight that goes more than 20 seconds uninterrupted is to fly one of the speed burners and drag something willing to follow you to neutral territory.

[Masherbrum]

I look for a red dot, usually more behind it and I go for it.  I get a new plane regardless.

[Stoney]

It's even more than that. Speed allows you to force an engagement upon others.

Just for argument sake though Zaz, why don't we all dog-pile into LA-7's then?  Tactically, you're absolutely correct.  From a "fun for everyone"/playability aspect, that tactical truth won't do much for the game.  If everyone subscribed to the "speed as the genesis of initiative" approach, we'd be in for some boring fights.  Personally, I don't mind a mis-match, as many of us don't.  The problem is that if a P-51 wants to BnZ a Spit for 45 minutes, without blowing much E to pull for a real shot, that Spit pilot is not going to have fun.

For whatever that's worth...

[Zazen13]

Just for argument sake though Zaz, why don't we all dog-pile into LA-7's then?  Tactically, you're absolutely correct.  From a "fun for everyone"/playability aspect, that tactical truth won't do much for the game.  If everyone subscribed to the "speed as the genesis of initiative" approach, we'd be in for some boring fights.  Personally, I don't mind a mis-match, as many of us don't.  The problem is that if a P-51 wants to BnZ a Spit for 45 minutes, without blowing much E to pull for a real shot, that Spit pilot is not going to have fun.

For whatever that's worth...

It's all relative. By that I mean a fight between a P51 and a P47N is potentially just as interesting and likely as a fight between a SpitXVI and a Niki. Naturally, the greater the speed disparity the greater the initiative the speedier plane has over the slower, but presumably more maneuverable plane. However, two fast planes with comparable maneuverability are just as likely to feel compelled to fight one another as two slow ones as their potential for tactical initiative is also equal. If their speed is similar then their maneuverability is likely comparable also, so they will have equal opportunity and desire to force a fight upon one another as two equally slow and maneuverable planes...

The actual terms of the engagement may vary semantically between fast planes, but the likelihood of an engagement essentially remains the same between them. Actually, the likelihood of engagement in a fast plane generally increases as the faster plane is very likely to be engaged by any and every slower plane in a position of E advantage sufficient to temporarily force an engagement upon the fast plane in an aggressive and intimate fashion. The exact opposite is true of slow but maneuverable planes, they are generally much less likely to be engaged in a fashion that would tend to precipitate anything resembling an intimate engagement, being much more likely to be victimized by high speed slashing attacks.


So, ironically, if you seek to be engaged as much as possible, as intimately as possible, then fly fast planes. Of course, to enjoy any kind of success in this way will require the skill necessary to out-fly/out-think pilots in more maneuverable planes. Flying slow, but very maneuverable planes, ironically, is the worst possible thing you can do if you wish to be engaged, especially on relatively even terms. People that cruise around at 12k+ in Spits, Nikis and the like, whining non-stop about their perception of the lack of true "fights" just make me chuckle. If you want "fights" you must handicap yourself with poor maneuverability, you will then be engaged as much as your heart desires.