The Debate and national security

[Kaw1000]

I don't know if you guys caught the part of the debate when Obama said
he would attack Pakistan. McCain reprimanded him and said"you don't say that kind
of thing in public" You could tell McCain was very upset by that comment.
Kinda like a father correcting his son for saying the wrong thing.

[crockett]

I don't know if you guys caught the part of the debate when Obama said
he would attack Pakistan. McCain reprimanded him and said"you don't say that kind
of thing in public" You could tell McCain was very upset by that comment.
Kinda like a father correcting his son for saying the wrong thing.

No McCain "claimed" Obama said he would attack Pakistan. However in case you haven't been watching the news, we are already attacking Pakistan under Bush.

What Obama said, was if we had reports on where say bin Laden was, and if Pakistan was unwilling or couldn't attack him, we would attack our selves. McCain tries to construe that as Obama saying he will go attack the Pakistan govt, which is nothing more than another BS claim by McCain.

Obama simply said he would do what Bush is doing now. He said he would willingly hit a target if it was identified even without corporation  of Pakistan, which is exactly what we should do. Do you not remember all the flack you Republicans gave Clinton because he didn't take the opportunity to kill bin Laden by making a strike inside another country? Are you now saying what he did was right?


Even Palin seems to agree with Obama & Bush on this.. http://www.cbsnews.com/blogs/2008/09/27/politics/fromtheroad/entry4483110.shtml

This is another point where McCain is full of it. McCain also said he would stop giving money to country's that don't like us.. Yet he turns around and still wants to give Pakistan aid money while they are shooting at our troops and not working with us on these groups that are crossing the boarder and attacking us.

[john9001]

like when Don Corleone told his son, "you don't talk family business in front of strangers"

[crockett]

like when Don Corleone told his son, "you don't talk family business in front of strangers"

It's nothing that hasn't been said or done in the past. It's just McCain trying to make a issue of something that has already and is still happening. We are already doing attacks inside Pakistan and we should have been doing them the min Pakistan started showing they werent working with us.

[john9001]

Obama simply said he would do what Bush is doing now.

obama would never ever say he would do what bush is doing, bush is the devil doncha know, and obama is the savior of the world.

[crockett]

obama would never ever say he would do what bush is doing, bush is the devil doncha know, and obama is the savior of the world.

No Bush has fumbled both wars and mismanaged them from the start, he didn't actually start doing things right until this last year. In fact Bush fired most of the Generals who told him what he should have been doing from the start, because it didn't fit his agenda. It's quite ironic, that he's now doing what he was told to do at the start and gee guess what it seems to be working.

It's just too bad we had to wait 5 years for Bush to figure out what his Generals at the start already knew. Hell maybe it really could have been Mission Accomplished a few years ago had he done what they suggested.

[john9001]

what are you saying, McCain was right about the surge in Iraq, and obama was wrong?

[Bodhi]

No McCain "claimed" Obama said he would attack Pakistan. However in case you haven't been watching the news, we are already attacking Pakistan under Bush.

What Obama said, was if we had reports on where say bin Laden was, and if Pakistan was unwilling or couldn't attack him, we would attack our selves. McCain tries to construe that as Obama saying he will go attack the Pakistan govt, which is nothing more than another BS claim by McCain.

Obama simply said he would do what Bush is doing now. He said he would willingly hit a target if it was identified even without corporation  of Pakistan, which is exactly what we should do. Do you not remember all the flack you Republicans gave Clinton because he didn't take the opportunity to kill bin Laden by making a strike inside another country? Are you now saying what he did was right?


Even Palin seems to agree with Obama & Bush on this.. http://www.cbsnews.com/blogs/2008/09/27/politics/fromtheroad/entry4483110.shtml

This is another point where McCain is full of it. McCain also said he would stop giving money to country's that don't like us.. Yet he turns around and still wants to give Pakistan aid money while they are shooting at our troops and not working with us on these groups that are crossing the boarder and attacking us.

Crockett,
You are spinning this to defend Obama's ignorance.  Let's go back to what was said by Obama:

"If we have actionable intelligence about high-value terrorist targets and President Musharraf won't act, we will," Obama said.

8/1/2007
http://www.reuters.com/article/domesticNews/idUSN0132206420070801

Even if you think something like that, you just do not say that on national television where everyone gets a chance to see it.  He flat out told a people in Pakistan that we have no respect for your national sovereignty and we will attack you if we see fit. 

That's the type of rhetoric that gets Al Quaida there recruits.

That's the type of rhetoric that gets Pakistan controlled by a Islamo-facist group like Iran.  Guess what, Pakistan has nuclear weapons.

Ya know an even funnier thing, even your girl Hillary agreed with Senator McCain's and my statement.

"You can think big but remember you shouldn't always say everything you think when you're running for president because it could have consequences across the world and we don't need that right now," said Sen. Hillary Clinton, D-N.Y.

8/7/2007
http://blogs.abcnews.com/politicalradar/2007/08/sparks-fly-over.html

Furthermore, what is happening under Bush is irrelevant.  We are choosing a candidate to replace him, and hopefully that candidate will do a better job and understand the implications of opening their mouth and saying the wrong thing. 

You need to get your facts straight.  Obama said something stupid.  McCain called him on it and was right.

[crockett]

what are you saying, McCain was right about the surge in Iraq, and obama was wrong?

I've never said more troops weren't the answer in Iraq, we have needed more troops there from the start just like we did in the past. However myself and just like Obama's position I would never support more troops under the Bush admin's past mismanagement since that war started. Up until that point the war had been totally mismanaged and I don't blame Obama one bit for not supporting the surge. Obama made the right decision based on the past Actions of the Bush admin.

Bush and Co hadn't shown that they would accomplish anything with the surge from their past actions. So how could anyone support tossing more American lives into a war that was mismanaged? I'd also go as far as to say while the surge has worked it's also been a lot to do with the fact we are paying off the insurgents. Had we not started paying them off then I'm quite sure the surge would have had a much tougher time.

That also brings up a point of what happens when we stop spreading the green around? Surge or no surge I'm quite certain they will go back to fighting unless significant progress is made.

I have no issues with saying Bush finally got his act together in Iraq and "seems" to be pulling his head out of his arus in Afghanistan as well. It's just too bad it took him 5 years and many American soldier's lives to do it. It is quite ironic that he only managed to get with the program as a last ditch attempt to right his past mistakes before he leaves office.

Are you going to say Bush is wrong for doing cross boarder attacks in Afghanistan, being Pakistan has shown they weren't willing to do it? Do you think McCain is wrong for wanting to still give Pakistan military aid money when they have dropped the ball and won't do what they agreed to do? Are you going to say that Obama shouldn't take a shot at high level terrorist if we have intel on where they are at, even if it's with in Pakistan?

[crockett]

Crockett,
You are spinning this to defend Obama's ignorance.  Let's go back to what was said by Obama:
8/1/2007
http://www.reuters.com/article/domesticNews/idUSN0132206420070801

Even if you think something like that, you just do not say that on national television where everyone gets a chance to see it.  He flat out told a people in Pakistan that we have no respect for your national sovereignty and we will attack you if we see fit. 

That's the type of rhetoric that gets Al Quaida there recruits.

That's the type of rhetoric that gets Pakistan controlled by a Islamo-facist group like Iran.  Guess what, Pakistan has nuclear weapons.

Ya know an even funnier thing, even your girl Hillary agreed with Senator McCain's and my statement.
8/7/2007
http://blogs.abcnews.com/politicalradar/2007/08/sparks-fly-over.html

Furthermore, what is happening under Bush is irrelevant.  We are choosing a candidate to replace him, and hopefully that candidate will do a better job and understand the implications of opening their mouth and saying the wrong thing. 

You need to get your facts straight.  Obama said something stupid.  McCain called him on it and was right.

Dude, they already know we will do it. We already have done it.. Saying it on TV makes little to no difference, we have already acted on and done exactly what Obama has said he would continue to do. They already know we will do it, Obama just made it perfectly clear that he would continue to do so if the situation called for it.

You support what he said, but you are complaining because he said it in public? lol that's almost silly TBH. What facts don't I have straight? Obama said what I said he did. He didn't say anything about attacking Pakistan Govt as McCain tries to elude too. He said he would hit terrorist targets if the need arises.

Again you are crying that he said something in public that about continuing actions that have already been plastered all over the news. Why don't you go cry to CNN or Fox news about reporting on US troops doing cross boarder attacks? You are really grasping at straws with this one and you should really be thinking of McCain line of thought which seems to be allow them to cross the boarder and attack us then run away to the safety line with the security of not being attacked across the boarder.

Oh and Hillary has never been "my girl' I dunno where you pulled that one from.

[Anaxogoras]

He flat out told a people in Pakistan that we have no respect for your national sovereignty and we will attack you if we see fit. 

Oh, the irony!

[Bodhi]

Dude, they already know we will do it. We already have done it.. Saying it on TV makes little to no difference, we have already acted on and done exactly what Obama has said he would continue to do. They already know we will do it, Obama just made it perfectly clear that he would continue to do so if the situation called for it.

You support what he said, but you are complaining because he said it in public? lol that's almost silly TBH. What facts don't I have straight? Obama said what I said he did. He didn't say anything about attacking Pakistan Govt as McCain tries to elude too. He said he would hit terrorist targets if the need arises.

Again you are crying that he said something in public that about continuing actions that have already been plastered all over the news. Why don't you go cry to CNN or Fox news about reporting on US troops doing cross boarder attacks? You are really grasping at straws with this one and you should really be thinking of McCain line of thought which seems to be allow them to cross the boarder and attack us then run away to the safety line with the security of not being attacked across the boarder.

Oh and Hillary has never been "my girl' I dunno where you pulled that one from.

In the past when Musharraf was President of Pakistan, we had permission to operate inside Pakistan.  Since his removal from office, we now are faced with a President of Pakistan that is no longer friendly towards us, because he is naive.  Naive in that he does not understand the level at which his own military is infiltrated by terrorists.

What you say and how you say it on the world stage means an awful lot.

I have never heard McCain say we were going to attack Pakistan whenever we felt like it was prudent.  I did hear Obama say that.  The world watches what is going on in these debates and past.  Obama's lack of thought in an attempt to get votes WILL cost cooperation and lives in the future.

Grasping for straws you say?  Look in the mirror.  

[Bodhi]

Oh, the irony!

Again, voting for a new President.  Anything useful to contribute with?

[crockett]

To take this one step further McCain's idea of say one thing in public and do another behind the scenes is exactly what has gotten this country into the problems with these religious fanatics. It wasn't so long ago that even George Bush Jr, had the Taliban in Texas for a visit while he was Govoner trying to set the deal up for Unicol and the gas line in Afghan.

I think it's good to see a leader like Obama say that his will do something if it needs to be done, rather than claiming he won't in public but then doing it anyway. Everyone knows they will done it anyway, so might as well tell the truth, rather than treat the US public like Unicorns and tooth fairies really exist.

[crockett]

In the past when Musharraf was President of Pakistan, we had permission to operate inside Pakistan.  Since his removal from office, we now are faced with a President of Pakistan that is no longer friendly towards us, because he is naive.  Naive in that he does not understand the level at which his own military is infiltrated by terrorists.

What you say and how you say it on the world stage means an awful lot.

I have never heard McCain say we were going to attack Pakistan whenever we felt like it was prudent.  I did hear Obama say that.  The world watches what is going on in these debates and past.  Obama's lack of thought in an attempt to get votes WILL cost cooperation and lives in the future.

Grasping for straws you say?  Look in the mirror.  

Yet knowing Pakistan is now unfriendly too us, McCain still supports giving them military aid money that they are currently spending to build up their military to confront India rather than fight the insurgent like how it was agreed to be used. Supporting that and believing in the Unicorns that McCain rides are what is naive.

It's amazing how fast the right wing Republicans shy away from the terrorist threat when it's not their guy whom wants to fight it.