pony versus K4

[EnIgMaSpItPiLoT]

        As far as 109 being faster I might be mistaken about that! But what alt are you talking about! If your taalking about all alts then Im mistaken and I gave bad advice on that! But It's still not abad Idea to get alt and run! I also thought that in history the p51d was faster! Especially at alt! Either way In either one of those planes I wouldn't try to stay and turn fight thats not what they are for!

[uptown]

       As far as 109 being faster I might be mistaken about that! But what alt are you talking about! If your taalking about all alts then Im mistaken and I gave bad advice on that! But It's still not abad Idea to get alt and run! I also thought that in history the p51d was faster! Especially at alt! Either way In either one of those planes I wouldn't try to stay and turn fight thats not what they are for!

On the deck at about 200 feet. If I have good alt it as simple as diving away. He'll have to pull out or compress. But on the deck at 200 foot or so they stick to me like glue.
The K4 is one of the fastest prop planes in the game and a P51 will not pull away. Besides, even if it could i wouldn't. Too many people have given the mustang a bad rap by running away. I want to find the K4s weakness and kill it. But so far i'm finding out that it don't have too many weaknesses on the deck.

[Agent360]

snip--
..... is that the only weakness i can exploit is a right hand roll or turn, because of the torque to the 109K4s prop.......
snip--

The tork is not a weakness as many seem to think so. In fact it is one of the great advantages the 109 has. The k4 in particular has a huge amount that can be used to great effect in stalling manuevers.

It is false to think that the k4 has "trouble" turning to the right. With the correct timing I can immediatly chop throttle, slam right rudder and snap roll to the right....jam throttle on and I have made an immediate right turn. It's actually a little more difficult to do this to the left because the tork will snap the plane over upside down so you have to use right rudder when turning left to counter act the spin.

The only time tork is a problem is on a slow climbing turn to the right. At the top when the plane comes to stall it will want to roll left. If you cut throttle you just tail slide. This only works against a K4 if you have tons and tons of energy and you are working a continuous looping rope.

On the deck turning right against a k4 is of no advantage at all.

[morfiend]

 If you read my post and infered I meant torque was a weakness,well that wasnt what I said.
 I corrected myself twice,1st it turns better left,2nd it is harder to roll right.Both I beleive to be true.

 As agent stated the torque isnt really a bad thing and if used to your advantage it can be quite helpful.

 

[Anaxogoras]

      I also thought that in history the p51d was faster! Especially at alt! Either way In either one of those planes I wouldn't try to stay and turn fight thats not what they are for!

Been watching too much History Channel?

[BaldEagl]

       As far as 109 being faster I might be mistaken about that! But what alt are you talking about! If your taalking about all alts then Im mistaken and I gave bad advice on that! But It's still not abad Idea to get alt and run! I also thought that in history the p51d was faster! Especially at alt! Either way In either one of those planes I wouldn't try to stay and turn fight thats not what they are for!

Both planes with WEP on the K4 is faster at every altitude.  With WEP off the Pony is faster but the K4 has twice the WEP duration.
 
The Pony can out-dive the K4 but that doesn't help on the deck.

[pdm]

Hey Uptown you have one of the best pony pilots in the game in your squad. ( SkatSr ).. While he'd probley tell you the K4 is uber to the pony, but Sr can do some pretty amazing stuff in mustang. Your definitely gone have your hands full if you get jumped by a K4. It's a fun challenge though. . Until that lone spud destroys your plane I always had fun going up against Creaton in his K4 a few years ago when I was in the 412th.

  Uptown

[BnZ]

Been watching too much History Channel?

Quite...and if the Germans had possessed the fuel and the pilots to actually make a difference with such uber-rides during the last 5 minutes or so of the war, why, the USAAF would had to have quit sitting on their hands and bothered to introduce the H-Stang a little sooner. 

[Scotch]

 This is one of those situations where you have to be aggressive and force your opponent into making mistakes. Or die trying.

[uptown]

Hey Uptown you have one of the best pony pilots in the game in your squad. ( SkatSr ).. While he'd probley tell you the K4 is uber to the pony, but Sr can do some pretty amazing stuff in mustang. Your definitely gone have your hands full if you get jumped by a K4. It's a fun challenge though. . Until that lone spud destroys your plane I always had fun going up against Creaton in his K4 a few years ago when I was in the 412th.

  Uptown

my squadies have warned me about fighting with 109s like that  I just can't help myself 

[EnIgMaSpItPiLoT]

         Well regardless if I was wrong on the speed issue. Oh well  But the tactics I told you how to do earlier in this post will work! I grantee it! I know a couple (granted very few) P51 pilot that can fly that plane like you wouldn't believe! Its not impossible it just needs to be practiced! Using those tactics I mentioned earlier will work in every plane! Just some planes do it better then others. Unfortunately other planes are better suited for the the burn and turn roll then the p51D

[Rich46yo]

Been watching too much History Channel?

The problem wasn't with German Industry making competitive, or superior aircraft. The problem lay in manning the fighter planes with experienced pilots. So not only didn't the Luftwaffe have the training machinery in place to keep qualified sticks in the air , they also didn't have the gas to adequately train them even if they did. But as for German aircraft designers and manufacturer's?? They did a remarkable job keeping very competitive aircraft available almost until the bitter end. Especially considering the huge bombing campaign on the German aircraft Industry. Both factories, component factories, and the fuel pipeline.

The Mustang was a remarkable airplane in that, like the P-47, it could fly so far, so fast, and so high. It could penetrate deep into German airspace and whittle the Luftwaffe down with attrition. The Pilots we trained in them had hundreds of hours of practice before combat while coming out of a training infrastructure that had almost no limitations.

But the attributes that made it so effective in actual war dont necessarily reflect in a computer game. As an escort fighter, a B&Z'er, and even a bomb trucker, I think the Mustang is effective. I have had an awful lot of fun flying it, even if I dont fly it much. Last week against a high ALT bomber mission I met another stang at 30,000' on totally equal terms. The long, long, long dogfight I had with the other Pony, almost to the deck, was probably the most fun Ive had in the game since I joined. I mean my hands were shaking after, know the feeling?

Be that as it may I couldn't imagine a worse plane to be on the deck with, against a K-4, then in a Mustang. Especially since the chances of a noob being in the K-4 are about zero. I'd much rather be in a corsair or a Hellcat in that predicament. Even a P-38. The truth is the K-4 is a very dangerous aircraft. Ive had hard times against them even when in a LA-7.

The guys who are good in Mustangs force you to play "their" game. When you have 2 good sticks flying as a team a pair of ponies can cause a lot of disruption at an airbase.

[BnZ]

Oh, I agree entirely Rich. My only caveat is that probably the fact that he war was almost over in Europe and American pilots were NOT facing a lot of opposition meant there wasn't a lot of pressure to update on the USAAF. If there had been enough K4s flying in '45 to make an impact, then the U.S.A. would have gotten stuff in the field sooner which would seem a lot more competitive in the LW MA.

The problem wasn't with German Industry making competitive, or superior aircraft. The problem lay in manning the fighter planes with experienced pilots. So not only didn't the Luftwaffe have the training machinery in place to keep qualified sticks in the air , they also didn't have the gas to adequately train them even if they did. But as for German aircraft designers and manufacturer's?? They did a remarkable job keeping very competitive aircraft available almost until the bitter end. Especially considering the huge bombing campaign on the German aircraft Industry. Both factories, component factories, and the fuel pipeline.

The Mustang was a remarkable airplane in that, like the P-47, it could fly so far, so fast, and so high. It could penetrate deep into German airspace and whittle the Luftwaffe down with attrition. The Pilots we trained in them had hundreds of hours of practice before combat while coming out of a training infrastructure that had almost no limitations.

But the attributes that made it so effective in actual war dont necessarily reflect in a computer game. As an escort fighter, a B&Z'er, and even a bomb trucker, I think the Mustang is effective. I have had an awful lot of fun flying it, even if I dont fly it much. Last week against a high ALT bomber mission I met another stang at 30,000' on totally equal terms. The long, long, long dogfight I had with the other Pony, almost to the deck, was probably the most fun Ive had in the game since I joined. I mean my hands were shaking after, know the feeling?

Be that as it may I couldn't imagine a worse plane to be on the deck with, against a K-4, then in a Mustang. Especially since the chances of a noob being in the K-4 are about zero. I'd much rather be in a corsair or a Hellcat in that predicament. Even a P-38. The truth is the K-4 is a very dangerous aircraft. Ive had hard times against them even when in a LA-7.

The guys who are good in Mustangs force you to play "their" game. When you have 2 good sticks flying as a team a pair of ponies can cause a lot of disruption at an airbase.

[uptown]

The problem with Germany at that point in the war was that Hilter and the other powers to be were putting alot if not most of their resources into rocket and jet research and development. Germany had too many irons in the fire so to speak.

[evenhaim]

Push the limit and be aggressive its your only chance, and even then your SOL if the pilot knows something, ask tango or skat.