Author Topic: justice for Oscar grant  (Read 4781 times)

Offline avionix

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Re: justice for Oscar grant
« Reply #60 on: January 14, 2009, 02:26:53 PM »
It amazes me at all the second guessing of police everywhere and everytime something like this happens.  Talk about a high stress job where if a mistake is made, someone can get hurt.  I can make a mistake at work and it does have a large repercussion.  He does and someone dies.  These guys are human just like you and me and make mistakes.  Still have yet to see someone be able to put their pants on both legs at a time.  Some people here think they can.  The video posted was grainy and I can't believe that you can infer that the perp was acting in a calm and collected manner.  From what I saw, it was the end of what happened and not the beginning.  People were in the way and the cops were moving around.  Just remember this.  Rodney King was high on drugs when he was beaten and RESISTING ARREST.  We only saw the few minutes of video that the press wanted us to see.  The website linked at the beginning of this thread is one of those crackpot 9/11 truther websites.  Do you really think that they will give the whole story?   

I am not a cop, but I lean toward giving the police the benefit of the doubt the majority of the time.  There are a few bad apples out there and unfortunately, it is opinions such as at the beginning fo the board that has fostered a "fear" of police.  Hopw many times do we have to see some dink talking back to the cops or not following the policeman orders.  If they would have just listened in the first place.  Does noone have respect for authority anymore?

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Offline Shamus

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Re: justice for Oscar grant
« Reply #61 on: January 14, 2009, 02:54:46 PM »
I have never respected authority for authority's sake, have always been civil for the most part but respect is a mutual thing.

This guy screwed up royal and I hope that it was just a mistake on his part, if not, and that will never be proven, we are in deep stuff if thats what is coming out of the academy these days.

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Offline Rich46yo

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Re: justice for Oscar grant
« Reply #62 on: January 14, 2009, 03:19:32 PM »
Quote
There is also speculation that the BART cop by accident pulled his service weapon instead of his Taser.  Anyway, the cop should be prosecuted to the fullest extent of the law and serve prison time if convicted. 


I guess you skipped the Law School class where they explained the term "intent".
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Offline bongaroo

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Re: justice for Oscar grant
« Reply #63 on: January 14, 2009, 03:50:35 PM »
On a related note Cops with tasers kill more people yearly than accidental gunfire.

I didn't know that.  Interesting.

It amazes me at all the second guessing of police everywhere and everytime something like this happens. 

If you don't question them now were not far from being hauled off to the "camps" for "re-education" or some other calamity.

ALWAYS question authority.

I have never respected authority for authority's sake, have always been civil for the most part but respect is a mutual thing.

This guy screwed up royal and I hope that it was just a mistake on his part, if not, and that will never be proven, we are in deep stuff if thats what is coming out of the academy these days.

shamus    

Like this guy.  If an authority shows you no respect, you have no reason to respect it.
« Last Edit: January 14, 2009, 03:53:09 PM by bongaroo »
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Offline Shamus

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Re: justice for Oscar grant
« Reply #64 on: January 14, 2009, 04:57:40 PM »


I guess you skipped the Law School class where they explained the term "intent".

Are you saying that the state has to prove "intent" before you can be sentenced to prison there Mr. Scalia?

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Offline Elfie

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Re: justice for Oscar grant
« Reply #65 on: January 14, 2009, 05:25:22 PM »


I guess you skipped the Law School class where they explained the term "intent".

Intent matters not if it is a civilian doing this. A civilian would be prosecuted to the fullest extent of the law in the case of an accidental shooting that resulted in a death. Our public servants should be held to just as high a standard if not a higher standard than the civilians are.

Quote
I have never respected authority for authority's sake, have always been civil for the most part but respect is a mutual thing.

Respect is most certainly a mutual thing. To many LEO's show no respect whatsoever to the civilians they are supposed to be protecting, those LEO's get no respect from me in return. Otoh, there are LEO's that genuinely respect others, those LEO's get my utmost respect for the job they do. There is an LEO in this thread that belongs in the first group for me.
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Offline Elfie

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Re: justice for Oscar grant
« Reply #66 on: January 14, 2009, 05:29:08 PM »
There was a report of a fight on the BART train between a group of party goers.  It is not clear whether or not Grant was part of either of the groups taking part in the fight.  The BART police just yanked everyone from that train to try and figure out what was going on.

There is also speculation that the BART cop by accident pulled his service weapon instead of his Taser.  Anyway, the cop should be prosecuted to the fullest extent of the law and serve prison time if convicted. 


ack-ack

I'm having a hard time figuring out how a cop pulls a (black) gun instead of a (yellow) Taser without knowing it. Does he not look before pulling the trigger? Even so do you not naturally move the weapon out in front of your body before pulling the trigger? 
Corkyjr on country jumping:
In the end you should be thankful for those players like us who switch to try and help keep things even because our willingness to do so, helps a more selfish, I want it my way player, get to fly his latewar uber ride.

Offline nirvana

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Re: justice for Oscar grant
« Reply #67 on: January 14, 2009, 05:52:04 PM »
Looked like it went off right as he pulled it out of the holster.
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Offline Ack-Ack

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Re: justice for Oscar grant
« Reply #68 on: January 14, 2009, 06:57:17 PM »
I'm having a hard time figuring out how a cop pulls a (black) gun instead of a (yellow) Taser without knowing it. Does he not look before pulling the trigger? Even so do you not naturally move the weapon out in front of your body before pulling the trigger? 

I have a tough time myself understand it but that one 'theory' that is being thrown out as a possible defense. 

As for Dick's 'intent' comment, it seems that the DA is claiming it was an intentional shooting and the guy is being charged with murder.  I guess the DA didn't miss the class on 'intent'.


ack-ack
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Offline Elfie

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Re: justice for Oscar grant
« Reply #69 on: January 14, 2009, 10:23:45 PM »
I have a tough time myself understand it but that one 'theory' that is being thrown out as a possible defense. 

As for Dick's 'intent' comment, it seems that the DA is claiming it was an intentional shooting and the guy is being charged with murder.  I guess the DA didn't miss the class on 'intent'.


ack-ack

Maybe Dick missed the class on intent. ;)
Corkyjr on country jumping:
In the end you should be thankful for those players like us who switch to try and help keep things even because our willingness to do so, helps a more selfish, I want it my way player, get to fly his latewar uber ride.

Offline E2hawkey

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Re: justice for Oscar grant
« Reply #70 on: January 15, 2009, 07:36:35 AM »
It amazes me at all the second guessing of police everywhere and everytime something like this happens.  Talk about a high stress job where if a mistake is made, someone can get hurt.  I can make a mistake at work and it does have a large repercussion.  He does and someone dies.  These guys are human just like you and me and make mistakes.  Still have yet to see someone be able to put their pants on both legs at a time.  Some people here think they can.  The video posted was grainy and I can't believe that you can infer that the perp was acting in a calm and collected manner.  From what I saw, it was the end of what happened and not the beginning.  People were in the way and the cops were moving around.  Just remember this.  Rodney King was high on drugs when he was beaten and RESISTING ARREST.  We only saw the few minutes of video that the press wanted us to see.  The website linked at the beginning of this thread is one of those crackpot 9/11 truther websites.  Do you really think that they will give the whole story?   

I am not a cop, but I lean toward giving the police the benefit of the doubt the majority of the time.  There are a few bad apples out there and unfortunately, it is opinions such as at the beginning fo the board that has fostered a "fear" of police.  Hopw many times do we have to see some dink talking back to the cops or not following the policeman orders.  If they would have just listened in the first place.  Does noone have respect for authority anymore?


Let me state for the Record that I'm not a truth movement member. lol however i am an American who is sick & tired of being lied too. and open minded enough to take in all the information and make choices on my own as to what i want to stand for i still stand for the public! the downfall
of our nation is right in our faces to deny that fact means  your a sleep walker and law enforcement structure will fail as well  bringing along the need for federal emergency mobilization in our country  freedom not available in some areas prices subject to change with out notice
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Offline doleboy

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Re: justice for Oscar grant
« Reply #71 on: January 15, 2009, 08:05:28 AM »

Sad, but true.
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Offline DJ111

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Re: justice for Oscar grant
« Reply #72 on: January 15, 2009, 10:40:12 AM »
Them broad brushes very expensive?

Seems like alot of people here have them....
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Offline Rich46yo

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Re: justice for Oscar grant
« Reply #73 on: January 15, 2009, 08:01:04 PM »
I have a tough time myself understand it but that one 'theory' that is being thrown out as a possible defense. 

As for Dick's 'intent' comment, it seems that the DA is claiming it was an intentional shooting and the guy is being charged with murder.  I guess the DA didn't miss the class on 'intent'.


ack-ack

Maybe, maybe not Crack. DAs are elected officials and often bow to political pressure. Most of all in places like Oakland where a lot of offenders are also people you count on to vote for you. This guy tested the political waters for a few weeks and might have found them to hot to not bring charges.

After all he can put charges on anyone he wants, for the most part. The stupid taxpayer foots the bill. Even for a case he knows he cant win, in the end he can say, "I charged him and did all I could to bring the case in". He loses nothing and maybe keeps the votes.

I see I have to pretty much explain everything to Crack and Elfie, "what kinda man names himself Elfie"? My best guess is, and Ive seen all this before, is they will throw heavy charges against this guy and try and plea bargain it away to a lesser charge. After all your DAs do that all the time and the worst thing that can happen is the state will lose the case. Meanwhile its years down the line and the entire thing is off the front page and forgotten. Everytime we arrest anyone we are also "charging" them. By doing so we are simply saying we have probable cause the offender had intent. Nothing is proven until a court of law says so. That goes even for scumbags who would victimize you and your own in a heartbeat so why not for someone who risks their life serving and protecting? That question was for the thoughtful posters in this thread. Not for the sputtering,whineing, wheezing, muttering,babbling, morons who selfishly turned this tragedy into a selfish, flaming, borderline troll thread on an Internet gaming forum. Most of all Ack-Crack and Elfie, and were still waiting for information on all those incidents you've been alluding to Elf.

Personally I find the entire episode very sad and I feel for all involved. Most of all the victim and his family but also for the guy in uniform. I work a big city and we always have guns out during violent incidents and in progress calls. All the time! Frankly I'm surprised this kinda thing doesn't happen more. Ive personally witnessed bad shoots, as well as good ones. I wouldn't consider any of them trivial enough to be turned into a sweetheartbagfest on an Internet flight game forum.

To the few who have posted thoughtfully I thank you.

I'm done with this thread.
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Offline Ack-Ack

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Re: justice for Oscar grant
« Reply #74 on: January 15, 2009, 08:17:15 PM »
Not for the sputtering,whineing, wheezing, muttering,babbling, morons who selfishly turned this tragedy into a selfish, flaming, borderline troll thread on an Internet gaming forum. Most of all Ack-Crack and Elfie, and were still waiting for information on all those incidents you've been alluding to Elf.



Please show me Dick where I "selfishly turned this tragedy into a selfish, flaming, borderline troll"?  I take it reading comprehension isn't one of your strong suits.

There was a report of a fight on the BART train between a group of party goers.  It is not clear whether or not Grant was part of either of the groups taking part in the fight.  The BART police just yanked everyone from that train to try and figure out what was going on.

There is also speculation that the BART cop by accident pulled his service weapon instead of his Taser.  Anyway, the cop should be prosecuted to the fullest extent of the law and serve prison time if convicted. 


ack-ack


That was my post you're referring to and is not even close to what you described but thanks anyway for proving what a total and complete idiot you are. 

Have a nice day Dick.


ack-ack

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