Author Topic: Anyone build an HTPC?  (Read 3336 times)

Offline Fulmar

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Anyone build an HTPC?
« on: April 10, 2009, 07:14:00 PM »
Kind of a pipe dream but I've always wanted to build one.  What I've priced out its going to run me about $400 using a nice case (this some spare ddr2, dvd drive, psu).  Initially I'd like to buy it in steps (case first, then mobo/cpu etc later) since I have no need for Blu-ray or DVR capabilities are the moment.  So I can utilize old hardware for now for DVD/Media center capabilities.

I've tried playing around with some software to get a feeling, but have only touched the surface.  I put together an old p3 933, 512 ram, Geforce 3, SB Live, and an ATI TV Wonder VE.  The TV Wonder was a pos from the first day I bought it so I really couldn't use it at all since for tv recording I need a hardware encoding TV tuner card (wonder ve is software) for the rated CPU I had.  That aside, I did give SageTV a try which seemed to be a pretty good program.  I did try MythTV (and Mythbuntu), but hardware conflicts and my linux handicap prevented me from getting far).  I've also though about XP MCE and waiting for Windows 7 (I know Vista has it in the premium version, but its Vista).  Any recommendations on software would be much appreciated

I've had a hard time finding anything (that isn't a few years old) that can give me an idea for specs on Blu-ray playback.  I've pegged the AMD 4850e cpu as the processor of choice for cost and power effeciency, but I'm wondering if an integrated video chipset like the ATI HD 3200 or Geforce 7100/8200? are enough, or is it more CPU dependent?  I'd prefer to keep this as low power as possible.

Any idea how well the DVR software (Windows/Myth/Sage/etc) integrates with cable/satellite setups?  I only tried it with an antenna, but I had no problems with that.

Lastly, recommendations on remotes?  I've debated this but I'm not sure which work better.  Some higher end HTPC cases have remotes that come with them and some TV tuners have remotes that come with them.  I would lean towards the TV tuner remotes for capability, but some of the HTPC case integration stuff can be appealing.

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Offline MrRiplEy[H]

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Re: Anyone build an HTPC?
« Reply #1 on: April 11, 2009, 03:05:23 AM »
If you're planning blu-ray anything you're going to need latest hardware to run it properly. Forget p3 or AMD 4x.
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Offline TheZohan

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Re: Anyone build an HTPC?
« Reply #2 on: April 11, 2009, 05:04:05 AM »
you can get AMD X4's for under 100 they make great HTPC's cpu's

AMD Phenom 9600 Agena 2.3GHz Socket AM2+ 95W Quad-Core Processor Model HD960ZWCGDBOX
4x512 level 2 cache and 2 MB level 3 cache
94.99

but if your gonna go dual core i would go with the

AMD Athlon 64 X2 7750 Kuma 2.7GHz Socket AM2+ 95W Dual-Core black edition Processor Model 
2x512k level 2 cache and 2 MB level 3 cache
59.99

AMD Athlon X2 4850e 2.5GHz 2 x 512KB L2 Cache Socket AM2 45W Dual-Core Processor
your X2 4850e was listed at 55.99 for comparsion

all prices on newegg.com
« Last Edit: April 11, 2009, 05:10:24 AM by TheZohan »

Offline MrRiplEy[H]

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Re: Anyone build an HTPC?
« Reply #3 on: April 11, 2009, 05:20:47 AM »
Some hardware guidelines to go by (and I'd keep these 'recommended' hardware specs as bare minimum).

http://www.hardwarezone.com/articles/view.php?cid=19&id=2108&pg=2
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Offline Fulmar

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Re: Anyone build an HTPC?
« Reply #4 on: April 11, 2009, 10:07:36 AM »
Some hardware guidelines to go by (and I'd keep these 'recommended' hardware specs as bare minimum).

http://www.hardwarezone.com/articles/view.php?cid=19&id=2108&pg=2
I've seen that article before.  And like I said before, a lot of the stuff I'm finding is old news.  That article is from 2006.  The specs I'm looking at are:

AMD Athlon X2 4850e - low power, only 45W

GIGABYTE GA-MA78GM-US2H AM2+/AM2 AMD 780G HDMI Micro ATX AMD Motherboard
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813128379

Hauppauge WinTV-HVR-1800 MCE - White Box 1129 PCI-Express x1 Interface - Retail
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16815116016

HD - debatable, probably a 500gb of 640gb Seagate or WD

Case is quite debateable.  Currently I've chosen this (not too expensive):
SILVERSTONE Black Aluminum / Steel LC13B-E ATX Media Center / HTPC Case - Retail
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16811163117

I have DD2 RAM, DVD Drive, PSU.
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Offline eagl

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Re: Anyone build an HTPC?
« Reply #5 on: April 11, 2009, 10:49:30 AM »
The later integrated chipsets should be ok, as long as they will drive your monitor/tv at the desired resolution.  I have a perfectly good nvidia socket 939 based HTPC set up on an nvidia 6850 board, except that the stupid vid chipset maxes out at 1600x1200 or something like that so I can't get 1/1 pixel ratio on my 1080p tv.  I had to find a resolution that the tv would scale up without ruining the image, and run it like that.  It still looks WAAAAY better than even my old upscaling standalone dvd player because nvidia put a lot of effort into dvd scaling and dvd playback image quality, but it's maddening that I'll have to buy a separate vid card if I want to drive the tv at it's native resolution.

But I think the 7xxx series and later integrated chipsets should work fine with even a 1080p tv at native resolution.  Just make sure you check the specs on the mobo and chipset manufacturer website before you buy lower-end, otherwise you might end up having to buy another vid card anyhow.

As for sticking with integrated video in the first place, it will lower power draw and keep the system cooler, which reduces cooling load so you can keep the fan speeds down.  That makes it quieter, always a good thing.  Other things to consider are finding a really quiet PSU and hard drive, or go with a tiny SSD boot drive and then use LAN attached storage so you can keep the noisy hard drives in another room entirely.

You probably want DVI or HDMI output, so make sure the mobo has that if you want to use the integrated graphics.  Also, make sure the mobo has the right sound output.  The mobo I have was purchased in part because it had the right digital SPDIF output to go to my stereo, plus a riser card with optical sound out.  That was an important choice.
 
My HTPC uses that case but in aluminum, not black.  I wish I'd gotten the black instead.  It was fairly easy to work in and standard PC components fit fine, but it's bigger than most stereo components so make sure you have room wherever you plan on putting it.

Consider one of the WD "green" drives.  They ought to be quiet and cool, and you don't need blistering speed in an HTPC.

If you buy a new vid capture card, make sure it's digital tv capable since analog tv is on it's way out.

That cpu ought to be ok, but you WILL be going to some sort of hi-def playback at some point, so plan ahead with either cpu speed or upgradable video card that can decode the vid stream.  I think you'd probably be ok with blu-ray decode on that cpu as-is, but you'd have problems transcoding on the fly or doing anything else during playback.

Remotes - I got a cheap OEM windows MCE remote and it seems to work fine both under windows and under various myth-tv based distributions.

For software, I'd just try out the various linux based htpc setups.  Some are automated enough to detect standard hardware and just get up and running, and then you can really customize it as you learn more about linux.  If you want an 80% solution without any hassle, just use some variant of windows.  I think the windows MCE front-end is dumb, but if it works then it can make it look like you intended it to look that way.
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Offline Fulmar

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Re: Anyone build an HTPC?
« Reply #6 on: April 11, 2009, 11:06:43 AM »
Thanks for the input eagl.  How are the stock fans on the Silverstone case?
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Offline eagl

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Re: Anyone build an HTPC?
« Reply #7 on: April 11, 2009, 11:23:38 AM »
Thanks for the input eagl.  How are the stock fans on the Silverstone case?

They're ok, but I put them on a multi-fan capable speed controller and they would probably be too loud if I just hooked them straight up to the PSU.  I also got my case a couple of years ago and there's no way to tell if they're still using the same fans.

For thermals, I put a three-fan speed controller in there, hooked up to a front 80mm case fan and the 2 small (40 or 60mm, can't remember) fans in the back.  They're turned down to a small but comfortable margin above startup stall.  The PSU is a seasonic 480W and if things warm up in the case, it has a large fan that will automatically speed up so that's my overall case thermal management scheme.  I used the really nice AMD socket 939 X2 heatsink that came with my X2-4400 cpu, which has some heatpipes and a reasonably quiet fan, and turned on the automatic cpu fan speed control.  So the cpu fan is normally very very quiet and even under full load it's barely audible from 3-4 ft away.

The hard drive is a 300gb drive that had been rated highly at a few htpc and silent pc websites for noise and heat.  The newer drives are probably at least as good and I've read good things about the WD green drives since they run slower and therefore quieter than many others.  Obviously an SSD would be the quietest but you'd be stuck with a very low capacity drive if you want to keep costs reasonable, and then you'd want switched jumbo frame capable gigabit ethernet to networked storage somewhere separated from your htpc for noise management.

http://www.silentpcreview.com/

Silentpcreview discusses hardware suitable for any computer where noise is an issue, so you might find links to current hard drive recommendations there.  Sometimes the lower capacity drives are quieter because they use only a single drive platter, but if you get the wrong model number you might get a cheapo model with 2 or more last-generation platters and those will be just as noisy as any other drive.  But some of the single platter models (usually around 300ish gig) are really quiet.

Here is the current silentpcreview drive recommendation page:  http://www.silentpcreview.com/article29-page1.html  It's a bit out of date but still good reading.

One thing I did was put one of those combo floppy/memory card readers into one of the front drive bays.  They're only about $25 but now right on the front I can use just about any memory card format plus floppy disk is available if necessary.


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Offline Fulmar

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Re: Anyone build an HTPC?
« Reply #8 on: April 11, 2009, 03:03:35 PM »
The more I look into it, I think I'm going to pass on the DVR capabilities.  So I will scratch the TV Tuner.  This will free up some budget as well.

Will probably switch it up to the Antec Fusion case, though hesitant on its mixed reviews.
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Offline Dadano

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Offline 1701E

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Re: Anyone build an HTPC?
« Reply #10 on: April 11, 2009, 05:37:29 PM »
May not be exactly what you are looking for, but it is classified as a HTPC case.  The Aerocool M-40 Cube case works wonders for me.
>Plenty of cooling
>Decent room
>Decent price (81$)
>Room for up to 3 HDDs
>Temperature sensor built-in to case
>2x 5.25" bays, 1x 3.5" bay external 2x internal

As for the CPU, I use that same one and it runs great for me.  It runs fast enough, quiet, cool (broken sensors, but still cool running), powerful enough for all my gaming, low power.  One thing you may look at with the CPU is the EcoButton it comes with, not quite a Standby/Sleep mode it puts the PC into, but it does power it to minimal use when not used (Got one, but never use it).


If you consider the case though be cautions of the PSU.  It holds up to a 144mm long PSU with no troubles, any longer and it can bump against the DVD drive.
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Offline Fulmar

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Re: Anyone build an HTPC?
« Reply #11 on: April 11, 2009, 06:13:05 PM »
http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/windows-7-htpc,2159.html

Yeah I saw that when that article came out.  I liked the nMediaPC 1000B case they used.  Also that Aerocool M-40 case is interesting as well.  I looked into that LCD screen for the nMediaPC case and they want $40 for it.  Which is a load.  Thats nearly half of what the case costs.
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Offline Vulcan

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Re: Anyone build an HTPC?
« Reply #12 on: April 11, 2009, 06:19:39 PM »
I run an Athlon 4000+, 2Gb RAM, some sort of Geforce I can't remember, a really cheap and crappy cmedia card (important), and a Hauppage 3000 tv tuner card (hooked into DVB-S). I run Win XP Sp3 with Mediaportal and the whole thing runs like a charm. It runs into a 5.1 dolby digital surround system with a projector. And it runs HD content quite nicely.

The more expensive your sound card is the less happy you will be. You need to use either the cheap and nasty cmedia card combined with the 'home brew' cmedia drivers (google em) or HDMI audio output off your video card. The home brew cmedia drivers do really good digital audio pass through without playing with the audio - which the more expensive cards do and tend to mess up.

Oh and not a big HDD, I have a server in the basement with ~1Tb of storage (not expensive these days). I also have some of those crappy low end networkable media players around the house. Everything runs on a gigabit network.






« Last Edit: April 11, 2009, 06:23:27 PM by Vulcan »

Offline Fulmar

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Re: Anyone build an HTPC?
« Reply #13 on: April 11, 2009, 06:42:28 PM »
Thanks for the info on Mediaportal.  No idea how I missed that one.  Good interface and I like the price tag of opensource.

Edit:
Very impressed with Mediaportal.  Do you use a remote with your setup Vulcan?  And does it interact with Mediaportal well?
« Last Edit: April 11, 2009, 07:01:35 PM by Fulmar »
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