Defining bad game-play

[TequilaChaser]

You rant about the skill level of the players, the type of engagements and so on but if anybody hold you accountable for your actions you spout jibberish, and you're right in that situation ACM or SA would not make any difference when people dweebly B&Z others that are engaged in a "turn fight" which is what everbody wants but the same people don't practise what they preach do they.

I'm not worthy, I'm not worthy, I'm not worthy

Only you people can spell out what is and what is not, there is no other view point, well I don't think so!

I'll say this we don't talk out of both sides of our mouths unlike you people, you say this you do that " did you have a bad childhood or something"  

whatchu mean buy "You People"   

[oTRALFZo]

  You guys take bases with half that amount,...6/110's 3 niks,and 2 goons???Well congrats ,and good thing you did not have any resistance..

  I put 15 slots for 110's in my missions,I put 10 slots for fighters,and 4 goons,I do not see where that is horrible..I want the town down as FAST as possible,I dont want to sit there and "FONDLE" it..I want it DOWN,and so do the  people who are with me,..

  You want to see A 50 man mission???? that would be the one with 190a8's,when eny has gone through the roof,literally,,and is over 25..

 ANd tral I never said that 12 110's missions were a challenge to me,you put words in my mouth..but I want to be sure when I launch a mission for a particular target,that it goes down the way it is supposed too..and that is that it gets captured..

                                                                         

       

THIS^^^ is in response to the short term memory loss when you say THIS:

  When I post a mission it averages about 20...TO some that is a "HORDE".

  

Few pages ago, you were whining that its hard to take a base with only 12 110s, 6 nikis and 4 goons. **Again count 22**. Why is it that these "mega squads" that can average 20 with a scrolly bar filled on the roster feel the need to post public missions on country?
You as the CO, if base taking is "the thing to do" with your squad..so be it..have fun. Do it as a squad. I dont know if you do what you do thinking that the other "teams" pop blood vessles and shake fists whenever you take a base, in reality..half the time they dont even care that you did.
The worry here and though your too thickheaded and stubborn to realize is that you are poisoning minds on new guys that come in. Imagine what a game it would be and how fast it would be shut down if thats all that countries did was have a race to reset the maps. Rooks, nits and bish all racing to attack undefended feilds ALL seeking that reset "high". I sure as %^$% would cancel my account very rapidly.

[The Fugitive]

When A mission is posted for a base,one never knows how many will be there to counter it..Sometimes there are not any at all,sometimes there are 15+ defending from a mission..Does not matter if it is a base on the front-lines,or a base out of the way..

 We took A9 a few days ago that had LOTS of rooks flying in and out of it...We fought at V10 for hourse before finally taking it after taking A9...There were at least 20 defenders at V10..And they got lots of kills,and so did we,and yet not ONE of them has replied to the post I posted when I asked if it was not fun??? I know they had a blast,just as we did trying to take it.

V10 was about 15 minutes not hours. A9 was hours. I got there from 51 and made a few passes and then it was captured. The problem with V10 was the overwhelming force that was used.... It a vehicle base ! Common sense would tell you the only air support that could come would be from 51. You didn't need that force.

So why wont they respond about it???I feel they are trying to keep a negative light on missions,and God-Forbid someone would actually say they had fun fighting a mission of the sort that they constantly complain about..

  WHy do the furballers care if bases are taken???I dont mean bases which affect your furballing,although sometimes this is the case,but why do you insist that another side taking bases is detrimental to game-play??DO you guys,who have been playing this game much longer than others,really run out of people to fight when missions are going on???

  I mean if all of a sudden bish dropped of the radar,you always have nits to hit.This statement applies  bish,nits,or rooks...It is a 3 sided game.You will never run out of people to shoot down..

 SO why is taking bases With as many or as few people as is in any respective mission so detrimental to YOUR gameplay???

To a furballer loss of a base means the end of a fight, but in most case a new fight should start back up. The problem is the fights either start out completely over balanced by a horde, or a quick NOE, so fights don't start as often as they could, or should. Then when a fight finally gets going the base gets taken, but thats ok a new fight should be starting soon. But it doesn't, most go run off to find anouther undefended, or lightly defended area.

 

On a large map,hundreds of bases,and you are going to get upset when a mission takes one??And then really get upset that the mission took a base that is not even close to where you are getting your action from??

 If it is not a big deal,taking bases as many of you furballers and ACM guys claim,then why the outcry for CHANGE!!!!!!!!!

The only change we are talking about here is to get rid of the lame game play.... dive bombing lancs, 20+ NOE ... hordes hitting bases.... 5 guys diving on a single bogie.

It may be because you up at the base to defend,and get killed,or maybe others on your side are not helping so you get frustrated..I really dont know..Not every mission takes the base.I have seen missions from all 3 sides with HUGE NUMBERS not take a base,so your argument that ONLY numbers take a base is wrong..It helps,but it guarantees nothing.

 Evidently there are numerous people on ALL 3 sides which TAKE BASEs WITH MISSIONS,and I just bet,that when a mission on your side takes a base,you are just as happy as any other side which takes bases also..


   This "HORDE" mission that you guys speak of is not the 50 man mission you guys so proudly speak of..
  When I post a mission it averages about 20...TO some that is a "HORDE".to some it is only a "HORDE" if the defenders which up do not equal the same which are in the mission.

    So,evidently all 3 sides feel the need to take bases.Because it is movement,it stops stagnation in an area,which does happen..it opens up new avenues for furballers,gv'ers and bombers,and mission planners on ALL 3 sides,this is why base-taking is good for gameplay.Wheteher it is done NOE,or at ALT...

 
  Why is it whenever a CV pulls up next to an enemy base,the first thing that starts happening,after the initial 5-10 min FB,the other team starts trying to kill the CV??

 I know why,because if left alone,eventually the side with the CV would attempt to take the base..And more than likely,it is 99% of the reason the CV is there..The furballs are fun with CV's by enemy bases,but they do come to an end by any of the 3 sides which are represented in the game,and it is understood that it is usually proper to KILL the cv before it can take the base..  

Again, its not the taking of bases thats a problem is the manner in which they are taken.

Late this afternoon, and I really hate that I'm using this example, but.... I was helping to defend a shoreline base, it started out with just 3 of us,  against 5 or 6 enemy. They were hitting the base from a CV, but snuck in some GVs as well. I got to town in a GV just in time to kill the troops and the GV before the capture, but the fight was on now! They started upping off the CV which was close, almost spwaning GVs feet dry. Next think you know there are alot more planes in the air, and LVTs spawning left and right, PT boats and all. The battle lasted a good 45 minutes, and had a good 40 people fighting it out.

Eventually the CV was sunk, and the fight disappeared. The thing I hate about this fight was I have to give credit to the Jokers   . They fought well, and didn't use any lame crap and the fight was a blast. That was old style game play. This time we held them off, next time maybe not, but that isn't what important, the fight is what was important.

The point I keep trying to make here is just be honest with your self, put your self in the position of the guy on the other side. Yes this is a game, but it is NOT WAR. If you loose a base you won't have to start learning a new language, or how to use the metric system. The guy on the other side is playing and trying to have fun too. Think if this mission was run at you what would you think about it? Just a bit of common sense, a little fair game play. Is that so hard to work with?

[thndregg]

In LWO a bit ago, I posted yet another 20 Jug Mission intended for a Rook medium airfield 1.5 sectors away. On our way there, the intended base was taken, so we overflew it to the next one in line, a small field (A79) about another sector out. Our darbar was visible to the Rooks for a good long time. Plenty of time for Rooks to collectively investigate.

We encountered one curious 262 at 15K.

When we got to our target, resistance was still light, suggesting Rooks overall were not interested in finding us and putting up a fight before we got to the base. We were laiden with ord and not moving real quick. Rooks could've had a field day had they upped early on. My point is, we were a very ominous mission for several minutes on the map. Rooks either were completely oblivious to the situation despite the map advertisement, or chose to ignore what was happening.

We arrived, blew up the FH's, VH and downed what few Rooks chose to defend. In short order, not suprisingly, the base was ours.

In that instance, undefended to me means the enemy makes the conscious choice not to defend against something completely advertised (short of calling it out on open channel).
Had we have been intercepted earlier, A   F I G H T would have errupted, which would result in everyone overall having fun, even though the mission itself would not have succeeded.

[LYNX]

One see's if friendly air or Gv's are already there.   Usually NO, Sometimes Yes,  but not a requirement either way. "usually NO"... forgive me for what you may perceive as a slap in the face but that smacks of poor planning, unless you have 15, 20 or 30 blokes at hand and just want to throw them at something.


IMO, As for the example mission used its not poor game play, the poor thing about it is the poor use of the resources in that mission.  I am not defending the action of all those guys hitting the V-Base only, I am identifying the fact that the mission planner did not use what he had in the mission properly.  semantics my dear fellow.  Poor planning = poor game play does it not?

As for what is perceived as an over kill mission, because any mission could be perceived or has a potential of being as seen as overkill, I have stated that they are determined to be over kill after the mission arrives depending on the probability of resistance they may encounter. All it would take is for someone to spot an NOE or an inbound mission and the resistance will escalate, so that probability or potential of a response in escalation is what has to be factored.  Honestly we can argue "if I woulda shoulda coulda" all day long.  What your advocating here is maximum numbers even if the probability of resistance is low.  A quick scan of the map is all that's needed for a reasonable assessment.

I have ran missions myself and have seen it done many times before where the intent was to have a few bombers or fighters and once it was posted more than needed were joining,  determind by how many slots you allocate

But by modifying the mission so that all 20 people hit multiple bases or dictate roles that would further use those assets that would not be wasted on a v base as this example illustrates is the key.  EXACTLY.

I hope this clarifies it a bit.    
 

[LYNX]

Just wait.

Thndregg
 
I've seen the powers to be change things over the past....to curb game play issues and of cause to preserve and expand upon their revenue.

ENY was brought in to kerb the Sunday RJO's (rook joint opporations).  It all got a bit silly when Rooks on a Sunday would have as many players as Bish and Knights put together.  Defectors for want of a better word would switch to the winning side (rooks) on the Sunday.  ENY did what it was developed to do and RJO's are a thing of the past.

25% fuel porkage is also a thing of the past.  So as to keep the fight going I presume.

Acks, ammo's barracks were increased presumably to stop one guy porking a whole field or a string of front line fields.  This in my opinion is the single most factor that gives us the base taking hoards of today but that's besides the point.  It's done.  The monster is unleashed.

Split arenas.  To kerb game play issues.  "slum behaviour" I think they termed it.  This actually and with some help from TV advertising increased subscriber's.  Strange ?

Small maps for months on end.  Presumably to localise the fighting.

Anyways you get the point.  HTC is on the ball where game play and revenue are concerned.  Here's the kicker.  All of those changes have affected each and every one of us.  Some folk have quit the game  because of these changes.  Many have rolled with the punches so's to speak.

I've asked this question of you twice with no response.  Giving you the benefit of doubt I'll ask again............


Say they do change something like making the mission planner have a maximum of 12 players per mission from any given field.  What would you do then.  Roll with the punches as in the case of ENY, split arenas, the same small maps for months on end.  Would you adapt or just say "oh heck the games not fun anymore.  I'm outta here"

Would you care to comment?
 
 

[Dadsguns]

THIS^^^ is in response to the short term memory loss when you say THIS:
Few pages ago, you were whining that its hard to take a base with only 12 110s, 6 nikis and 4 goons. **Again count 22**. Why is it that these "mega squads" that can average 20 with a scrolly bar filled on the roster feel the need to post public missions on country?
You as the CO, if base taking is "the thing to do" with your squad..so be it..have fun. Do it as a squad. I dont know if you do what you do thinking that the other "teams" pop blood vessles and shake fists whenever you take a base, in reality..half the time they dont even care that you did.
The worry here and though your too thickheaded and stubborn to realize is that you are poisoning minds on new guys that me in. Imagine what a game it would be and how fast it would be shut down if thats all that countries did was have a race to reset the maps. Rooks, nits and bish all racing to attack undefended feilds ALL seeking that reset "high". I sure as %^$% would cancel my account very rapidly.

Like he stated before, WE ARE NOT ALL IN THE MISSION. 
The second  bold part is they dont, your "the world is gonna end" promises are not going to scare anyone to believing that its as bad as some of you paint it out to be.  Would they do something if it were?  Yes. 
But for the simple few of you that continually and admittedly for 20 years    think the world evolves around your style of play alone and what you consider to be good or bad play is ludicrous. 

V10 was about 15 minutes not hours. A9 was hours. I got there from 51 and made a few passes and then it was captured. The problem with V10 was the overwhelming force that was used.... It a vehicle base ! Common sense would tell you the only air support that could come would be from 51. You didn't need that force.

I didnt want to say this, but your out right lying.  You already admitted you were not there, period.  For the 8+ hours that I was there the entire time and that you recently had logged in as it was being captured, there were multiple attacks on that base, hangers taken down several times, cv attacked it, etc. etc. both bases were equally defended by air and GV's, both of those bases were attacked and were heavily defended.  But you wouldnt know that, since you were not there.  Your credibility sir is wearing thin.

The point I keep trying to make here is just be honest with your self,

How about starting with YOU   

Falcon told me that the fight had been going on for 5 hours, I don't know, I logged in a few minutes before A9 fell and saw the stupidity at A10.

 

[StokesAk]

IN

[Masherbrum]

Thndregg
 
I've seen the powers to be change things over the past....to curb game play issues and of cause to preserve and expand upon their revenue.

ENY was brought in to kerb the Sunday RJO's (rook joint opporations).  It all got a bit silly when Rooks on a Sunday would have as many players as Bish and Knights put together.  Defectors for want of a better word would switch to the winning side (rooks) on the Sunday.  ENY did what it was developed to do and RJO's are a thing of the past.

25% fuel porkage is also a thing of the past.  So as to keep the fight going I presume.

Acks, ammo's barracks were increased presumably to stop one guy porking a whole field or a string of front line fields.  This in my opinion is the single most factor that gives us the base taking hoards of today but that's besides the point.  It's done.  The monster is unleashed.

Split arenas.  To kerb game play issues.  "slum behaviour" I think they termed it.  This actually and with some help from TV advertising increased subscriber's.  Strange ?

Small maps for months on end.  Presumably to localise the fighting.

Anyways you get the point.  HTC is on the ball where game play and revenue are concerned.  Here's the kicker.  All of those changes have affected each and every one of us.  Some folk have quit the game  because of these changes.  Many have rolled with the punches so's to speak.

I've asked this question of you twice with no response.  Giving you the benefit of doubt I'll ask again............


Say they do change something like making the mission planner have a maximum of 12 players per mission from any given field.  What would you do then.  Roll with the punches as in the case of ENY, split arenas, the same small maps for months on end.  Would you adapt or just say "oh heck the games not fun anymore.  I'm outta here"

Would you care to comment?

After last night watching your squaddie DREDger lead the charge in taking all of the center islands.   Which he has done time and time again, because he enjoys ruining other people's fun.   One must ask themselves, "What are we really trying to achieve?"

[Dadsguns]

After last night watching your squaddie DREDger lead the charge in taking all of the center islands.   Which he has done time and time again, because he enjoys ruining other people's fun.   One must ask themselves, "What are we really trying to achieve?"

 

[StokesAk]

After last night watching your squaddie DREDger lead the charge in taking all of the center islands.   Which he has done time and time again, because he enjoys ruining other people's fun.   One must ask themselves, "What are we really trying to achieve?"

Get another base exaclt the same to the one they had.

[The Fugitive]

Like he stated before, WE ARE NOT ALL IN THE MISSION. 
The second  bold part is they dont, your "the world is gonna end" promises are not going to scare anyone to believing that its as bad as some of you paint it out to be.  Would they do something if it were?  Yes. 
But for the simple few of you that continually and admittedly for 20 years    think the world evolves around your style of play alone and what you consider to be good or bad play is ludicrous. 


I didnt want to say this, but your out right lying.  You already admitted you were not there, period.  For the 8+ hours that I was there the entire time and that you recently had logged in as it was being captured, there were multiple attacks on that base, hangers taken down several times, cv attacked it, etc. etc. both bases were equally defended by air and GV's, both of those bases were attacked and were heavily defended.  But you wouldnt know that, since you were not there.  Your credibility sir is wearing thin.

How about starting with YOU   

 

Your so high and mighty about jumping in just to argue!

 A9 is the airfield on the south side of the island where the fight had been going on for ever, V10 is the Vehicle base on the north side of the island that didn't get going untill A9 was finished. I logged in and upped A9 in a spit, and barely got my wheels up before I was killed, then the base was captured. I upped A51 in a pony and went strait to V10 because that is the next logical place to fight. That is where I ran into the "stupidity" I saw. Dive bombing lanc, stick stirring Chogs that have no other move than the HO, making 3 guys over shoot my pony at the same time because they have no clue how to fly, and the biggest of all, more than 20 people to take a vehicle base.

Ask FALCON for the screen shot of the one a minute before the one he posted where he stated he was tired of the FB so he made a mission. HE dictated a way to play the game, not me. Everything I posted was what HE told me up until the capture of A9, I witnessed the rest. So I'm NOT lying, I'm just repeating what I was told.

I'm brutally honest, I call it as I see it. Do I vulch yes I do! Do I dive in to a fight with out asking, no I don't, Do I bomb HQs and factories, Yes I do, but not often, towns are closer, and more often than not someone will try to shoot you down there. Do I HO? nope. DO I bomb and bail? Nope I always try to RTB, in my fighters as well.

You keep saying we talk about changing everyone to "our game play" If that were the case we would be looking to get rid of the GVs, and the heavy bombers. All us fighter types need are fighter type planes. No we are talking about.....wait for it..... LAME GAME PLAY!

Heres that list I posted way back again....


    * HOs lame
    * dive bombing lancs lame or any heavy bomber
    * running NOEs with 12 110s, 4 goons, and a half dozen or so NIKs lame
    * spawn camping lame
    * being the 6th guy in on a single bad guy lame
    * suicide dive bombers lame
    * bringing a CV close enough to dry spawn lame
    * hiding captured CVs lame


Can you honestly say that all those things on that list ARE NOT LAME?

Do you see anywhere on that list capturing bases?... running missions?... working together with your squad?.... saving your "country" from the evil empire?

Again, this is NOT a BISH problem, its an Aces High COMMUNITY problem. There is lame play on all sides. I call it out when I see Rooks doing it, do you when you see your teamates do it, or do you just join in?

[LLogann]

Hold on a second everybody.....









































..... I gotta make more popcorn.

[thndregg]

Say they do change something like making the mission planner have a maximum of 12 players per mission from any given field.  What would you do then.  Roll with the punches as in the case of ENY, split arenas, the same small maps for months on end.  Would you adapt or just say "oh heck the games not fun anymore.  I'm outta here.

I don't necessarily need the mission planner. And no, I wouldn't quit. The comradery I've enjoyed with the BOPs over the past 5 years is priceless. I don't soley put missions together as my mainstay in this game. I'm also not at all apprehensive about throwing missions together with less than uber planes. Those actually are the most fun.

[Masherbrum]

Here is one of my pet peeves for over 7 years of playing this game.

Folks are always griping, sniping at each other because "We're losing the war!"   I have on many occasions listened to them grumble and say "Well, you see where their darbar is at, hit the field and goes away."

10 times out of 10 this is the response.  "Well can someone make a mission?"    I mean really folks, are people this inept that they NEED a fuggin mission to get a few guys together and communicate?