something that should never..nver happen

[-ammo-]

Never should any existing models of the P-47 current in AH be perked,  and I would even go as far to say that a P-47M would be a questionable perk. That is of coarse if the 109G10 and the dora stays unperked....

Everyone should have no problems agreeing with this IMO.

   

[This message has been edited by -ammo- (edited 05-01-2001).]

[-ammo-]

duh..

[This message has been edited by -ammo- (edited 05-01-2001).]

[Regurge]

Well then your best move would be to roll d25s at caped fields. It will be tough, but if you can die faster than Drex kills, you'll be ok  

I'd bet on the M being perked seeing as how its better than a ta152.

[sling322]

ya know, regurge, that plan just might work  

[Tac]

imo d9 should be the one perked not the 152. 152 SUCKS at low alt. D9 is rewly at any alt.

Just my 2 cents.

BTW, gimme a P-38K and PERK it please      

[juzz]

With the current setup, it shouldn't be perked based on performance(neither should Ta 152), but it would probably be perked based on the number produced(130 iirc).

[Maverick]

Perking the P47 makes as much sense as perking the P51 does. That is to say, none at all.

Personally I think the perk system needs perking.

Mav

[StSanta]

If the g10 is perked, so should the P51 and the P-47  . And La-7, tiffie, n1k and some more planes.

That'd be a good thing in my book

------------------
Von Santa
Staffelkapitän 9./JG 54 "Grünherz"
"If you return from a mission with a victory, but without your Rottenflieger, you have lost your battle."
- D. Hrabak, JG 54 "Grünherz"

[R4M]

1-fix the P47D30 loadouts
2-add a P47M
3-Perk it (5-10 perkies)
4-Let all the rest unperked.

The P47 model wich belongs to late 1944 (the time of the Dora, the P51D,the 109g10, etc) is the P47D25. The D30 is OK because it has similar performance although was a later plane. But the M was a low numbers plane and the N was introduced quite later.

So, both N and M would be perkies with the current planeset.

IMHO.

[This message has been edited by R4M (edited 05-02-2001).]

[Sancho]

Small clarification R4M... the 56th FG got it's first P-47D-25 in mid May '44.  It is not a "late 1944" airplane.

I'm interested to know what the problem is with the P-47D-30 loadouts?

Last thing I have to say is that so far the only planes that are perked are ones which have a "unbalancing effect" on the MA.  Being rare aircraft based on numbers produced in WW2 is not a consideration for perk-worthiness.  If you ignore Drex's stats   you will see that neither P-47 comes close to being "unbalancing".  This is why no P-47 would need perking, IMHO.

[R4M]

 

Originally posted by Sancho:
Small clarification R4M... the 56th FG got it's first P-47D-25 in mid May '44.  It is not a "late 1944" airplane.

Yep, its first one. Can you tell me when did the bubbletop P47 turn into something common?

Just a hint: almost all the P47s wich took part in overlord and AFTER overlord were razorbacks  

According to the books I have wich talk about the P47 (Admittedly not many   ) The D25 became common after the Summer of 1944. So, I note it as a late 1944. But anyway note that I dont include the D30 in that pack

 

I'm interested to know what the problem is with the P-47D-30 loadouts?

Of course. If wing bombs, or wing DTs, were loaded, only four HVAR Rockets could be fitted. And usually none was. Also when the wing tanks were used for bombs, almost always the central rack carried a drop tank, or nothing.

So, the 10xHVAR rockets+2x1000lbs bombs+ 500lbs bomb configuration is pure fantasy. Is like if I put in a Fw190A8 the 21-cm rockets and underwing gondolas with four MG151/20s (without deleting the outboard cannons), and then I put a SC1000kg bomb under the fuselage.

 

Last thing I have to say is that so far the only planes that are perked are ones which have a "unbalancing effect" on the MA.  Being rare aircraft based on numbers produced in WW2 is not a consideration for perk-worthiness.  If you ignore Drex's stats     you will see that neither P-47 comes close to being "unbalancing".  This is why no P-47 would need perking, IMHO.

The Ta152H1 then should be non-perk too according to that argument. And it is a perk plane,and rightly so on my book.  

[This message has been edited by R4M (edited 05-02-2001).]

[Sancho]

R4M asks:
Can you tell me when did the bubbletop P47 turn into something common?

By February '44, the razorbacks were no longer being produced at Republic's Farmingdale plant.  In P-47 Thunderbolt: From Seversky to Victory, Warren Bodie wrote that the first P-47D-25-RE rolled out of the Farmingdale plant of Republic Aviation on February 3, 1944.[p. 250]  385 D-25s and 611 D-27s had been completed by 6 May 1944. [p. 247]  There's a great photo on page 264 of Gabby's D-25 with the following caption:

"Everyone subject to orders issued by Hq. at WIDEWING would certainly have removed the invasion stripes atop wings and fuselages within 7 to 10 days after D-Day.  If anyone still doubts that bubble-canopy P-47Ds were then operational, here is Lt. Col. Gabreski heading out for what probably was a D-Day mission (freshly painted stripes, over and under) on June 6 in his new P-47D-25-RE.  The airplane had been painted by the 56th FG or the 33rd Service Group maintenance people and the pilot had certainly checked out in the newest model, all of which took time."

In another fine book, Beware the Thunderbolt, David McLaren writes that the first D-25s (dubbed "Superbolts"   ) were in combat operation with the 56th FG on May 19, 1944.  By June 1944, the 56th FG was flying a mixed bag of aircraft, ranging from the razorback D-22 and D-23 to the D-28.  Does that give you any indication how fast these puppies were being cranked out and sent into battle?

Certainly, most P-47s operating during this timeframe were indeed razorbacks, but it definitely wasn't in your words "almost all" of them.  All new planes coming into the theatre would be bubbletops.  I'd be interested to know in what book you read that.

Nevertheless, the point of all this drivel is merely to say that the D-25 is not a "late 44" plane.  Again, there were only 385 D-25s made, which all went into service in May or June of 44.  How "the D25 became common after the summer of 1944" does not compute if they were already in combat service and no more were ever built.

[R4M]

Nice info, Sancho. As I admitted, my references on this matter were quite limited. I stand corrected  .

[Lephturn]

I think some combination of limited availability and performance should factor into whether or not a plane is perked.  What the real factors are is up to Pyro and HT, b ut I trust 'em.    I expect the 47M and 47N to be cheap perks only based on availability.  IE, I want the 47D-11 and D-25/30 to be more common in the MA than an M or an N model.  The perk system is the only way to do that.

I don't think anyone can argue that the 47M or N warrants being perked from a purely performance standpoint.  They are good planes, but not uber IMO.  They will just be competitive with the other late-war killers in AH, at least at arena alts.

------------------
Sean "Lephturn" Conrad - Aces High Chief Trainer

A proud member of the mighty Flying Pigs
http://www.flyingpigs.com

Check out Lephturn's Aerodrome for AH articles and training info!

[Wilbus]

TA152 is great down low although not fast enough to run. TA152 is undermodelled at hight, its top speed wa 472Mph, not 460 like in AH, FIX IT!

P47? Hell, let it be unperked, they burn nice.

 



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Rasmus "Wilbus" Mattsson
III/JG5 Eismeer

"Only the spirit of attack, born in a brave heart, will bring success to any fighter aircraft, no matter how highly developed it may be."

Adolf Galland