Author Topic: Would a 9mm pistol round bounce?  (Read 8957 times)

Offline thorsim

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Re: Would a 9mm pistol round bounce?
« Reply #15 on: November 30, 2009, 03:55:34 PM »
a plane moving however fast is not necessarily moving at all relative to another moving plane ...

200 yards is just not that far when discussing ballistics ...

period.

That still doesnt meet the definition of AFK angus. A plane outfitted with 9mm isnt going to do enough damage unless the plane NEVER moves or cannot get out of the way at all. Its not about range at all its about destroying the target at firing time... period.
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Offline Chalenge

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Re: Would a 9mm pistol round bounce?
« Reply #16 on: November 30, 2009, 04:01:28 PM »
Thorsim you are a luftwaffe flier mostly correct? Do you sit right behind a bomber and fire at it from 200 yards? I hope not because the luftwaffe planes were not designed for that but they were designed to drop bombers primarily or all they would have ever needed was 20mm cannons. Even if you dont accept that you should realise that in a fighting situation you are not very often going to have a con that is sitting there allowing you to shoot him from 200 yards as you please and when you do have a shot you want to knock him down quickly or his wingman is going to be shooting you.

(EDITed for obvious typo)
« Last Edit: November 30, 2009, 04:29:23 PM by Chalenge »
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Offline Krusty

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Re: Would a 9mm pistol round bounce?
« Reply #17 on: November 30, 2009, 04:26:04 PM »
Not AFK?
Some 85% (Estimated) actually never knew what hit them.
Obviously a better ranging weapon will allow that...better.
However, you'd need to really be a beliver to sit behind a cessna door and have somebody go at you from 100 yards with a 9 mm.....

At 100 yards he's well out of effective range, and has a better chance of spitting at you than hitting you.

We're not talking 9mm RIFLES here, we're talking handguns.

Average effective range for revolvers is 30 feet, if I recall my old-west history (and these guns are normally more accurate than auto-loading pistols because the barrel does not move).

Offline thorsim

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Re: Would a 9mm pistol round bounce?
« Reply #18 on: November 30, 2009, 04:47:58 PM »
At 100 yards he's well out of effective range, and has a better chance of spitting at you than hitting you.

We're not talking 9mm RIFLES here, we're talking handguns.

Average effective range for revolvers is 30 feet, if I recall my old-west history (and these guns are normally more accurate than auto-loading pistols because the barrel does not move).

sorry krusty there was no mention of weapon type just ammo type 9mm i am assuming 9x19mm ...

Thorsim you are a luftwaffe flier mostly correct? Do you sit right behind a bomber and fire at it from 200 yards? I hope not because the luftwaffe planes were not designed for that but they were designed to drop bombers primarily or all they would have ever needed was 20mm cannons. Even if you dont accept that you should realise that in a fighting situation you are not very often going to have a con that is sitting there allowing you to shoot him from 200 yards as you please and when you do have a shot you want to knock him down quickly or his wingman is going to be shooting you.

(EDITed for obvious typo)

that is not the discussion chalenge the statement i took issue with was that a 9mm would just "bounce off" a plane skin, i think it would likely make a hole of some sort ...

as far as just sitting there, someone already pointed out that the vast majority of air to air kills were made on pilots who were unaware they were being targeted ...

BTW : some german planes were designed to "sit right behind a bomber and fire at it from 200 yards"
they are just not in the game.

nobody is saying the 9x19 MM is a good choice as an air to air weapon, but that is not the posters question.

a 9mm bullet will do harm of all sorts to an aircraft, that is all we are saying.  


« Last Edit: November 30, 2009, 04:50:52 PM by thorsim »
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Offline Die Hard

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Re: Would a 9mm pistol round bounce?
« Reply #19 on: November 30, 2009, 04:48:34 PM »
You're the only one talking about handguns Krusty.
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Offline Karnak

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Re: Would a 9mm pistol round bounce?
« Reply #20 on: November 30, 2009, 04:51:11 PM »
Not AFK?
Some 85% (Estimated) actually never knew what hit them.
Obviously a better ranging weapon will allow that...better.
However, you'd need to really be a beliver to sit behind a cessna door and have somebody go at you from 100 yards with a 9 mm.....
That statistic is used to say things that it doesn't support.  Not seeing your killer is not the same thing as flying along nice and level and not seeing your killer.
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Offline Strip

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Re: Would a 9mm pistol round bounce?
« Reply #21 on: November 30, 2009, 05:16:50 PM »
Everybody is falling over themselves to answer the original question....

I propose better question....WHY BOTHER?

Strip

Offline SPKmes

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Re: Would a 9mm pistol round bounce?
« Reply #22 on: November 30, 2009, 05:46:54 PM »
lag
« Last Edit: November 30, 2009, 06:29:28 PM by SPKmes »

Offline Chalenge

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Re: Would a 9mm pistol round bounce?
« Reply #23 on: November 30, 2009, 05:48:34 PM »
that is not the discussion chalenge the statement i took issue with was that a 9mm would just "bounce off" a plane skin, i think it would likely make a hole of some sort ...

Then why say this?

Quote
a plane moving however fast is not necessarily moving at all relative to another moving plane ...

But to answer the question: No one would be so foolhardy is to think it would be effective in warfare.
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Offline SPKmes

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Re: Would a 9mm pistol round bounce?
« Reply #24 on: November 30, 2009, 05:51:38 PM »
     Pssssst....^^^^^^^

You're the only one talking about handguns Krusty.

Offline ZZee

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Re: Would a 9mm pistol round bounce?
« Reply #25 on: November 30, 2009, 06:18:57 PM »
I do have some aircraft skin laying around that I'll take to the range next time I go if I remember.

i'll shoot at it from different distances and angles.

 :lol, cant believe we're arguing about this :D


Thorism,

I never said it would bounce off an aircraft skin, however, you wouldnt be shooting at it at 90 degree angles so deflection would become far more likely then penetration at the distances mentioned.

The car on the web site was pretty funny, but again, it was pretty close range and at right angles.


 :cheers:

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Offline ZZee

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Re: Would a 9mm pistol round bounce?
« Reply #26 on: November 30, 2009, 06:25:18 PM »
because strip, even dumb questions can be fun to debate over. Look at congress :aok
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Offline Krusty

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Re: Would a 9mm pistol round bounce?
« Reply #27 on: November 30, 2009, 06:36:44 PM »
Ahem... folks...?

The topic line of this thread says "9mm pistol round".....

Offline Strip

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Re: Would a 9mm pistol round bounce?
« Reply #28 on: November 30, 2009, 06:49:08 PM »
Krusty,

Dont be to obvious ya know....

 :headscratch:

Offline thorsim

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Re: Would a 9mm pistol round bounce?
« Reply #29 on: November 30, 2009, 06:53:12 PM »
Ahem... folks...?

The topic line of this thread says "9mm pistol round".....

the noun is round
THOR C.O. II ~JG-27~ Afrika-AH
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Quote from: any number of idiots here
blah blah Blah
Quote from: oldman
Good call.  Ignore the people who actually flew the real planes against each other.