Ok... maybe I'm wrong.

[-lazs-]

I see a lot of posts from guys who claim that certain planes can make a 180 degree turn without losing any speed or energy.   Some go so far as to say "multiple 180's".  

I don't think this is possible.   Maybe I'm wrong.   Still.... I have allways heard only one side to it.   Those who claim that the dastardly deed was done against them (usually causing their unfair demise at the hands of said uber plane).

Is there anyone out there who claims that THEY can do a 180 degree turn in any AH plane and not lose any speed or energy?    If so, I would like to go into one of the arenas with them and learn how to do this.
lazs

[TheWobble]

Any plane can do a 180 without losing speed...but that speed is  gonna be on the verge of stall.

[funked]

I did some tests of high-g 180's in some of the most-whined-about planes.  I found nothing unusual.

[-ammo-]

 

Originally posted by TheWobble:
Any plane can do a 180 without losing speed...but that speed is  gonna be on the verge of stall.

huh?

[TheWobble]

ammo, what i mean is that all planes (even bombers) have a certin speed at which they can maintain a 180. although its at the very verge of the plane stalling and rolling over.

[juzz]

You know, sustained turning speed...

[Yeager]

Had this happen three times in the space of a week.  It was the same Chog driver on two occasions and a N1K driver on a different occasion.  I havent seen these two online since then, and have never had the problem repeat itself.

Maybe a hack got into the game for a short while.  

Dunno.

Yeager

[Andy Bush]

-lazs-

Any AH plane can make a 180 degree turn without losing airspeed...but you probably didn't really mean to ask the question that way, did you?

I think you probably meant that AH aircraft when flown at max performance parameters will bleed speed in a turn...if so, you are correct.

As my buddy Leon 'Badboy' Smith will discuss in his upcoming article on AH aircraft, most of these planes can sustain a turn of about 3Gs...any more g than that, and they will bleed energy in a level turn.

In RL, we use to refer to a very quick and tight turn as a 'bat turn'...then...as in this sim...no one pulled off a bat turn without giving up a bunch of energy.

Andy

[StSanta]

Anyone ever gone into a tracking position while skydiving, and then extended one of yer arm 90 degrees?

Now *that*s a bat turn.

And you don't lose that much e either  .

------------------
StSanta
9./JG 54 "Grünherz"
while(!bishRookQueue.isEmpty() && loggedOn()){
30mmDeathDIEDIEDIE(bishRookQueue.removeFront());
System.out.println("LW pilots are superior");
myPlane.performVictoryRoll();
}

[Jekyll]

Did some testing of a certain Japanese plane   tonight in the TA.

Initial conditions.. zero altitude (well, maybe 20 feet), 50% fuel, initial airspeed 300mph.

Pull hard into level 360 degree turn, holding 4-5g's constant.

After 180 degrees, airspeed has dropped to 295mph.

After 360 degrees, airspeed has dropped to 260 mph.

Average speed through 360 degree turn - 280mph.  Time for 360 degree turn - 16.7 seconds (timed via stopwatch), giving average turn rate of 21.55 degrees/sec and turn radius of 1091 feet.

Now, will this end the complaints about the Nik?

FILM

 

I did some tests of high-g 180's in some of the most-whined-about planes. I found nothing unusual.

Keep testing funked... you'll get it right sooner or later  
 

------------------
C.O. Phoenix Squadron http://www.users.bigpond.net.au/phoenix
Aces High Training Corps

[This message has been edited by Jekyll (edited 11-28-2000).]

[gatt]

I'm at work now, so I cant see the film but, definitely, 5mph look like a *huge* E-loss. So, if I merge H2H at 300mph IAS with my trusty C.205 and I extend without any maneuver I'll be safe, right?

[RAM]

 

Originally posted by gatt:
I'm at work now, so I cant see the film but, definitely, 5mph look like a *huge* E-loss. So, if I merge H2H at 300mph IAS with my trusty C.205 and I extend without any maneuver I'll be safe, right?

LOL I smell sarcasm here?  

[funked]

Keep testing Jekyll, you'll get it right sooner or later.      

You dropped about 350 feet during the 360.  Which over a 16.7 second turn is about the same as having an extra 300 hp accelerating the plane!

Doing level turns starting at 300 mph, 50 feet altitude, WEP on, I get 275-285 mph after a 180 in the N1K2-J and 265-275 mph after a 180 in the Fw 190A-5.

Search for Wells' "Energy Retention" thread if you want to see how to do this kind of testing properly.  He's got a really good method worked out which is better than doing 180's on the deck.

Also Wells did some calcs to show which planes should do better than others in this kind of thing.  Not surprisingly, N1K2-J and Spitfires were on top.  I've yet to see a comparison of planes in AH (with each other or with real life experimental data) that didn't make sense in light of Wells' calculations.

<S>  Glad to see someone looking at this scientifically instead of with whine-ology.    

[This message has been edited by funked (edited 11-28-2000).]

[gatt]

Very interesting! I dunno squat about tight turns. I'll do some tests this evening. May God help us, 300hp more just for having dropped the nose 300ft ...

[-lazs-]

Ok, I wasn't very clear... I thot we all knew the complaint.   I am talking about a full or near full, speed merge.   Both planes at the same alt and one of em makes a 180 degree reverse without losing any E.  

I have heard all the stories of how this was done to this guy or that but... I am only interested in hearing from someone who claims to be able to do it.
lazs