Timid

[thndregg]

Opinions and light discussions only please ... im tired of these stupid thread locking name maimer arguments back and forth.

Good luck.

[Wmaker]

you might be considered timid if:

you don't fight until someone dies, but rather try to RTB!

you extend more then 3k

you extend and wont turn around until your chaser turns around and heads the other way(this sometimes lasting a full sector)

you BNZ from a 2k perch or higher

To those I will add:

You only engage if there are more friendly's than enemy's (flying in a horde)
You only engage if you have an advantage, speed, alt, position, firepower.

So disengaging from a fight for whatever reason and returning to base is considered timid now and this line of thinking even gets the trainer's "seal of approval"??

[Rebel]

There's a difference between flying timid, flying smart, and being a dumbarse.  

Flying Timid means a 1 vs 1 where you just bail on the fight the second you lose an advantage (rather then try your skill, fix your mistake, and win the fight through determination, you bail and run away into ack/friendlies/etc)

Flying smart is, well, not dying.  Cherry picking is a form of it (clearing friendly sixes, etc)- I don't get how this is a "bad" thing, though.  If you arrive with an altitude advantage, invariably the same advantage could be had by those below you, if they showed just a bit of patience and arrived at the same alt.

Being a dumbarse- this is screaming, crying, and wailing about that big mean ol' bully of a P51 that took off from a rear field to arrive at the fight that you're oh-so-noble self is valiantly fighting (apparenlty one must contend with a legion of enemies, AND the trees to be a worthy fighter pilot), and pick your butt off at 500mph.  

[TequilaChaser]

So disengaging from a fight for whatever reason and returning to base is considered timid now and this line of thinking even gets the trainer's "seal of approval"??

WMaker, seems like you misinterpeted what Ghosth was a sayin.......

where did he say anything of the like,  He said

• You only engage if there are more friendly's than enemy's (flying in a horde)
  
• You only engage if you have an advantage, speed, alt, position, firepower.
  

he just added them to the list someone else made......... he never gave an approval of anything

my my my,  are we feeling a bit touchy on the subject????  did someone call you Timid???   

[Blooz]

Timid?

You could be playing Aces High but play Cafe World instead.

[RufusLeaking]

Flying Timid means a 1 vs 1 where you just bail on the fight the second you lose an advantage (rather then try your skill, fix your mistake, and win the fight through determination, you bail and run away into ack/friendlies/etc)

In the elusive case of a well matched 1 v 1 (plane, alt, speed,) it is crazy to run.  Good, white knuckle fights happen once per tour, if you're lucky.  These rare fights are even worth a death.

Flying smart is, well, not dying.  Cherry picking is a form of it (clearing friendly sixes, etc)- I don't get how this is a "bad" thing, though.  If you arrive with an altitude advantage, invariably the same advantage could be had by those below you, if they showed just a bit of patience and arrived at the same alt.

No argument with the smartness.  Personally, I find it dull.  And my gunnery blows.  I have trouble hitting the ground.

Being a dumbarse- this is screaming, crying, and wailing about that big mean ol' bully of a P51 that took off from a rear field to arrive at the fight that you're oh-so-noble self is valiantly fighting (apparenlty one must contend with a legion of enemies, AND the trees to be a worthy fighter pilot), and pick your butt off at 500mph. 

I am guilty of a good whine.  Usually on country.  A roll of duct tape might be in order.  My personal dumbarsed-ness is diving into help a green guy who is in over his head, seeing him die, and being in over my head.  Then I whine that other green guys don't repeat my mistake ...

Timid, smart or dumb isn't the goal here.  Fun is the goal.

"This is fun."

"This is fun."

"This is fun."

[Wmaker]

he just added them to the list someone else made......... he never gave an approval of anything

So am I wrong in thinking that when someone quotes something and says "To those/that I will add" that he agrees about what he has quoted and simply adds more of his thoughts to the matter?

my my my,  are we feeling a bit touchy on the subject????  did someone call you Timid???  

Touchy? Not at all. I just think that the attitudes of the vocal few in this community are in the need of piss cleansing.

[TequilaChaser]

heck, I don't know....... I just look at what they post, not what they quote...... maybe I am wrong

but still, there is no

trainer's "seal of approval"

 given or meant, I am almost 99.9% positive of that

the lil    gesture was just a joke......  jut as well, 99% of the stuff I see post in most of these threads, I take with a grain of salt.......

still wish HTC could incorporte some way of having players who play online, have to also register & acknowledge that they know  / are aware of the Aces High Messageboards when they 1st sign up and log into the game for the 1st time......

then the vocal few that view/post to these boards can become the Vocal majority of players, or however that should be worded......

[BigB]

So disengaging from a fight for whatever reason and returning to base is considered timid now and this line of thinking even gets the trainer's "seal of approval"??

Actually, this is "apples and oranges" so to speak.

Ghosth was referring to choosing when or not TO engage. ( ie. only when in a furball of friendlies or
when having an advantage over a bandit )

Your comment is referring to breaking an engagement for whatever reason. ( RTB due to fuel, ammo or just to run )

I am adimittingly still a bit of a noob around AH, but to me the difference makes your comments a bit off base.

Just my thoughts and an observation, no bashing intended.

<S> and blue skies sir..

 

[Wmaker]

Actually, this is "apples and oranges" so to speak.

Well IMO, it isn't. Check the post Ghost quoted and the posts after that.

[gyrene81]

You only engage if you have an advantage, speed, alt, position, firepower.

At first glance I misinterpreted Ghosth's assertion, but after reading it again, I understand the idea...but I still disagree. With a few exceptions, if you're following Boelcke's dicta, you are not going to engage an enemy unless you do have advantage, speed, alt, position and firepower...and nearly everyone tries to use one if not all of the principles that Boelcke taught, yet strangely enough many of the vocal minority consider the use of some of those principles to be lame when put into practice by others.


Boelcke's Dicta

1. Try to secure advantages before attacking. If possible, keep the sun
behind you.

2. Always carry through an attack when you have started it.

3. Fire only at close range, and only when your opponent is properly in your
sights.

4. Always keep your eye on your opponent, and never let yourself be
deceived by ruses.

5. In any form of attack, it is essential to assail your opponent from behind.

6. If your opponent dives on you, do not try to evade his onslaught, but fly to
meet it.

7. When over the enemy's lines, never forget your own line of retreat.

8. For the Staffel: Attack on principle in groups of four or six. When the fight
breaks up into a series of single combats, take care that several do not go
for one opponent.

[FLS]

I believe Boelcke had a different dicta for online gaming but I can't seem to find it at the moment.   

[Dadsguns]

We all are not far off on the true definition of being Timid.

What leads to timidness also could be defined into many different views as well, Score being the most prevalent I would believe.  Ego probably has alot to do with it as well.

I don't fly for score, but it is the result of what I do.  I don't run from fights and search for and crave good ones.  Unfortunately I run into several stereotypical type of players that fit into one extreme or another.  

Yesterday, I had several decent fights, but came across one particular pilot that had a tremendous alt advantage on me for our first fight, I enjoy these as well since like one posted below, I go into the fight with the mindset of winning it.  This guy put up a decent fight and when the tide turned he ran to help which saved him momentarily until I had them both on my six and started working them, now its 2vs1, I am not panicking or typing on country for help, I crave these situations, I worked them both over and won that round.  

So the next round he comes back again at a tremendous alt 24k and he finds me co-alt with him this time, immediately he dives for the deck and finds some help which did not come soon enough, he dies again along with his help.  This goes on several times with even more "help" with him, just for little ol me.

What does that guy learn, nothing.   Does not gain anything from our experience other than come in higher and with more help.  

The only thing that I cant tolerate, (so many other evils to choose from), is to run from a fight if you have no other explainable reason outside of (beans, bullets, gas) like not having some advantage.  

I cant tell you how many times, and I don't mean to pick on any side more than the other but Rooks are notorious for this in a horde or 1 on 1, its a joke on the Bish side that all you have to do is get co alt with a rook and he is diving for help or ack.   That is timid in my book, that is not learning anything but running to help so that someone else does the work.  

Just my opinion, and this surely happens on all sides, some more prevalent then others,  but if you want to learn anything don't learn to run to help, that's the easy thing to do, any two weeker can do that.  Learn to fight more so with a disadvantage as well as an advantage.  


Bar, you are the biggest hoer, runner, noe'r, picker in this game and you should be ashamed to have posted this crap!!!!          Just kidding.......
 

[Wmaker]

.

[papjohns]

Funny this came up as I have been struggling with this myself recently.

I tend to fly in a way that some may call timid and others "smart." I won't engage a con unless:

1) I have the advantage (alt)
or
2) It is at least CO-E
and
3) The numbers on each side are somewhat even (1v1, 2v3, 3v4, but not something stupid like 2v7).

Now some call that TIMID, others call it SMART. Makes no difference to me. The thing I have personally been struggling with is that I think this will "plateau" my learning curve. Hence, recently I have flown some sorties in attack mode and intentionally headed into a horde just to see how long I can live/evade the 3,4,5 enemy cons. I know it is suicide, and I will die. But at that point my goal is not to get kills, but to see what works for reversals/survival tactics.

My overall SA is pretty good, what I lack now is the ueber ACM skill that muppets and other's possess.....I am trying to pick up those skills and the above Timid and/or "Smart" "criteria" I laid out for myself are not helping in advancing that goal.

Sorry, the above is more of a statement than anything else Take it for what it is worth.