How to kill those bombers!?

[Soulyss]

Great pic!  I do have a question about the angle though.  Like all shots in flight the nose gets in the way of leading the shot.  So to clarify when you say correct angle of attack you would want to roll so that the full bomber is visible?

You can roll your wings a little so that the target is approaching from the side which helps get the nose out of the way, you can also program one of your views to either move your head higher in the seat, or in the case of the P-40 off to one side a bit to help see around the nose.

[Ardy123]

I like to come up from underneath a box of bombers and climb into them, esp with lanks. Lanks don't have belly gunners so if you come in fast and underneath them, then pull up and shoot. Once you overshoot and fly above them, roll over and repeat (and dive on them like others have suggested).

[BillyD]

I like to attack from the 3 or 9 o'clock, slide my views to match the direction of the attack ( bombers right, slide right ). Plan your attack well ahead and make the necessary adjustments.... then shoot in front of the formation as it crosses in front of you. Buffs are big enough targets to land alot of hits on them in this manner and often times I'll smoke 2 bombers or the whole formation this way ( w/ 30mm birds). A good friend taught me this trick  

[Spikes]

I've found that with 30mms it's good to come up from the bottom, and as soon as you pass under and fire, roll over immediately and fire inverted on your way down.  Then setup again.Makes it hard for a guy to track the fighter...but then again, to each his own.

[whipster22]

Hehe.. I sometimes attack Ki-67s that way to avoid the top turret.
It's always very exciting, for I know: If I botch this, I will just zoom into his stream of 20mm's... 

that reminds me of when some spit dweeb came up from dead 6 overshot and got the 20mm pwnge   

but ahh i always have rubber bullets so it took me long time 

[darxe]

My favorite is when I approach a bomber and he opens fire when I am not even in range.  I like to float at range and let them use up all of their ammo.  Then the evil side of me likes to move in at the six after the guy is in a panic because there is nothing he can do 

[LLogann]

Use your arrow keys so you can see out the "edge" of the cockpit.  At first you'll have a pseudo-uncomfortable feeling looking out the side but once you get used to it....     BUT.... That isn't the end all be all, you will still have a blocked view at times.  Think about your egress from the first pass and set it up so you can execute it with the better view.  ( move left vs. move right )

Great pic!  I do have a question about the angle though.  Like all shots in flight the nose gets in the way of leading the shot.  So to clarify when you say correct angle of attack you would want to roll so that the full bomber is visible?

[APDrone]

I would offer up another suggestion for helping you determine the best angle..

Fly bombers for awhile and see what angles are the hardest to hit with the guns.  ( After, of course, you've mastered defensive gunnery )

Then you really won't have much question as to where the best approaches are.  You also get the benefit of seeing others' form and get an idea of the amount of time necessary to set the shot up.

[mtnman]

I posted this in a different thread, but since it applies here too...

Buffs require patience...  If you fly them, it takes a long time to get where you're going, especially at an altitude that gives you a margin of safety.  If you're in a fighter, it takes patience to get into a position to attack from above, and be able to zoom forward so you can set up another steep attack.

In either case, rushing the situation just leads to frustration.  It takes time to set things up right.  Like almost everyone mentioned, if you attack bombers "wrong", they're lethal.  If you attack them "right" though, they're very vulnerable.  Maybe even too vulnerable? 

Attack them in a steep dive.  Try not to go too much below them as you go by, and zoom forward for your next attack.  In a case like this one, looping works fine.  Had I not had quite as much speed, my attack would more closely resemble a very large barrel roll with my shooting taking place at the bottom of the coils.  If you find yourself unable to attack in a steep dive, stop attacking.  Fly parallel with them, getting out front and above them, and set up a decent attack.  As you get better at it, you can afford more risk, but be careful, there are a few really good shots out there!

This type of attack is easy to master, and very effective.  I had a month where I paid attention to my K/D vs buffs a few years ago.  Using this type of attack, my K/D against all bombers was roughly 80 or 90 to 1.  The one was a C47 that jinked a bit while I was too fast and I rammed him, lol.  Embarrassing...  Take the time it takes to set up this type of attack, and get good at it.  Then, you can start to attack without such a good position, and you'll still do fine.  Don't worry about whether they've dropped their ord or not.  That will just cause you to rush things.  Set up the kill, and worry about getting quick at it later.  Bombers begin to look like "gimme" kills after a while.

http://www.4shared.com/file/0h_xSRI2/6_buffs_with_Saber.html (these were set afire, but it doesn't seem to show in this film).
http://www.4shared.com/file/wUpB-EdR/Lancs_0000.html

You don't need big cannons, or a long time to land your shots.  A decent hit in the right place and they really don't stand much of a chance.  Don't sit behind them, or attack at a shallow dive angle.  Minimize the time you're exposed to their guns.  Shoot for the cockpit, wingtip, or wing root.  Clear the right drone first, left drone second, and lead bomber last.  If you light one on fire, it will die.  Time your dive so that as you get in range for your second pass, the burning plane has already died.  Attacking from front to back works fine for one pass, but makes subsequent passes take forever to set up.

[bozon]

Thanks I will keep practicing it then.  The top approach is a good idea.  I imagine after you dive past the bomber you can either use that E to climb up for another run or turn and use the same tactic to the belly.  Maybe finish off a wing from the 1st pass.

Your speed, or more accurately your angular motion from the gunner perspective is your defense. Attacking from higher altitude allows you to pass the bomber when you are fastest. In addition, the vulnerable parts of the bomber are wings and engines - they are easier to hit from above the bomber wing plane.

If your horizontal flight path is not aligned with the bomber's (i.e. you dive at least a little to the side) he will have to track you in two rotation axis and is much more likely to miss. I always try to add some cross component to the attack direction.

The last means of defense is the above-under-above attack: you have to think like a gunner. If you start from above and to the side, the gunner will most likely be in the top turret. To lead you he will have to aim ahead of you. This means that if you take your shots and drop below the bomber wings plane he will be unable to lead you even BEFORE you actually get below him. At this point he will try to jump into another turret: rear or belly. If you use your speed to pass below him and cross to his other side and do not drop too far behind his 3/6 oclick line, he cannot shoot you from the rear and will have to re-acquire you from the belly and rotate like crazy to track you blasting close and below him. Use the speed to get away quickly flying between 60-90 degrees from the bomber direction and only a little below his level - do not climb immediately! use the speed to get some distance. When the belly gunner acquires you and start shooting, then start your zoom - he will lose you again as you get above his wings plane and will have to jump back into the top turrent, reacquire you and by that time, you are already 1+k away in a climb for the next attack.

The general pattern is:
1. Parallel and above to one side
2. diving attack diagonal to the bomber path and dropping below him.
3. fast level flight under and in a diagonal direction to the bomber (do not fall behind) until safe distance is reached.
4. zoom to above the bomber level, establish a parallel path from the other side and back to #1

[darxe]

Good points mtnman and bozon thanks.  That is probably my biggest problem with dive bombing and bomber attacking is extending 1st before I try to get into position again.  Being able to extend away should be key.  I know when I am in the gunner seat the hardest thing to do is reacquire the target after I lose sight of him.  Jumping to different guns then adjusting the sights.  That key moment should be used to provide separation before setting up for another shot.  There seems to be a common theme with all tactics discussed here....PATIENCE!

[Lusche]

What I do see with inexperienced players that are trying to attack buffs the "right" way is that they just extend - Often too long and in the wrong direction, which makes setting up the next attack more difficult.
Your next attack actually begins the moment you pass the buffs. Plan ahead, have an idea where you will (or want to) end up with you plane to set up your next attack. Do not just dive down and extend to the bombers 6, do not just think about getting away. Think about the next attack even when first one is not over yet.

When I do a high speed slashing attack from 2-3 line, I immediately start a gentle, shallow climbing turn towards the flight directions off the buffs, which a gradually increasing climb & turn angle once I got about 800yds seperation. That way I do not lose too much E and get a better position for my next attack, while still giving the buff gunner a very difficult target.

Never stop to think aggressive, never stop to think about you next attack. Note that "thinking agressive" and setting up your attack patiently do not exclude each other.