Icons

[Otaz]

Well it seems the ones that like short icons are not matching the dislike so far in this thread?  As for opting out if the setup is undesirable, I guess that is the way folks in America make decisions everyday?  Why buy a Ford over a Toyota, they both get you where your going? You seem to be saying that any idea a designer wants to put forward should met with open arms, regardless of how the participants feel about it, I doubt very much that idea will fly for long.

This isn't directed at you specifically Boxboy, but I'd like to point out that, as someone who's been an admin for many games (CoD:UO, MoH:AA, Jedi Academy among others) as well as being a former beta tester for many of the current popular MMOs (WoW, LotRO, Age of Conan, PotBS etc) and admin'd several forums over the years, rarely do the people who agree with a setup or topic of discussion support said setup or discussion with the same fervor as those who are against it. Just because the "yays" don't make as much of a concentrated effort in a forum debate defending their position on an issue as the "nays" do, doesn't mean that the nays win the debate or that there are greater numbers "against" rather than "for"...it just means that some people are content with things as they are or have no opinion one way or the other and feel no need to defend their position to those who can not "agree to disagree".

In past experiences, I've found that the silent masses who agree with or are at least indifferent to an issue (such as the shorter icon ranges in this particular case) often outnumber those who are vehemently opposed to the change, and often to the point where threats of quitting their subscriptions (and/or boycotting a volunteer created event) are used in a futile attempt to try and get their way. Many times, those that do quit, come back, and those that don't, are replaced by other players. I would bet that a majority of the players would continue to play the game if the icon range was shortened by half. Most just want to enjoy the game and would be tolerant as long as they have a game to play.


In the end, the game goes on, the developers continue to develop their games the way they feel is best, and volunteers, CMs, Event planners/Admins, etc, continue to step forward to enhance the game for all which many times leads to a beating from the vocal minority who seem to always find something to complain about.

    and   to the volunteers and all they do to enhance the game...and thanx.

C'ya in this Friday's FSO and hopefully, many more to come no matter what the setup is.

[Chapel]

It was said months ago that the current crop of CMs was hell bent on reducing icon ranges to 0. Everyone said that would never happen. We are slowly being conditioned to accept this ridiculous/gameplay killing setup. The majority of the players hate short icon ranges. Not only that, short icons are UNFAIR to players with small screens and or bad eyesight. Despite this fact, the CMs insist on forcing this crappy gameplay down our throats. I think some people are too intent on recreating history when they SHOULD be focused on creating compelling gameplay situations based in a historical setting. These are not historical reenactments. We play a game..thats right folks..you are not real fighter pilots. This is not WWII. This is a game. And games need to be fair, balanced and fun.

So are you going to push to force a ban on HOTAS and joystick setups because they are UNFAIR?
This game has progressed to the point where everyone should be flying on a decent sized screen. If your not, then that's your choice. Most 22"+ sized flat panel screens can be bought for less than $150 bucks. That's what I got mine for, and that was over a year ago.
Most joysticks cost at LEAST $150 bucks, don't even get me going on a HOTAS setup and rudder pedals. All those buttons and the Hands On Throttle and Stick definitely give a HUGE advantage to those without a HOTAS or even a cheaper joystick. Yet no one ever complains about them being an UNFAIR advantage.

If your going to complain that people can't see or afford a decent monitor, then at least spread the dough around to make a proper cake.

[daddog]

I said this 5 months ago in an 11 page long thread about icons that had to do with the Combat Challenge.

As I have said in other threads the Arena Settings which include icon ranges are up to each Admin CM. I don't see making icons off an FSO standard despite many asking for that last night. I have an FSO this summer and will probably fiddle with the icons as I did in my last one, but it is my impression (which could be wrong) that most Admin's for FSO will keep the standard short range icon settings we have used successfully for years.

But I must be a liar according to some of you. I say one thing and do another. I should point out that it is 'this' summer and I am fiddling with the icon settings. You guys had a 5 month heads up.

Boxboy all that you got for your belligerent efforts.

You are ignoring this user. Show me the post.

I just love that feature of the HTC forums. If someone can't make a point without being rude and insulting others you don't have to read their posts.

I take it then that you OWN this event DD, nice to know that we are just pawns for you to experiment with.

Nope Boxboy, don't own it. Just started it back in 2001 I think.

The majority of the players hate short icon ranges.

I missed that poll BigR. Could you show me choices and where the FSO players took it? I would like to participate. Oh, and don't forget I think I said that myself 5 months ago.

It was said months ago that the current crop of CMs was hell bent on reducing icon ranges to 0. Everyone said that would never happen.

Well, apparently not everyone ,because when everyone was saying it would never happen some were saying the current crop of CM's were hell bent on reducing icon ranges to 0.

Other than this last frame how many other times have we 'messed' with the icon ranges this year in FSO? Anyone know? You would think by the very first post in this long thread

Why do you guys insist on messing with these ranges?

that we do it every month. If my memory serves the last time was in 2009.

I was contacted by the AK's prior and was made aware of their choice not to participate long before I divided up the squads. Not only did they make me aware they did the work themselves by updating their squad and marking themselves 'not-active'. I did not have to do a thing. I did inquire privately as to why and did not receive a reply until this public thread, but I did believe then was due to the icon settings.

As far as squad participation I don't see this any different than getting an AC you don't like. If squads committed to a certain number it is reasonable for us to expect them to honor that. Many of you have stated you will participate despite your not liking the settings. Hats off to you. Others have said they will not show up. We have already had one squad not show up and ruin the night of another squad they were supposed to escort. We don't need squads like that in FSO and they will be removed.

[Vulcan]

Other than this last frame how many other times have we 'messed' with the icon ranges this year in FSO? Anyone know? You would think by the very first post in this long thread  that we do it every month. If my memory serves the last time was in 2009.

Sorry daddog but I distinctly remember several occasions this year where the icon range was 'accidentally' set wrong. So far iirc it's always been short, never long. Maybe they were genuine mistakes but you can't blame people for wondering.

You noted the poll (or lack thereof). Perhaps an email from the CM's to the squads would have been warranted?

[FiLtH]

    How about we just make it 3.0 and call it good huh?


   Half as far as the MA and still good enuff for the handicap players (small screens/poor eyesight) to have fun.

   And make it a standard for FSOs so we always know what to expect.

    This squabbling is getting nowhere. 

[daddog]

I don't blame anyone for wondering, but many have made comments that would lead other to believe that we have changed the icons in several designs and that is not the case. To be more specific I don't recall any design with the icons set to short, but if you want to count mistakes so be it.

BigR said

The majority of the players hate short icon ranges.

I stated 5 months ago that I thought this to be true. He has stated it as a fact which it is not. I did not feel a need to poll the players and still don't.

[Valkyrie]

Its the same people squeaking about the icons every f**king time. Turn the icons off and we'll have a hell of a time.

Vlkyrie1

[saltee]

Did you ever personally build a car from scratch if not I don't see why your driving one???

That's an easy one.  I like the one I'm driving and not ranting about the manufacturer that built it.

I love relevant analogies...

[DrDea]

As far as squad participation I don't see this any different than getting an AC you don't like.

  Theres a HUGE diff here. I have always held that I will fly whatever Im given to fly and not wine about it. I know what the plane can and cant do and will act accordingly.  The issue is in the normal settings you have time to decide what your going to do with said plane. Now you can be engaged from 20 directions all at once and never see it coming.
  I think what most are saying is the fun factor gets seriously reduced when your spending your entire time checking every dot in sight wondering not only is it a friendly,but is it close enough to be a threat or not.

[AKKuya]

In my humble opinion, it is the responsibility of each participating player to take the 3 minutes out of thier time to log on to the internet, log onto AH special events and head to the area marked FSO to look at the current set-up to read the entire page of information.  Simple 3 minutes out of 10,080 minutes in one week.

If players can't find 3 minutes out of 10,080 to choose from and not know the conditions of the Frame, then why are they complaining?

Laziness is no excuse for disgruntlement.  

The AK's took a look at the set-up and opted out for issues with the icons and some of us wanted to take a break and spend more time in the MA's on friday night doinf squad activities.  Three minutes a few conversations did that.

If individual players have problems with the set-up, then take that to your squad leadership and in-house discuss going inactive for a tour or two.  It's not a hard thing to do.

[Squire]

Evil is in the land and on the march. The only way that daddog can be stopped now is to have the "ring of icons" melted down from where it was forged, in the fires of the MA's Titanic Tuesdays mount doom in grid 10.10.1. It will not be an easy task however, as the great CM EYE sits atop the arena. A great lidless eye wreathed with flame, filled with hate, and ringed in darkness (and Rook bases) that can see past d5k. daddog senses victory, so close now, searching as he does with squadrons of all black Bf 110s flying below 500 ft to avoid detection. All those that want to plunge AH Events into a great no icon darkness that will completely envelope all of Aces High march to his banner. The last Free Arena, the AvA, has fallen, only FSO remains, but can they stand alone?

...Or, maybe a few folks need to get some summer sun and have a BBQ? 

[68falcon]

Squire, seriously, I am ROFLMAO

 

[Otaz]

Evil is in the land and on the march. The only way that daddog can be stopped now is to have the "ring of icons" melted down from where it was forged, in the fires of the MA's Titanic Tuesdays mount doom in grid 10.10.1. It will not be an easy task however, as the great CM EYE sits atop the arena. A great lidless eye wreathed with flame, filled with hate, and ringed in darkness (and Rook bases) that can see past d5k. daddog senses victory, so close now, searching as he does with squadrons of all black Bf 110s flying below 500 ft to avoid detection. All those that want to plunge AH Events into a great no icon darkness that will completely envelope all of Aces High march to his banner. The last Free Arena, the AvA, has fallen, only FSO remains, but can they stand alone?

...Or, maybe a few folks need to get some summer sun and have a BBQ? 

 

[Chapel]

I'm sure it's been mentioned before....

But Squire sparked my memory and a concept i've seen used before. It had to do with Icons getting "lighter" or more "faint" depending on how long you were looking at them. So they'd get brighter until fully lit if you focus'd your vision on them, but if you looked away for a few seconds, it forced you to "re-aquire" the target. I'm sure this is probably a coding issue and not simply a switch that can be turned on/off.

Anyway, Squire jogged my memory and I remebered that I thought that was pretty cool. Might be an awesome comprimise.

[Zoney]

I was stupid and did not catch the icon set up note.  It was a surprise when I spotted my first bandit.  I was challenged by this set up.  I enjoyed it alot.  I look forward to the next 2 weeks of no icons.  I look forward to future FSO's and shall compete with the best of my ability with whatever I am given.

And this shall continue.  Up to a point certainly.  Maybe my threshold of dissatisfation is higher than yours.  I would not want to be playing the same game forever, as new developments are made and options can be considered, an experiment to revue how playable those options would have to be tried, analyized and then decided on as to its merits.

<S> JG77 is privileged to participate in the FSO and we thank those involved.