Author Topic: Town Building Respawn  (Read 837 times)

Offline Zygote404

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Town Building Respawn
« on: September 29, 2010, 02:30:14 PM »
My wishlist item is: Town buildings don't respawn till the last building to be destroyed respawns under its timer.  Then they all respawn at once.  Makes it much simpler and might help the map move a bit faster. 

Offline SlapShot

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Re: Town Building Respawn
« Reply #1 on: September 29, 2010, 03:40:01 PM »
Why does it need to be simpler and why does the map have to move faster ?
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Offline guncrasher

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Re: Town Building Respawn
« Reply #2 on: September 29, 2010, 04:08:34 PM »
I have seen parts of the town respawn at same time but never the whole town respawn at once.


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Offline ImADot

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Re: Town Building Respawn
« Reply #3 on: September 29, 2010, 04:12:05 PM »
An object respawns at a set time after being destroyed.  Why should it wait until all other objects near it are also destroyed?
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Offline Killer91

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Re: Town Building Respawn
« Reply #4 on: September 29, 2010, 04:16:43 PM »
NOPE


Then everyone would wait untill troops were in town to take down the last building.
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Offline Latrobe

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Re: Town Building Respawn
« Reply #5 on: September 29, 2010, 05:34:34 PM »
NOPE


Then everyone would wait untill troops were in town to take down the last building.

That nope gave me a good laugh :lol

But I agree, everyone would leave one building up and wait until the troops were in town before destroying it. :lol

Offline Zygote404

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Re: Town Building Respawn
« Reply #6 on: September 29, 2010, 05:42:24 PM »
How about ya kill the troops b4 they get to town? If you can't do that I think you deserve to lose the base.  Thats a non-sensical argument anyway.  This only applies for the last building destroyed not the last building. 

If the timer was up on the last building destroyed, regardless of any remaining buildings then the buildings would repop anyway, which would mean waiting would accomplish nothing except having the entire town repop on you.
« Last Edit: September 29, 2010, 05:47:41 PM by Zygote404 »

Offline Lusche

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Re: Town Building Respawn
« Reply #7 on: September 29, 2010, 06:43:11 PM »
How about ya kill the troops b4 they get to town? If you can't do that I think you deserve to lose the base. 

How about killing town within the existing 45 minutes timeframe? ;)


Seriously: have you considered what it would mean for gameplay if towns buildings stay down almost indefinitely? I don't mean from any particular viewpoint, but for the gameplay balance for the arena as a whole?
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Offline Zygote404

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Re: Town Building Respawn
« Reply #8 on: September 30, 2010, 02:40:51 AM »
How about killing town within the existing 45 minutes timeframe? ;)


Seriously: have you considered what it would mean for gameplay if towns buildings stay down almost indefinitely? I don't mean from any particular viewpoint, but for the gameplay balance for the arena as a whole?
45 minutes is not long enough.  Many captures for various reasons last over an hour, some over many hours.  Invisible magical builders should not be a significant influence on captures, players should.  If you want to keep your base, fight for it, if you want to take an enemy base, fight for it.  Fighting for it for hours because troops keep failing to take when the invisible magical builders pop up a building is not good gameplay.  Players should be the primary influencers on captures.

And yes I have considered it, imo it would speed up map captures, currently they are around about never on many base maps.  IMO The only real reason maps do reset before the week is up is because of two country gang banging.  Two country gang banging should not be a prerequisite for a country winning or losing wars.

Also they would not stay down indefinitely.  Either you kill all buildings and you get 45 minutes.  Or you kill some buildings and you get 45 minutes.  The timer would still be 45 minutes.  

What it would do is stop a situation developing where one guy puts down 10 buildings by himself over a few minutes, then a mission comes along 20 minutes later, puts down the rest, believing they have 45 minutes.   They bring their troops 30 minutes into the mission and suddenly they don't take.  They get uppers, put down the newly popped buildings and by the time more troops arrive the buildings they put down are up again.  After this buildings begin popping every few minutes.  Its a stupid situation.
« Last Edit: September 30, 2010, 02:42:59 AM by Zygote404 »

Offline Lusche

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Re: Town Building Respawn
« Reply #9 on: September 30, 2010, 08:04:50 AM »
45 minutes is not long enough.  Many captures for various reasons last over an hour, some over many hours.  

Plenty of bases are being captured within the 45 minutes. And what is wrong with having a battle for very contested field lasting over an hour? The whole point in basecaptures, from a game designing viewpoint, is to initiate combat, a battle. A protracted battle is an absolute "win" in this regard. Of you make captures too easy, there will hardly a battle. If you make them too difficult, nobody will try. And while they have become more difficult, I don't see people not trying any more. The main difference is that bases are no longer being sneaked that easily (though it still happens), and steamrolling the has become a bit more difficult.

But let's look at your proposal in detail:
"Respawn timer starts only when last building has been destroyed"

That means town buildings will stay down indefinitely until the last building is going down. In other words, one side can kill town buildings here and there, all over a front, without having to worry about the timer.  The attacker never has to concentrate on any target, he can easily avoid combat by switching his point of attack. Quick raids for a few more buildings here an there. No reason to press the attack. No reason stay and fight any defenders.
In the end, you will have a lot of towns that are down to a handful or even ONE building. Particularly for the outnumbered side, it's about impossible to mount any successful defense against this. All that is needed for the attacker is another quick raid vs a town with only one building, and that can happen any time. Now, next hour, in three ours. And you can bet on it: It will happen when nobody is looking.

So effectively you are reducing the towns to a single object. You are vastly boosting the attack, while almost completely crippling the defense. The result: Much less combat, much less battles. That's about the worst thing that can happen for balance & gameplay.

« Last Edit: September 30, 2010, 08:06:33 AM by Lusche »
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Offline Mato

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Re: Town Building Respawn
« Reply #10 on: September 30, 2010, 10:26:21 AM »
Please correct me if I'm wrong here.

Quote
"Respawn timer starts only when last building has been destroyed"

That means town buildings will stay down indefinitely until the last building is going down.

I believe he means the last building that was destroyed, not necessarily the last building needed to destroy the town.

Quote
You are vastly boosting the attack, while almost completely crippling the defense. The result: Much less combat, much less battles. That's about the worst thing that can happen for balance & gameplay.

I agree.
This is THE point, in my opinion.

One person, with a lot of time, could take down a town at their leisure.
All that needs to be done is to return to the town and destroy at least one building within 44 minutes, keeping the previously destroyed buildings down.
Defensively, you would need to commit to the town for at least 45 minutes from the time the last building was destroyed.
It doesn't take much luck to destroy one building, even against a defended town.



Offline Chugamug

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Re: Town Building Respawn
« Reply #11 on: September 30, 2010, 12:00:02 PM »
Does destroying the road convoys add to the re-build time of the town's buildings?
If it does, then you'd need someone to keep the convoys from reaching base to help with a capture.
If not, what effect does destroying the road convoys have?

Offline Lusche

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Re: Town Building Respawn
« Reply #12 on: September 30, 2010, 12:20:31 PM »
Does destroying the road convoys add to the re-build time of the town's buildings?
If it does, then you'd need someone to keep the convoys from reaching base to help with a capture.
If not, what effect does destroying the road convoys have?

Road convoys resupply bases, not the towns.
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Offline Lusche

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Re: Town Building Respawn
« Reply #13 on: September 30, 2010, 12:49:29 PM »
Please correct me if I'm wrong here.

I believe he means the last building that was destroyed, not necessarily the last building needed to destroy the town.


Hmm. Could be.

But if so, it wouln't make a difference. You can still keep town buildings down indefinetely by killing just one more once withing 45 minutes. In other words, a single player in a Typhoon can keep down several towns to near-capture status all over the front for hours.
The result is pretty much the same as I described above.
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Offline Zygote404

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Re: Town Building Respawn
« Reply #14 on: September 30, 2010, 10:46:08 PM »

Hmm. Could be.

But if so, it wouln't make a difference. You can still keep town buildings down indefinetely by killing just one more once withing 45 minutes. In other words, a single player in a Typhoon can keep down several towns to near-capture status all over the front for hours.
The result is pretty much the same as I described above.
Thats a bit of a stretch.  There are 90 buildings in a town.  To take out 90 buildings on even one town with 1 typhoon would require many sorties and hours of work factoring in defenders.  I'd like to see you try to bring several different towns down to almost capturable levels while the usual defenders up and kill your bellybutton :)

And base captures do happen, map victories are very few and far between.