Kids

[Dichotomy]

my grandmother thought a dinner of soap worked best for that

[dedalos]

No, not a simple slap. Now if you close fisted punched your kid a couple times thats different. You can slap 'em all day as long as theres a good reasoning for the actions.

Wow, and you claim to be the person who is supposed to protect them?  Please show me the law that explains what you wrote.  Have you read the definition of assault and battery?  Out of curiosity, does that apply to adults also?  Could I slap my employees for showing up late?

Whats hard to understand? In Ga. you can legally "Spank/kick their arse/give them knuckle sandwiches". It just depends on the reasoning behind all of this. Of course if its to the face or something of that nature its different.

Sounds like to you "Spank/kick their arse/give them knuckle sandwiches" is all the same?

[Mar]

So when my two year old moves towards the gas stove that's hot, I should skip over the get in there first and move them or explain to them it's hot and instead get right into smacking them?

LOL my little one is deaf yet he knows the sign for hot, and knows that it's not ok to touch the gas stove in the back room for that very reason.  Have I had to get up off my backside and move him away on occasion?  Sure.  He's fascinated by it. Every day he comes into that room with me and looks at it and makes the sign for hot.  It's part of the routine now. Haven't had to smack him for it though.  It still comes down to active vs reactive parenting.  

Way too many of the folks here seem to be of the reactive parenting mode and believe playing catch up by smacking their kids makes up for it.

Not exactly what I meant, I should have described a situation where the child does something offensive and disrespectful. If he doesn't get the message that what he's doing is bad, an alternate means of communication is required. It's not as difficult to understand pain as it is for a squirt to talk.

[dedalos]

so a quick slap in the face for dropping the "F" bomb is illegal?

CAP, it is elegal to hit someone period, unless you are defending yourself.  It has nothing to do with what word they said.  Can I slap you if you drop the F bomb?  What if I feed you first?  Can I slap you then?  What if you did not fix my car properly?  What is it that makes you think kids are exempt from the laws?

[CAP1]

No, not a simple slap. Now if you close fisted punched your kid a couple times thats different. You can slap 'em all day as long as theres a good reasoning for the actions.

that's what i thought.

[CAP1]

CAP, it is elegal to hit someone period, unless you are defending yourself.  It has nothing to do with what word they said.  Can I slap you if you drop the F bomb?  What if I feed you first?  Can I slap you then?  What if you did not fix my car properly?  What is it that makes you think kids are exempt from the laws?

ok. i stand corrected in the other thread then. it is not the kids fault. it is the fault of  laws. the kids are only being human and doing what humans do.....pushing as far as they can.

 

[BowHTR]

Deleted.

[BowHTR]

Wow, and you claim to be the person who is supposed to protect them?  Please show me the law that explains what you wrote.  Have you read the definition of assault and battery?  Out of curiosity, does that apply to adults also?  Could I slap my employees for showing up late?

Sounds like to you "Spank/kick their arse/give them knuckle sandwiches" is all the same?

Georgia
Physical forms of discipline may be used as long as there is no physical injury to the child.
Secs. 19-7-5/19-15- 1/49-5-180. [Civil Code]

Parent or person in loco parentis reasonably disciplining of a minor has a justification for a criminal prosecution based on that conduct.
§ 16-3-20. [Criminal Code]

Colorado
Parent/guardian/ person with care and supervision of minor can use reasonable and appropriate physical force, if it is reasonably necessary and appropriate to maintain or promote welfare of child.
§ 18-1-703. [Criminal Code]

Arkansas
Parent/teacher/guardian/other with care and supervision of a minor may use reasonable and appropriate physical force when and to the extent reasonably necessary to maintain discipline or promote the welfare of the child.
§ 5-2-605(l). [Criminal Code]

Arizona
A parent or guardian and a teacher or other person entrusted with the care and supervision of a minor or incompetent person may use reasonable and appropriate physical force upon the minor or incompetent person when and to the extent reasonably necessary and appropriate to maintain discipline.
§ 13-403. [Criminal Code]

Alaska
When and to the extent reasonably necessary and appropriate to promote the welfare of the child or incompetent person, a parent, guardian, or other person entrusted with the care and supervision of a child under 18 years of age or an incompetent person may use reasonable and appropriate non deadly force upon that child or incompetent person.
§ 11.81.430. [Criminal Code]

Kentucky
Parent/guardian/person/teacher with care and supervision of minor can use force if person believes force necessary for welfare of child and force is not designed to cause or known to cause a substantial risk of causing death, serious physical injury, disfigurement, extreme pain, or extreme mental distress.
§ 503.110. [Criminal Code]

Michigan
Parent/guardian/other person permitted by law, parent, or guardian can reasonably discipline a child, including the use of reasonable force.
§ 750.136b.. [Criminal Code]

A definition of significant trauma is any injury beyond temporary redness of the skin. A practical guideline to use is that any inflicted injury which lasts more than 24 hours constitutes significant injury and requires an investigation.

- Valarie J.
North Carolina Division of Social Services

In all of the 50 states, you can legally spank your child.

[FireDrgn]

This is exactly where all the crazy that is this world has come from. Definitions of "superiority" written by members of one species.

How do you know this without a hidden claim of superiority?

[FireDrgn]

Penguin has the structure of..


All horses are green.

Sam is a horse.

Therefore, Sam is green.

Penguin syllogism is deductively valid.  
You can not imagine on any world both premiss's true and the conclusion as false.





Moot has the structure of...


All horses are green

Sam is green

Therefore ,Sam is a horse.

Moot syllogism is deductively invalid.
You can imagine a world were premiss's are true and the conclusion is false.

[FireDrgn]

     

The ASPCA will put you in jail/ fine you for hitting animals
     Why then, are adults allowed to hit children without punishment? (Not by the ASPCA specifically...)

ASPCA does not jail or fine you for hitting animals generally , only for abuse .Jockeys beat horses all the time with no fines.

Adults that abuse children get punished a lot of the time.

Surely your asking the wrong question?    What is abuse  maybe?

[clerick]

What's worse is the impossibly small margin of error in letting him see for himself (the root of the nonviolent reasoning approach to parenting) that the grill is hot as hell, by letting his hand touch it for long enough, but not too long either.
My little brother (6 years younger) once did this with a clothes iron set to near-max temp. Most of his hand was inhumanly swollen for a while. He learned his lesson..  There's no better way to teach than to let someone "see for themselves".   

I'm speaking from experience here. Just a few years ago i reached down to fiddle with the lever that sweeps the ash down into the pan below. The back of my hand touched the grill for the briefest of moments. The resulting burn was not insignificant.  In fact I still have scaring from it.  I am with you though, natural consequences are one of the best ways to instruct but, there are some situations where I am not willing to risk serious harm.

[Lusche]

Georgia
Colorado
Arkansas
Arizona
Alaska
Kentucky
Michigan

In all of the 50 states, you can legally spank your child.

Just for comparison, this is the corresponding law here in Germany:

BGB, Section 1631:

Section 1631

Contents and limits of care for the person of the child

(...)

(2) Children have a right to non-violent upbringing. Physical punishments, psychological injuries and other degrading measures are inadmissible.

(...) The family court is to support the parents, on application, in exercising care for the person of the child in suitable cases.

[Sonicblu]

[quote

     Human beings are animals
     Children are human beings
     Therefore, children are also animals
[/quote]

It is valid I would challenge it as unsound. Your premise is based on your world view and is unproved/arbitrary.

1. Humans are not the same as animals they are different therefore different forms of discipline could apply. To many reasons that they are different to list.
2. Your world view says humans are animals.  My world view says we are different than "animals" animals can't reason for one.

[Ardy123]

[quote

     Human beings are animals
     Children are human beings
     Therefore, children are also animals


It is valid I would challenge it as unsound. Your premise is based on your world view and is unproved/arbitrary.

1. Humans are not the same as animals they are different therefore different forms of discipline could apply. To many reasons that they are different to list.
2. Your world view says humans are animals.  My world view says we are different than "animals" animals can't reason for one.

Some non-human upper primates have been know to do limited reasoning as well as..
1) hold grudges and seek revenge
2) create simple tools
3) have fairly complex social structures.
4) have even been taught to communicate in sign language

are they human? no....

do some species share almost 96% of the same genes as humans....yes
http://news.nationalgeographic.com/news/2005/08/0831_050831_chimp_genes.html

anything more will get me the ban hammer.