Remove zoom from aircraft sight picture (front view)

[Krusty]

GVs don't have to make split second observations on wing orientation, descent, ascent, rolling, diving, etc. These things could and would be available with the naked eye in real life but in AH would require zoom to make out more than a pixellated blob.

When talking 2D planes, the GV zoom is much more realistic than we had before.

When talking 3D dogfighting, you can't pretend removing the details afforded by zoom is realistic. There is far too much info available in the real world that cannot be supplied by the AH view system.

[gyrene81]

Reflector glass on all versions is about 2x the ring diameter. Move your FOV in until you have that. Create a new Revi in 512x512 mode with a 100mil ring. Mount that in your 109's and 190's. Then move your default FOV forward to make the ring about 1/2 the width of the glass. That will give you a 50mm ring on glass that is about 90-110mm wide. Then zoom is not as much of a factor unless you want to use the stadia marks for degrees of deflection.

I find zooming at the last moment to make the ring about 50mm on my screen makes using the ring and stadia marks work like the manual says they will work. Otherwise at default FOV you are pecking away at something your cross hairs and ring covers up unless you use a dot only.

Wonder if a 42inch LCD gives you more of a 1:1 in your default FOV looking through the gunsight?? Try opening your Revi gunsight in your art program and zooming in on it until the ring meaures 50mm with a hand held ruler up to the LCD panel. Then move your face until it's 17.5 inches from the LCD panel. Now you have the same FOV german pilots did in their cockpits of their Revi gunsight. The british distance was 16.5 inches and the ring was 60mm.

How Is Your Periferal Vision Now??

using your equation...zooming in on a 22 inch monitor to get the dimensions you state for just the glass at a distance of 17.5 inches...i can see 24 inches to each side of the monitor without moving my eyes...i agree default fov isn't good...but the magnification and loss of fov isn't right either, especially at full zoom...and monitor size is going to make a difference in where you start out...target detail isn't going to get any better for sure.

[SmokinLoon]

The gunsights had "zoom", i.e. magnification: The Panzer IV for example was using the TZF % with a 2.5x magnification - yet it has the same level of magnification in AH as any pilot, which is supposed to represent 1:1.  


From another thread:

From a P-38 cockpit
(Image removed from quote.)

From tank commander's position
(Image removed from quote.)

from Panzer IV gunsight
(Image removed from quote.)

All views at max zoom, and at same distance

Loocshy Looschy Looschy... c'mon gent, get it right.    The Panzer IV H used the TZF 5f/1 tank sight, that has only a 2.4X zoom which is LESS than the zoom capability of the TC or aircraft pilot (2.5X?). Bounce back and forth between the TC's maxed zoomed view and the Panzer IV's tank sight, you will see the difference in zoom capability.    

FWIW, I'd like think we could at least TRY having a go without the aircraft pilot zoom.  It would lend towards more of a simulator vs arcade game.  Or, perhaps HTC would consider reducing the zoom by half, maybe to 1.75X or maybe up to only 2X???  I'm not seeing why there is so much drum pounding AGAINST it.  I understand all the 3D vs 2D arguments, but there are lots of other balance mechanisms in the game.  Try it for a month in the AvA server???  Or perhaps just for a couple of days in the MA's???  What harm could come from it????

[kvuo75]

What harm could come from it????

rivers of tears.

just like this thread, because unless htc limits everyone to the same resolution, some people will have better "vision" than others.  My 24" at 1920x1080 a foot in front of my face is way better than someones 60" at 1024x768 at any distance. etc. 

[LCADolby]

To keep in line with the GV gunsight modelling. 

I like the idea. I've watched alot of WWII gun cams and all the shots the pilots take are relatively short distances (on average 50 yards to - 300 yards, because they don't have bionic cyber vision like we have in AH). The GV changes have been fantastic for gameplay, bringing the fight closer in and a much more tactical feeling, (spawn camping excluded).
 If the removal of the zoom function in aircraft caused us fight much more closely together I wouldn't complain one bit. I'm not saying I wouldn't miss it but anything that makes AH feel realistic is a plus.

As for the later TrackIR for FOV/looking around, we can move the camera of any view anywhere in the c-pit well out of reach of the real view of the pilot. The pilot being strapped in can only move his neck and head so far.
 I'd like in addition to the zoom removed; The realistic head positions for our views,(The camera swing just in the same way as you looking over your shoulder, non instant, slightly tilted) and the introduction of the realistic mirrors the aircraft had. I think it would make the experience even more exiting and give one 'ell of an andrenaline rush.

[dirtdart]

Dolby,  I do know that HTC is pretty adverse to the idea of mirrors, so I don't think we would ever get them.  They should would make the Hellcat a bit more interesting to fly...lol.

One thing to consider though, is the what the "average" player uses as a system.  I was a bit upset with the big update two years ago because I had to go out and buy a new system to play, at the setting I wanted to play on.  When ditching these high zoom functions, I wonder how many people could no longer see to the extent those with higher end systems could.  I was a bit shocked not to long ago when HT mentioned that so many folks play with mouse or keyboard. 

Krusty, frankly I have never used zoom looking around in a plane in a fight to make "split second decisions", unless it is to look at a couple of guys fighting, spot M3s, or to confirm town was down.  To look around the fight in zoom, is disorienting.  The only thing zoom does is allow you to fire shots at a greater range than some could naturally see.  Great for shooting down running Mustangs in a Brewster, but not what I would call realistic. 

[Noir]

+1 so pple with small screens don't stand a chance against my 26' anymore 

[bangsbox]

rivers of tears.

just like this thread, because unless htc limits everyone to the same resolution, some people will have better "vision" than others.  My 24" at 1920x1080 a foot in front of my face is way better than someones 60" at 1024x768 at any distance. etc. 

[Karnak]

Dolby,

It isn't just about the range at which a shot is taken, it is mostly about being able to see the orientation of your opponent so that you can see what he is doing and try to get into range.

[dirtdart]

Dolby,

It isn't just about the range at which a shot is taken, it is mostly about being able to see the orientation of your opponent so that you can see what he is doing and try to get into range.

Which is difficult, but that is probably what separated the living from the dead back in the day.  The ol' OODA loop. 

[715]

GVs don't have to make split second observations on wing orientation, descent, ascent, rolling, diving, etc. These things could and would be available with the naked eye in real life but in AH would require zoom to make out more than a pixellated blob.

To be a successful tanker you need to be able to see the same kind of things: you have to see what armor surface and what angle the enemy tank is showing and you certainly need to see what direction his turret is pointing (both offensively, i.e. the sides of turrets have weaker armor than the front, and defensively, as in he's going to shoot you).  And you need to do this quickly: the tanker that makes slow decisions is the dead tanker.

I've measured my screen (24" 1920x1080 at automatic FOV setting) and the tank sight is exactly the right magnification (2.5X in a T34/85) when my eyes are 18" from the screen (which is my normal distance).  The commanders zoom setting is also 2.5X.  For planes the default non zoomed view is about 0.4X, i.e. wide angle, the default zoomed level (no [ or ]) is about 0.86X, and the maximum zoom is 2.5X.  So it comes down to justifying why the limitations of a pixelated screen require 2.5X zoom above reality for pilots but don't require any zoom past 1:1 reality (i.e. the 2.5X the gunsight had in reality) for the tanker.

Personally, I almost never fly planes with max (2.5X) zoom because I'm such a poor shot I need to close to short range.  I'm getting used to the new 1:1 tank sight and I can get kills even at range, but it is a tad annoying and I would imagine it's even more annoying for people with smaller and/or lower resolution screens.  Also my extreme nearsightedness helps me: I just take off my glasses and put my eyes 6" from the screen for an instant 3X extra magnification (7.5X total).