Author Topic: P-40 "white #7"  (Read 17386 times)

Offline ink

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Re: P-40 "white #7"
« Reply #30 on: August 27, 2011, 12:52:01 AM »
ty Motley :salute

got a lot done on her, very few things left to do....pretty happy with the results, still think the color needs tweaking :headscratch:












 in this pic you can see some clipping on the gear doors....



up close there is much less clipping going on :old:


Offline skorpion

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Re: P-40 "white #7"
« Reply #31 on: August 27, 2011, 03:24:40 AM »
:O  looks great ink!!

Offline Fencer51

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Re: P-40 "white #7"
« Reply #32 on: August 27, 2011, 05:16:54 AM »
You have any picture's of Scott's airplane showing that much wear and tear?
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Offline Citabria

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Re: P-40 "white #7"
« Reply #33 on: August 27, 2011, 06:29:51 AM »
(disclaimer: before I get assaulted for giving a full blown art critique, I don't ussually take the trouble to do so but ink is already a proven tatoo artist and a squaddie and he asked me to  :joystick: )

I have stopped using a black rivet layer on flush rivets btw if your using that old tutorial as a model. I use only a low opacity/fill white rivet layer and manual rivet deformation shading around them with a black and white layer.

panel line and rivet subtlety improved.

to get more realistic olive drab try desaturating it to greyish green/brown and tweak it with more color after looking at old color photos if your interested in the saving private ryan look.

remove the paint chip layer and do it over and do it from photo references only very subtley. also always lineup your textures weathering/chipping too. your wings do not match the fuselage wing root on its coresponding texture.

experiment with very faint earth tones and a hint of grime (faint! dont overdo it) and exhaust around and behind the engine. p40s are dirty skanks.


try to recreate what you see in photographs if you are interested in a photorealistic look.


the one thing you can do to get more photorealism is precision and detail. take your time on every tiny piece of the texturemapping and pack in as much refined detail as possible while using photo references as a guide.
« Last Edit: August 27, 2011, 06:44:57 AM by Citabria »
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Offline caldera

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Re: P-40 "white #7"
« Reply #34 on: August 27, 2011, 07:38:20 AM »
The shark mouth, artwork and number 7 all look nicely done - if the paint was new.  With all that wear, they still look too good.  The olive looks a little brown to me.  Your work is quite good but the wear is overkill at the wing edges and roots, IMO.  The underside looks awesome.   :aok
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Offline oboe

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Re: P-40 "white #7"
« Reply #35 on: August 27, 2011, 08:56:57 AM »
Agree the paint wear is too much, and attention must be paid to matching areas between wing root/fuselage, under rear under fuselage vs rear underwing, but man it looks too me like he could do a clinic on paint chipping/wear over bare metal.

Offline Stoney

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Re: P-40 "white #7"
« Reply #36 on: August 27, 2011, 11:58:15 AM »
Ink, is that the right shade of gray underneath?  Its starting to look blue again.  Did they use a bluish-gray on these paintjobs?
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Offline Krusty

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Re: P-40 "white #7"
« Reply #37 on: August 27, 2011, 06:41:34 PM »
Ink your last 2 skins have been purely fantasy in regards to the end product. I think you will find the skin making community enjoys and promotes an eye towards the historically accurate representations of real aircraft, not just taking real markings that existed then making them look however you like.


My advice is to reign in your imagination. Look up some real examples of real planes. Don't just paint what you like on them. Try to replicate the real things.


That's all I'm going to say on it lest I get roasted like another thread.

Offline ink

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Re: P-40 "white #7"
« Reply #38 on: August 27, 2011, 08:02:19 PM »
:O  looks great ink!!
thanx bud :salute

You have any picture's of Scott's airplane showing that much wear and tear?

nope, but it don't matter, the guy was out there fighting every day, I am doing his plane right before his bosses said " scott time to get that plane painted don't ya think"

in other words I am not trying to "duplicate" a certain pic of his plane, but A "time" in its life.


(disclaimer: before I get assaulted for giving a full blown art critique, I don't ussually take the trouble to do so but ink is already a proven tatoo artist and a squaddie and he asked me to  :joystick: )

I have stopped using a black rivet layer on flush rivets btw if your using that old tutorial as a model. I use only a low opacity/fill white rivet layer and manual rivet deformation shading around them with a black and white layer.

panel line and rivet subtlety improved.

to get more realistic olive drab try desaturating it to greyish green/brown and tweak it with more color after looking at old color photos if your interested in the saving private ryan look.

remove the paint chip layer and do it over and do it from photo references only very subtley. also always lineup your textures weathering/chipping too. your wings do not match the fuselage wing root on its coresponding texture.

experiment with very faint earth tones and a hint of grime (faint! dont overdo it) and exhaust around and behind the engine. p40s are dirty skanks.


try to recreate what you see in photographs if you are interested in a photorealistic look.


the one thing you can do to get more photorealism is precision and detail. take your time on every tiny piece of the texturemapping and pack in as much refined detail as possible while using photo references as a guide.

definitely not using that old rivet way, I create the rivet layer using 5 layers...they consist of ....a shadow...a highlight....an a white offset shadow, a black shadow offset, and the rivet layer itself.

ya that's one of the things I noticed, I need to get the wing roots evened out. shoulda caught that right away....you'll have to excuse me I was up for 3 days straight :old:

 :D

   I am not looking to re create a particular pic of this plane, but more of  an attitude or time in its life...

I like the earth tones for dirt and grime, haven't tried or even thought of that, I just used black a bit and burned in some dark areas to simulate dirt.
 
thanx a bunch for the tips and feedback :salute

The shark mouth, artwork and number 7 all look nicely done - if the paint was new.  With all that wear, they still look too good.  The olive looks a little brown to me.  Your work is quite good but the wear is overkill at the wing edges and roots, IMO.  The underside looks awesome.   :aok

ya I haven't touched those yet for the were and tear  :D

and thanx    :salute

Agree the paint wear is too much, and attention must be paid to matching areas between wing root/fuselage, under rear under fuselage vs rear underwing, but man it looks too me like he could do a clinic on paint chipping/wear over bare metal.

I like the worn out battle hardened look...I cant escape it

and thank you  :salute

Ink, is that the right shade of gray underneath?  Its starting to look blue again.  Did they use a bluish-gray on these paintjobs?

it should be grey....I left a very light tint of blue when I colorized the belly paint, for some "life" to the paint, it may still be a bit to bold.


Ink your last 2 skins have been purely fantasy in regards to the end product. I think you will find the skin making community enjoys and promotes an eye towards the historically accurate representations of real aircraft, not just taking real markings that existed then making them look however you like.


My advice is to reign in your imagination. Look up some real examples of real planes. Don't just paint what you like on them. Try to replicate the real things.


That's all I'm going to say on it lest I get roasted like another thread.




exactly what is not historically accurate? 

because of the wear and tear :headscratch:  does that not happen under usage?  and just because there are no "pics" of it, it happened and to think otherwise is pure silliness.

I think you need to let go of that old thought that you need to make a skin EXACTLY like it is in a pic....obviously I am not talking about the nose art and markings.

but to say my two skins so far is all fantasy is an out right lie, they are both real planes, both skins are real.

trust me if I wanted to make a skin look EXACTLY like it is in a pic, I could do that, wouldn't be very hard. (or should I say would not be any more difficult  then what I am doing now, it would be easier in fact)

but my imagination wont let me, I see a plane and I know it goes through some beatings and a rough life,(much like myself) there is no way a paint job is gonna stay pristine during a war absolutely NO WAY...so me being me, I do what I see as a "battle hardened" plane...plain and simple.

 I told you when you sent me that PM about how I "only started skinning to cause a stir" that I am an ARTIST period, what the hell is so hard to understand about that....... :headscratch:   

I am sorry you don't like the fact that I started skinning planes for this game,  actually no....no... I am not sorry, something your gonna have to get used to.

if you cant subjectively and UNBIASED look at a skin and pick something that is obviously wrong with the "markings" "color" "historic accuracy" of said skin, then just put my bellybutton on ignore.



 











Offline Devil 505

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Re: P-40 "white #7"
« Reply #39 on: August 27, 2011, 10:08:49 PM »
Very nice, Ink. The worn paint effect looks fantastic.
But like the others I have to say it is way over done in this aircraft. I understand that you want that war torn look, but allied aircraft don't wear in that manner. The only places you would see paint wear it on panels that are removed on a daily basis. The ammo access door on the left wing of you plane is about as heavy as paint chipping would get. Typically wear would be oil, dirt and grime, faded paint from the sun, and repairs from battle damage.

Here is a model of a realisticly worn P-40 to illustrate what I'm talking about.
http://www.aircraftresourcecenter.com/Gal3/2901-3000/Gal2976_P-40_Stark/00.shtm

If you were to tone down the paint stripping by 75% and wear the paint by fading, this could be the best skin in the game.

Also, wasn't the spinner red?

 :cheers:
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Offline ink

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Re: P-40 "white #7"
« Reply #40 on: August 27, 2011, 10:31:44 PM »
Very nice, Ink. The worn paint effect looks fantastic.
But like the others I have to say it is way over done in this aircraft. I understand that you want that war torn look, but allied aircraft don't wear in that manner. The only places you would see paint wear it on panels that are removed on a daily basis. The ammo access door on the left wing of you plane is about as heavy as paint chipping would get. Typically wear would be oil, dirt and grime, faded paint from the sun, and repairs from battle damage.

Here is a model of a realisticly worn P-40 to illustrate what I'm talking about.
http://www.aircraftresourcecenter.com/Gal3/2901-3000/Gal2976_P-40_Stark/00.shtm

If you were to tone down the paint stripping by 75% and wear the paint by fading, this could be the best skin in the game.

Also, wasn't the spinner red?

 :cheers:

thanx for tips...and that model is awesome :aok

the plane I am doing is Col Scotts

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Robert_Lee_Scott,_Jr.

I read he would paint the spinner different colors....and it mentions that in that wiki....

he also did not have any other markings on his plane....hell I saw a pic of his plane with NO markings at all,  just the shark mouth, I almost did that one.


because of all the remarks about too much paint chipping I will re work that down a bit



again I appreciate very much,the comments and critique  from those who did

 :salute

Offline ink

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Re: P-40 "white #7"
« Reply #41 on: August 28, 2011, 02:48:23 AM »
I concede after extensive p40 image searching the worst paint chipping I could find was this....defanitly way less then what I had going on....so expect an up date soon

 :D

 :salute


Offline Debrody

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Re: P-40 "white #7"
« Reply #42 on: August 28, 2011, 02:57:31 AM »
Ink,
what Oboe said, plz pay a lil bit more attention to the matching parts weathering. Your last version was pretty nice except the wingroot, where the straight line between the "healthy" fuslage and the bare metal wingroot was unreralistic.
Otherwise, pretty nice skin. Keep going!
 :salute
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Offline ink

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Re: P-40 "white #7"
« Reply #43 on: August 28, 2011, 04:20:04 AM »
Ink,
what Oboe said, plz pay a lil bit more attention to the matching parts weathering. Your last version was pretty nice except the wingroot, where the straight line between the "healthy" fuslage and the bare metal wingroot was unreralistic.
Otherwise, pretty nice skin. Keep going!
 :salute

 :D

that did escape my attention....wont happen again sir :P

Offline SmokinLoon

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Re: P-40 "white #7"
« Reply #44 on: August 28, 2011, 07:51:22 AM »
The P40 is one of those aircraft that if it isnt perfect, it isnt right.   ;)   I too will jump on the "too weathered" bandwagon, but I'm glad to hear Ink is adjusting it a bit.  :lol

I give you skinners a lot of credit.  I started to work with the old M3 and quickly became a bit intimidated.

Thanks for adding another P40 skin!!!   :salute 

[anxiously awaits a white tailed 75 RAAF Squadron skin  :aok ]
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