Author Topic: how close when you pull the trigger?  (Read 1947 times)

Offline BB Gun

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how close when you pull the trigger?
« on: September 20, 2011, 10:55:23 AM »
As a Warbirds vet, I'm having trouble with shooting ranges.  I am used to shooting d2 to d4 in WB which is 600 to 1200 feet.   Yet in AH I am finding that I don't shoot until 400-ish.   Planes simply look small?  When do you all shoot?

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Offline shdo

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Re: how close when you pull the trigger?
« Reply #1 on: September 20, 2011, 11:10:27 AM »
BB,

This was a well known problem between AH and WB.  The visuals are different and to get similar visuals when firing you can use the 'z' key to zoom in.  This will give you a similar aspect ratio/ sight picture to what you had in WB but you will loose a lot of your peripheral vision while zoomed.

when doing BnZ i shoot from d6 to d3 and when TnB i shoot from d4 to d2.  With, my current, crappy stick i have too much dead zone to try and shoot closer.


shdo
« Last Edit: September 20, 2011, 11:12:26 AM by shdo »

Offline ink

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Re: how close when you pull the trigger?
« Reply #2 on: September 20, 2011, 11:43:53 AM »
I have all guns set at 300 convergence and try to shoot at that range....devastating when you hit at convergence  :rock

Offline TequilaChaser

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Re: how close when you pull the trigger?
« Reply #3 on: September 20, 2011, 11:57:04 AM »
also, I don't remember that WB was d2 ( d4 ) as being mesuared in feet, anyways it is not in feet in Aces high, it is mesuared in yards

your convergence is going to be user preference.... some like setting them 200 yrds/ 275 yrds / 300 yrds

I prefer 350 yrds for every plane

now, while doing some practice/work with shane in the DA.... he did relay some logic to me, that I had never considered

when dueling, you and your opponent are most times in so close that it is wize to bring your convergence in to under 300 , preferably around 200 to 250 convg. since you are basically in a knife fight

to where as when you fly in the MA's you would normally not be taking up close crossing shots, and would be better off with your convergence set out just a little further

hope this helps

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Offline PFactorDave

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Re: how close when you pull the trigger?
« Reply #4 on: September 20, 2011, 01:35:42 PM »
I have all guns set at 300 convergence and try to shoot at that range....devastating when you hit at convergence  :rock

^This is my method also

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Offline Butcher

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Re: how close when you pull the trigger?
« Reply #5 on: September 20, 2011, 01:48:54 PM »
^This is my method also

I generally use between 325-350 - basically I fly to ram and snap a shot off, few FSO's ago I had my Hurri-1 converg set to 300 and sawwed off 11 planes with barely any ammo at all, I try to stress its easier to hit a plane at a high deflection shot rather then strictly behind them.
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Offline Klam

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Re: how close when you pull the trigger?
« Reply #6 on: September 20, 2011, 02:06:05 PM »
The way the round will drop over a distace should also be considered.
Am not sure how much but I know the 50cal is one of the better rounds
and the A6m2's 20mm is one of the "not so good ones"..
Using the same gun for while will get you used to it's own characteristics.
If you are in level flight and have set convergence to say, D300.  Then fire at a
target which is D200, the round will land high, if at all.
Ranging the shot can be hard when banked and even harder when pulling G's
I was told to unload the airframe before making the shot...if you can.
I'm a crappy shot anyways but going off line and using the "lead computing gunsight" on the drone
will help you get a mental picture of the correct place to put your pipper
I'm sure a someone will post a better explanation than this

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Offline FLOTSOM

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Re: how close when you pull the trigger?
« Reply #7 on: September 20, 2011, 02:17:44 PM »
 :old: personally i just push the barrel really hard against the flesh, i really dig that back splatter thing that you get when the muzzle blast enters the skull cavaty and pops it from the inside like a..........  :headscratch: :headscratch:

oops, :huh is this executioners weekly digest????? no?!  :O ummmmm nevermind  :bolt:
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Offline VonMessa

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Re: how close when you pull the trigger?
« Reply #8 on: September 20, 2011, 02:29:08 PM »
The way the round will drop over a distace should also be considered.
Am not sure how much but I know the 50cal is one of the better rounds
and the A6m2's 20mm is one of the "not so good ones
"..
Using the same gun for while will get you used to it's own characteristics.
If you are in level flight and have set convergence to say, D300.  Then fire at a
target which is D200, the round will land high, if at all.
Ranging the shot can be hard when banked and even harder when pulling G's
I was told to unload the airframe before making the shot...if you can.
I'm a crappy shot anyways but going off line and using the "lead computing gunsight" on the drone
will help you get a mental picture of the correct place to put your pipper
I'm sure a someone will post a better explanation than this

Klam

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Offline ImADot

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Re: how close when you pull the trigger?
« Reply #9 on: September 20, 2011, 02:33:36 PM »
Please elaborate upon this statement...

I think he's talking about the ballistics characteristics.  Laser-like .50cal versus tennis-ball-like Japanese cannon.


Another thing about convergence and shooting "in range"...

When the enemy icon switches from D800 to D600, he's at D700.  When it moves from D600 to D400, he's at D500.  Etc., etc. So if you have your convergence at 300, wait until the icon changes from D400 to D200 and he'll be at 300 yards.
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Offline ink

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Re: how close when you pull the trigger?
« Reply #10 on: September 20, 2011, 02:34:25 PM »
:old: personally i just push the barrel really hard against the flesh, i really dig that back splatter thing that you get when the muzzle blast enters the skull cavaty and pops it from the inside like a..........  :headscratch: :headscratch:

oops, :huh is this executioners weekly digest????? no?!  :O ummmmm nevermind  :bolt:

 :rofl

Offline morfiend

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Re: how close when you pull the trigger?
« Reply #11 on: September 20, 2011, 02:36:57 PM »
The way the round will drop over a distace should also be considered.
Am not sure how much but I know the 50cal is one of the better rounds
and the A6m2's 20mm is one of the "not so good ones"..
Using the same gun for while will get you used to it's own characteristics.
If you are in level flight and have set convergence to say, D300.  Then fire at a
target which is D200, the round will land high, if at all.
Ranging the shot can be hard when banked and even harder when pulling G's
I was told to unload the airframe before making the shot...if you can.
I'm a crappy shot anyways but going off line and using the "lead computing gunsight" on the drone
will help you get a mental picture of the correct place to put your pipper
I'm sure a someone will post a better explanation than this

Klam
Actually Klam you are mistaken,if you set convergence to 300 and shoot at a target at 200 the rounds will be low,not high! the rounds come up to piper at convergence and never rise above the line of sight.Also the 20mm cannon on the zero may not have the best trajectory but if the rounds hit they do plenty of damage.




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Offline Ack-Ack

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Re: how close when you pull the trigger?
« Reply #12 on: September 20, 2011, 02:53:45 PM »
Even though I have no troubles with shots beyond 600 yards, I tend to hold my fire until the bandit is within 400 or less yards.  At these close ranges not much can survive a single shotgun like burst from a P-38.

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Offline waystin2

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Re: how close when you pull the trigger?
« Reply #13 on: September 20, 2011, 04:26:01 PM »
300 or less.  The closer you get the more satisfying the result! :aok
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Offline Wiley

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Re: how close when you pull the trigger?
« Reply #14 on: September 20, 2011, 04:29:51 PM »
Actually Klam you are mistaken,if you set convergence to 300 and shoot at a target at 200 the rounds will be low,not high! the rounds come up to piper at convergence and never rise above the line of sight.
    :salute

...Are you talking about in the specific instance he's describing, or in general?  If you're talking about in general, rounds can go well above the pipper with certain convergence settings and certain guns.  The easiest one to see it with is the 30mm on the K4.  Set it to 500 convergence.  It will shoot low out to around 100-150 yards, then will rise above LOS, in the 350 range, then drop back down to the pipper at 500.  To combat this, I think my convergence is set around 225-250 on the 30mm.  This makes its arc close enough to on the pipper for me out to about 400, with noticable drop at 500.  Not that I shoot at that range unless it's a nonmaneuvering guy trying to run.

Another thing about convergence and shooting "in range"...

When the enemy icon switches from D800 to D600, he's at D700.  When it moves from D600 to D400, he's at D500.  Etc., etc. So if you have your convergence at 300, wait until the icon changes from D400 to D200 and he'll be at 300 yards.

Just wanted to reinforce this as I was going to mention it as a fairly major difference between here and WBs.  In WBs, when it went from 500 to 400, it meant he'd crossed to within 400 yards.  In here, when it goes from 600 to 400, it means he's crossed the 500 yard line.  It's a bit of a different way of looking at it here.  When I first came over, I expended a lot of ammo at guys whose icons said 600 or 800, not realizing I was shooting 700-900 out.

As to convergence,  on .50 and 20mm equipped planes, I stick with 450 yards as my convergence.  I do most of my shooting inside of that distance, but I like the versatility it gives me.  If someone's not maneuvering at 600 yards I can still put a decent volume of fire on him without trajectory coming into play too much, and if they're pulling away at 400, if I hit them I hit at convergence.  My bullets are a bit diffuse inside that range, but I find it to be good enough.

The one thing I suggest is, try a setting and stick with it for a while (couple weeks at least) so you can give your brain time to get used to the sight picture in different circumstances at that convergence.  IMO one of the worst things you can do for your gunnery is to constantly be fiddling with your convergence.

For guys that aren't maneuvering much trying to run, I use the zoom feature to get right in on top of them.  As soon as they start to wiggle though I return to default FOV.  I find zoom messes with my ability to lead them effectively in a hard maneuver.

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