(Insert "Country" Here) M.o.M Forum?

[Lusche]

You are aware that it's not about capturing bases for everyone all the time?

[Delirium]

The MoM are exactly what we need.

I disagree strongly.

While historically accurate, what fun is it for some guy in a FW190A8 at 30k, barely able to stay level, trying to engage a bomber stream that in bomber numbers alone out number the defenders? Add another 25+ escorts and it is so lopsided (again while historically accurate) that even scenarios don't try and reproduce this carnage?

I'd much rather see spread out strategic targets that small groups can attack, instead of these massive missions.

Where is the fun in that?

I could care less if I see them coming or not, most of the time the big dar bar is a huge red arrow to the pack anyway. The problem is giving the ratio of attackers to defenders tends to be horribly lopsided.

[The Fugitive]

You are aware that it's not about capturing bases for everyone all the time?

No, it's all about combat. Having 15+ buff groups escorted by 15+ fighters at alt isn't combat. It's another horde to roll over what ever they choose to.

If the was a reason to defend...other than the obvious one that would bring the "gamers" out to play then I could see a MoM being something worth while.

On the other hand, 5 missions like Del described with 6 P47s hitting a base and covering each other all the way back to their base while being harassed by a pair of defenders sounds like something you could get to happen often in the MAs. If it's "not always about taking bases" the same 30+ guys in the MoM could instead run 6 missions simultaneously and have 12+ defenders  chasing them around. Instead of having 30+ guys climb for an hour hit an undefended base/depot having "fun" you could have 45 guys having as much if not more quicker duking it out all over the place.. 

[W7LPNRICK]

I was trying to figure out if you guys found another use for Milk-Of-Magnesia.      

[chaser]

I only few in q couple MoM's but both times they went to strat. Idk if I just happen to be on two that went to strats or what but I thought the goal of the MoM was to hit strats, not bases. This was its not a horde rolling over bases.

[thndregg]

Good grief, folks.

Been through it. Posted and participated in all sorts of heavy bomber missions. It has proven to be fun for a lot of folks. There's been a lot of salutes & appreciation expressed from all sides. If there were more of a vital strat system in place, then our target choices would not be as constrained.

I find it very odd, after being absent from the game since last May, that there would be such a surge of dissatisfaction over some event such as this.

I am ultimately NOT a land-grabber type of player in this game. I am interested in recreating a hint of historical flavor & realism (with respect to the game mechanics & playability). That's all I'm after-- just to create a fun fight, drink a few adult beverages, have a few laughs, and enjoy a little comradery from all sides.

If this were such a frowned-upon thing to do, why have lots of players on both sides participated? Why then has HTC done largely nothing in the past decade to curtail such activity?

I think it's fine.

[Delirium]

If there were more of a vital strat system in place, then our target choices would not be as constrained.

I agree utterly and completely with you. Bomber squadrons definitely get the short end of the stick...

I'm still not in favor of massive bomber formations with escort in the MA, never was, never will be. You'll never get anywhere near the defenders to make it challenging, much less finding an organized defense as the formations get attacked by single fighters most of the time.

Not a stab at you, ThundrEgg, I've agreed with you in the past about the bombers groups lack of targets.

[Lusche]

This is just sad.


We have the daily routines of smash&grab, NOE sneak attempts and so on. The tactical air combat prevails, and we read complains on this BBS about this 'landgrabbin mono culture', 'win the war at all costs' mindset, about 'gamey Xbox generation with no clue about WW2 aviation' and so on.

The come Thunderegg and tries to resurrect something that has somewhat fallen into disuse, but was huge fun for literally hundreds of players for long times. A mission that promises to put the "multi" into multi player again, is not disrupting the gameplay in any way, has no ill effect on those not caring to defend against it, but offers a nice change of pace for those looking for it. Something that is closer to a facette of WW2 air battles that is rarely seen in the MA these days.
In fact, the participants in such a raid do "hurt" their country (taking several dozen players out of the landgrab play for 1-2 hours), and as a matter of fact they hurt their scores too. It's totally opposite of everything what's usually bemoaned here in the forum.

I'm almost speechless that Thndr is getting flak for this. If that's the reality of AH 2011, this game has indeed gone south.


If you find it boring to climb up to 25k to intercept the MoM ... then just don't do it. What is the problem with that? They don't sink yer CV, they don't shut down your frontline bases, they most probably don't even have a significant impact on the strats and thus the resupply system. They just don't fight the kind of battle you are interested in. So what?
What about those having fun to fly bombers in formations similar to those we all have seen in movies and on myriad of pictures? What about those having FUN in trying to intercept such bombers, having FUN in trying to set up an attack run on the bombers despite the presence of enemy escorts? Having FUN fighting in the unusual high altitude environment? Oh wait... yes, I forgot... alt monkeys are lame....




Another note on "overwhelming the defenses".  Another point that I can't grasp. Is it really that terrible, if the vile bombers do make it to the target and back? Would it really soo much better / honorable / fun if they get completely wiped out?
I have fought many a time vs the MoM and numerous similar missions over the years. Almost every one of them, even when flying at 25k and above, was badly mauled. Usually only a fraction of bombers makes it back home. Sometimes the whole mission died before reaching the target area.
At one point the escorts are dispersed all over the sky, a few Me 262 start to appear and tear holes in the main formation, and sooner or later the formation starts to erode anyway. Shot down defenders can quickly up a second time to catch the raid on it's return leg, while the attackers are just getting less and less.


As a fighter pilot and buff hunter I want both sides to have fun and I want a more than an only remote chance for the bomber & escort guys to have a successful mission. I'd like to see reaching the target by a sizeable portion of such missions as the norm, not the exception.

[Jayhawk]

I would say the 'flak' is coming from a couple vocal guys who certainly don't represent the majority thought.  The truth is that MoM missions, not to mention just the old Saturday night ThndrEGG missions provided hours of fun for A LOT of players.  I know it's been a while since I played, but I can assure you, not all missions were overwhelming odds in favor of the bombers.  Some nights you would spent 8 sectors fighting off constant attacks, with only 1 or 2 bombers limping it's way home.  Sometimes you wouldn't even make it to target!

[caldera]

As an avowed buff hunter, I'd like to submit a request that your escort fighters be something other than P-51Ds this time.
Something more like a P-40C would be more fun for all involved!   

[Delirium]

Almost every one of them, even when flying at 25k and above, was badly mauled.

I haven't seen that... either way, have with it.

I'm not agreeing with you Lusche, I'm just ducking out because I don't want this thread to turn ugly.

[infowars]

!! great post Snailman !!  +1

Shut up whiners...  Let's MoM

[Trukk]

This is just sad....

Well said.
S!

[thndregg]

I agree utterly and completely with you. Bomber squadrons definitely get the short end of the stick...

I'm still not in favor of massive bomber formations with escort in the MA, never was, never will be. You'll never get anywhere near the defenders to make it challenging, much less finding an organized defense as the formations get attacked by single fighters most of the time.

Not a stab at you, ThundrEgg, I've agreed with you in the past about the bombers groups lack of targets.

No problem, Del. Difference of opinion is another facet of this game. It's just easy for things to get blown out of proportion over the likes of the internet. We just have to keep ourselves in check.

[Daddkev]

  Makem over medium.