Author Topic: Allied CiC After Action Review  (Read 1728 times)

Offline Stellaris

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Allied CiC After Action Review
« on: March 10, 2012, 04:21:41 AM »
For those who don't know me, I'm Paul, callsign Stellar, OpsO for Claimjumpers, though mostly inactive this year in FSO since I'm in the UK and FSO starts at 4AM here.  However for our CiC turn Kurt asked me to put together the plan and lead the mission, so I did.  This is my first time out as FSO CiC and side planner.

For this frame, 8th USAAF had four assigned objectives, at Bremen, Hannover, Stuttgart and Schweinfurt.  Each objective had 3 strategic targets and a base, and our tasks were to get them destroyed and bring all our planes home.  The operational area was fairly covered by enemy radar, restricting our options if we wanted an unexpected approach, and the enemy could be expected to mount patrols in the dead zones.  This in turn suggested we'd face a running battle into target, unless we could mislead the enemy.  The layout also suggested mounting two co-ordinated strikes, one in the north on Bremen and Hannover, one to the south on Stuttgart and Schweinfurt, deploying my fighters to protect the incoming bomber group as a whole, rather than close-escorting them.  The fighters would be deployed as an advance guard squadron ahead of the main group, with the other squadrons arranged ahead, in trail, and to left and right of the bomber group.  The routing meant that the whole group would overfly two objective areas, though adhering to the requirement that each target in each area be a specific, primary target for a single strike group. This approach also allowed me to unleash an independent fighter squadron as intruders, with the intent of triggering the radar and drawing the enemy out of position.This being my first FSO, I wasn't entirely sure if this degree of co-ordination would be legal (the rules are a little vague for the specific target arrangement and plan here), so I briefed the concept to Shifty, the scenario designer, who said it was good to go and rather clever :)   We were, it must be said, still spread very thin and vulnerable over the target areas, but before and after we were tight and well protected.  The only other major decision was whether to go in high, low or inbetween,  but really the best option was high, as it would make it harder for driven-down fighters to re-engage us.  I assigned B24s for the southern strike, as their higher speed would make it possible to make their required ToTs over the longer distance to be covered there, and B17 to the northern strike, which nicely met the aircraft requirements.  I never fly bombers in the MA, so I had to run a few missions to get a feel for the times, speeds and target effects on the ground - an education to be sure.  UncleKurt gave me tremendous support in flying the photo-recon missions so I could make target assignments at the individual aircraft level.  We had no specific mix of P47 and P38 to meet, so I left the choice of ride to the discretion of the fighter squadron commanders.  

I then did up a NATO standard operational plan (somewhat abbreviated).  I'm a ground forces guy and make no pretense of being up on air-ops planning factors.  If you haven't previously worked with military orders format you might find them of interest.  

http://paulchafe.com/fso/opavalanche.doc

On the other hand, if you're a military pilot - move along - nothing to see here!

I also did individual target plans for the northern strike, broken down plane by plane, based on Kurt's recce flights - we just ran out of time to do them for the southern group as well.  They were quite useful, and can be seen here...

http://paulchafe.com/fso/alphastrikenorthtargets.doc

http://paulchafe.com/fso/bravostrikenorthtargets.doc

The mission itself was straightforward.  I controlled the northern strike, and tasked Branch37 of VF-17 to command the overall southern strike, with LCA flying the other bomber squadron.  In the north we formed up and flew our routes over the ocean and around the north end of the radar to come down almost due south over our targets.  The formation wasn't bad, although my dream of an airshow-tight wingtip-to-wingtip bomber formation didn't materialize.   The AK's were our intruder group, coming in to the southwest, and successfully made contact and lured away at least a squadron of enemy fighters.  However, inevitably more enemy were waiting over the target (they knew, after all, that we were coming).  Contact calls from VMF 101 (our advance guard) came in ahead of us, and I ordered the trail escorts (132nd and Air Raiders) forward to support them.  In retrospect, I should have done this early, since once we were running in to target the odds of being bounced from behind were drastically outweighed by the certainty of a contact in front.  The left and right wing escorts (49th and 353rd) were tasked to close protection to keep the fighters off us as we dropped. I learned at this point it is impossible to monitor the air situation, man the tail gun and conduct a bomb run all at the same time - especially because, as mentioned, I never fly bombers, so turret gunnery is a black art to me.  I lost a drone to a 109, but my bombs were decently on target, and as the reports came back from the rest of the Claimjumpers it seemed we'd had a good run.  I gave the order to regroup, and passed navigation control to G3-MF for their attack, just in time to lose my remaining two planes.  I hopped back into the battle as a gunner for N1KDog, managing to down a 110, so I guess I can turret gun to some degree.  G3MF also had a good run, we regrouped quite well, and exited the battle without further drama.  Reports from the southern strike group were also positive, and the early results are on par with Frame 1.

Lessons learned (or at least experienced!) for future commanders

1)  Backbriefs.  Slipknot of G3-MF gave me an excellent backbrief (ie, a summary of his understanding of my plan, and an outline of the plan he'd done up to cover his part of it.  This is standard military practice (and Slippie is an ex-marine) but not (in my limited experience) FSO practice.  This was invaluable in co-ordinating our actions, and identified the fact that I'd set up the airbase bomb plan wrong (I targeted the VH and FH incorrectly - did I mention I never do any bombing?).  Next time I'll specifically ask for backbriefs and outline plans returned in orders.

2)  Voice procedure.  I briefed basic callsign use in orders, but thought it was probably expecting too much as most AH pilots aren't trained to use it.  However G3 and AK (and maybe others, I wasn't keeping track) did use it, and it really aided clarity.  The value of fixed callsigns, and simply opening a communication with the person you're calling and your own callsign is invaluable. Next time I'm going to brief some basic brevity codes as well.  I'll also sharpen up my own VP, which was sloppier than my professional pride is comfy with.

3)  Organization.  The best plan is no good if everyone doesn't know where they fit in it.  This is an issue for FSO, as it's difficult to know for sure who is coming until they show up.  My own standard is to set up flights of 4 as AH missions, and then assign slot positions (Lead, left wing, right wing and trail for the bombers) based on whether you're first, second, third or fourth on the mission roster.  I set up all the bomber flights this way prior to mission start, and this was reflected in the target plans.  It seemed to work OK, but I didn't feel warm and fuzzy that all the targets were properly covered, because I had no feedback that everyone understood how it was supposed to work.  Backbriefs and an established SOP within our squad (CJs) would solve this - and I think to better target scores, though the mission recording will tell the tale for sure.

I also set up the fighter squadrons, but most of the COs preferred to set up their own, so next time I'll skip this step.

4)  Last, I got MANY compliments on the thoroughness of the orders, which is really just about using the NATO standard format to guide my thinking and getting it all in there.  This definitely paid dividends in terms of making sure that squadrons were they were supposed to be, when they were supposed to be.  Its a bit more effort to set these up, but well worth it.

Last, I'd like to thank all the squads for their support and participation.  It was a good frame, well worth the effort, an excellent experience and rare opportunity to lead some 200 aircraft on a mission like this.  Any help I can offer anyone looking to do this in future is yours for the asking.

Cheers!

Paul

« Last Edit: March 10, 2012, 04:53:24 AM by Stellaris »

Offline AKP

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Re: Allied CiC After Action Review
« Reply #1 on: March 10, 2012, 06:16:23 AM »
Was a pleasure to fly with you and your squad sir <S>... 

Was an outstanding set of orders... hats off to you and your team.  Given the number of planes flying in such close proximity to each other...  I was amazed at how little radio chatter there was, and at how well it all came together.

Very... very well done.

 :salute

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Offline SlipKnt

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Re: Allied CiC After Action Review
« Reply #2 on: March 10, 2012, 09:01:58 AM »
Was a pleasure to fly with you and your squad sir <S>... 

Was an outstanding set of orders... hats off to you and your team.  Given the number of planes flying in such close proximity to each other...  I was amazed at how little radio chatter there was, and at how well it all came together.

Very... very well done.

 :salute

Ditto what AKP said! 

Also, a well written AAR.  Seems like we got the full experience this week.  Enjoy your tour overseas and hope to get you back soon so you can be back on a "FSO Schedule".   :neener:

We'd fly with you guys anytime.

 :salute
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Offline Bannor

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Re: Allied CiC After Action Review
« Reply #3 on: March 10, 2012, 09:43:36 AM »
It sounds like you had a very well written  set of orders sir, well done. :salute
However, FATE was one of the squads assigned to defend A137 and the surrounding factories, and all that came in were a few P38's that I would assume were to sweep and bring down the cap. After they were dealt with we waited until T60 for the main group that never materialized. I'm thinking they hit the wrong target last night. My squad was coming back into 10.5 sector when I saw several formations to the west of me heading south. Oops! :bolt:
 We ended up going north east to find some action. I saw a dot and chased it down discovering it to be a P47. He was totaly unaware of me as I pulled up from 600 behind and opened fire. Not a very good first burst, but as he tried to evade I blasted his right wing that I thought would have blown apart from my cannons from my 109G2, but alas, it did not and I went past him and now he was on my six. Thanx to my Squaddie Pounder and  to Shifty I was able to live about 8 min. longer but in the end a few P38's that joined the fray put the smackdown on me.

<<S>> sirs I had fun! :salute
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Offline SlipKnt

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Re: Allied CiC After Action Review
« Reply #4 on: March 10, 2012, 10:44:26 AM »
It sounds like you had a very well written  set of orders sir, well done. :salute
However, FATE was one of the squads assigned to defend A137 and the surrounding factories, and all that came in were a few P38's that I would assume were to sweep and bring down the cap. After they were dealt with we waited until T60 for the main group that never materialized. I'm thinking they hit the wrong target last night.

You are right.  I just checked the logs and it appears Allied hit A51 and V82 in the south.  A137 and V82 is what was written in the orders and objectives.

 :o
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Offline Shifty

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Re: Allied CiC After Action Review
« Reply #5 on: March 10, 2012, 11:55:16 AM »
You are right.  I just checked the logs and it appears Allied hit A51 and V82 in the south.  A137 and V82 is what was written in the orders and objectives.

 :o

This is correct, targets destroyed at A51 will not be scored for this frame.

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Offline Shifty

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Re: Allied CiC After Action Review
« Reply #6 on: March 10, 2012, 12:15:12 PM »
For those who don't know me, I'm Paul, callsign Stellar, OpsO for Claimjumpers, though mostly inactive this year in FSO since I'm in the UK and FSO starts at 4AM here.  However for our CiC turn Kurt asked me to put together the plan and lead the mission, so I did.  This is my first time out as FSO CiC and side planner.

For this frame, 8th USAAF had four assigned objectives, at Bremen, Hannover, Stuttgart and Schweinfurt.  Each objective had 3 strategic targets and a base, and our tasks were to get them destroyed and bring all our planes home.  The operational area was fairly covered by enemy radar, restricting our options if we wanted an unexpected approach, and the enemy could be expected to mount patrols in the dead zones.  This in turn suggested we'd face a running battle into target, unless we could mislead the enemy.  The layout also suggested mounting two co-ordinated strikes, one in the north on Bremen and Hannover, one to the south on Stuttgart and Schweinfurt, deploying my fighters to protect the incoming bomber group as a whole, rather than close-escorting them.  The fighters would be deployed as an advance guard squadron ahead of the main group, with the other squadrons arranged ahead, in trail, and to left and right of the bomber group.  The routing meant that the whole group would overfly two objective areas, though adhering to the requirement that each target in each area be a specific, primary target for a single strike group. This approach also allowed me to unleash an independent fighter squadron as intruders, with the intent of triggering the radar and drawing the enemy out of position.This being my first FSO, I wasn't entirely sure if this degree of co-ordination would be legal (the rules are a little vague for the specific target arrangement and plan here), so I briefed the concept to Shifty, the scenario designer, who said it was good to go and rather clever :)   We were, it must be said, still spread very thin and vulnerable over the target areas, but before and after we were tight and well protected.  The only other major decision was whether to go in high, low or inbetween,  but really the best option was high, as it would make it harder for driven-down fighters to re-engage us.  I assigned B24s for the southern strike, as their higher speed would make it possible to make their required ToTs over the longer distance to be covered there, and B17 to the northern strike, which nicely met the aircraft requirements.  I never fly bombers in the MA, so I had to run a few missions to get a feel for the times, speeds and target effects on the ground - an education to be sure.  UncleKurt gave me tremendous support in flying the photo-recon missions so I could make target assignments at the individual aircraft level.  We had no specific mix of P47 and P38 to meet, so I left the choice of ride to the discretion of the fighter squadron commanders.  

I then did up a NATO standard operational plan (somewhat abbreviated).  I'm a ground forces guy and make no pretense of being up on air-ops planning factors.  If you haven't previously worked with military orders format you might find them of interest.  

http://paulchafe.com/fso/opavalanche.doc

On the other hand, if you're a military pilot - move along - nothing to see here!

I also did individual target plans for the northern strike, broken down plane by plane, based on Kurt's recce flights - we just ran out of time to do them for the southern group as well.  They were quite useful, and can be seen here...

http://paulchafe.com/fso/alphastrikenorthtargets.doc

http://paulchafe.com/fso/bravostrikenorthtargets.doc

The mission itself was straightforward.  I controlled the northern strike, and tasked Branch37 of VF-17 to command the overall southern strike, with LCA flying the other bomber squadron.  In the north we formed up and flew our routes over the ocean and around the north end of the radar to come down almost due south over our targets.  The formation wasn't bad, although my dream of an airshow-tight wingtip-to-wingtip bomber formation didn't materialize.   The AK's were our intruder group, coming in to the southwest, and successfully made contact and lured away at least a squadron of enemy fighters.  However, inevitably more enemy were waiting over the target (they knew, after all, that we were coming).  Contact calls from VMF 101 (our advance guard) came in ahead of us, and I ordered the trail escorts (132nd and Air Raiders) forward to support them.  In retrospect, I should have done this early, since once we were running in to target the odds of being bounced from behind were drastically outweighed by the certainty of a contact in front.  The left and right wing escorts (49th and 353rd) were tasked to close protection to keep the fighters off us as we dropped. I learned at this point it is impossible to monitor the air situation, man the tail gun and conduct a bomb run all at the same time - especially because, as mentioned, I never fly bombers, so turret gunnery is a black art to me.  I lost a drone to a 109, but my bombs were decently on target, and as the reports came back from the rest of the Claimjumpers it seemed we'd had a good run.  I gave the order to regroup, and passed navigation control to G3-MF for their attack, just in time to lose my remaining two planes.  I hopped back into the battle as a gunner for N1KDog, managing to down a 110, so I guess I can turret gun to some degree.  G3MF also had a good run, we regrouped quite well, and exited the battle without further drama.  Reports from the southern strike group were also positive, and the early results are on par with Frame 1.

Lessons learned (or at least experienced!) for future commanders

1)  Backbriefs.  Slipknot of G3-MF gave me an excellent backbrief (ie, a summary of his understanding of my plan, and an outline of the plan he'd done up to cover his part of it.  This is standard military practice (and Slippie is an ex-marine) but not (in my limited experience) FSO practice.  This was invaluable in co-ordinating our actions, and identified the fact that I'd set up the airbase bomb plan wrong (I targeted the VH and FH incorrectly - did I mention I never do any bombing?).  Next time I'll specifically ask for backbriefs and outline plans returned in orders.

2)  Voice procedure.  I briefed basic callsign use in orders, but thought it was probably expecting too much as most AH pilots aren't trained to use it.  However G3 and AK (and maybe others, I wasn't keeping track) did use it, and it really aided clarity.  The value of fixed callsigns, and simply opening a communication with the person you're calling and your own callsign is invaluable. Next time I'm going to brief some basic brevity codes as well.  I'll also sharpen up my own VP, which was sloppier than my professional pride is comfy with.

3)  Organization.  The best plan is no good if everyone doesn't know where they fit in it.  This is an issue for FSO, as it's difficult to know for sure who is coming until they show up.  My own standard is to set up flights of 4 as AH missions, and then assign slot positions (Lead, left wing, right wing and trail for the bombers) based on whether you're first, second, third or fourth on the mission roster.  I set up all the bomber flights this way prior to mission start, and this was reflected in the target plans.  It seemed to work OK, but I didn't feel warm and fuzzy that all the targets were properly covered, because I had no feedback that everyone understood how it was supposed to work.  Backbriefs and an established SOP within our squad (CJs) would solve this - and I think to better target scores, though the mission recording will tell the tale for sure.

I also set up the fighter squadrons, but most of the COs preferred to set up their own, so next time I'll skip this step.

4)  Last, I got MANY compliments on the thoroughness of the orders, which is really just about using the NATO standard format to guide my thinking and getting it all in there.  This definitely paid dividends in terms of making sure that squadrons were they were supposed to be, when they were supposed to be.  Its a bit more effort to set these up, but well worth it.

Last, I'd like to thank all the squads for their support and participation.  It was a good frame, well worth the effort, an excellent experience and rare opportunity to lead some 200 aircraft on a mission like this.  Any help I can offer anyone looking to do this in future is yours for the asking.

Cheers!

Paul



Actually I was under the impression you were spliting the two forces into four once in German airspace with each proceeding to their individual targets. Two large groups over flying the same target together is not adhering to the to the requirement that each target in each area be a specific, primary target for an individual single strike group. Even if only one is actually attacking the target it is still basically hoarding. Also I don't recall telling you that you were clever. I didn't see your final orders. I don't read the orders sent out out by the side I'm flying opposite of because in my book that would be a conflict of interest. Had I been able to actually read your orders I would have advised you that this tactic was a violation of FSO standards and had you change them.
« Last Edit: March 10, 2012, 12:17:24 PM by Shifty »

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Offline UncleKurt

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Re: Allied CiC After Action Review
« Reply #7 on: March 10, 2012, 12:41:15 PM »
In short, the map has the label “Stuttgart” positioned a sector south of A137. The label depicts the A51 (9,4,4) base as Stuttgart. The actual location is A137 (10,5,5). When Branch37 asked about it at launch, I saw “Stuttgart” by A51 and confirmed (by comm on V122) that was Stuttgart (A51 incorrectly). I messed up and should have followed the printed material that had the correct grids.  A51 got hit, A137 did not. (Flashing A51 was actually the diversion). The route traced on the map was correct but the incorrect positioning of the Stuttgart label threw us off in all the rush of launching. Please accept this apology. This is one we can certainly learn from.  :salute
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Offline Shifty

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Re: Allied CiC After Action Review
« Reply #8 on: March 10, 2012, 12:48:03 PM »
In short, the map has the label “Stuttgart” positioned a sector south of A137. The label depicts the A51 (9,4,4) base as Stuttgart. The actual location is A137 (10,5,5). When Branch37 asked about it at launch, I saw “Stuttgart” by A51 and confirmed (by comm on V122) that was Stuttgart (A51 incorrectly). I messed up and should have followed the printed material that had the correct grids.  A51 got hit, A137 did not. (Flashing A51 was actually the diversion). The route traced on the map was correct but the incorrect positioning of the Stuttgart label threw us off in all the rush of launching. Please accept this apology. This is one we can certainly learn from.  :salute

Prob won't be the last time it happens. Honest mistake. The Map Grid position for targets will always be included in the Objectives. In the heat of cyber battle weird things happen. I saw a guy accidently bailout last night because he was typing position reports on the enemy. I recall doing the same thing myself once.

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Offline SIK1

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Re: Allied CiC After Action Review
« Reply #9 on: March 10, 2012, 01:27:42 PM »
It happened in the real deal. Shouldn't be surprised when it happens here.

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Offline SlipKnt

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Re: Allied CiC After Action Review
« Reply #10 on: March 10, 2012, 03:00:24 PM »
Needless to say, last night was a great mission.  It was planned down to the gritty detail and everyone carried the orders out rather well.  Also, the AAR was a really good reflection of the events, from planning to execution.  Fog of War certainly played a part as well as in flight communication and organization. 

I understand the NATO airstrike planning and also understand that last night's mission was carried out as it actually happened in WWII. 

Honestly, I didn't think we were going to punch through but somehow, my bombs found their targets. 

I am sure that if there is a violation, it is an honest mistake.  When I first saw the orders, that is the very question I raised.  It was communicated to me that this was already communicated to the CM and designer if I recall correctly.  This being said, we carried out our orders as designed.  No intentional bending or rules or violations occured that I saw.  All things that happened were addressed up front to ensure we were not in violation.  I can definately vouch for UnclKurt and Stellar that they had nothing but the best of intensions to make for a pleasant and realistic experience for all.

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Offline Reschke

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Re: Allied CiC After Action Review
« Reply #11 on: March 10, 2012, 03:16:08 PM »
Bannor sounds like we should have been flying into your guys defensive network and that would actually account for why we only had 6 escorts when we were going into what we thought was the target area. Oh well we had a boring flight and only accounted for one bad guy fighter getting shot down and we lost just a couple of drones to making turns that were too tight.
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Offline Bannor

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Re: Allied CiC After Action Review
« Reply #12 on: March 10, 2012, 03:48:49 PM »
No worries. We all had a good time. See ya next week! :rock
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Offline Stellaris

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Re: Allied CiC After Action Review
« Reply #13 on: March 10, 2012, 04:47:25 PM »
The best laid plans of mice and men go aft aglay!

For the record the plan WAS approved, by Shifty (scenario designer) in concept and Warloc (FSO team lead) in detail.

That said, it was approved first through miscommunication and second because the issue was caught too late to make changes.  Now that I understand the parameters better, I'll do something else next time.

Also for the record, Shifty is correct and did not say it was "clever," but "a good idea."  My apologies, Shifty, for the misquote.

Mea culpa also for the wrong base bombing.  This also goes to the importance of early backbriefs, which would have caught this error.

Please be kind to the new guy!

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Offline oakranger

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Re: Allied CiC After Action Review
« Reply #14 on: March 10, 2012, 05:36:51 PM »
Might want to let everybody know where the no-fly zone line is.  I had two 110s fighting me until I had to break off do to 6 min of fuel.  They chase me pass the 6 line into the no- fly zone, north of v100.  After landed at A40 to refuel I headed west when a 109 jumped me right at the 7 line.  Fighting to get away the annoying Luftwaffe kept attacking me follow by four other 109s to help him out.  It was a good fight but not sure if they ignor the no-fly zone or not.
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