PTAB

[danny76]

IL2's should have the option for PTAB bomblets. Sturmoviks carried 4 containers with 48 in each. Thoroughly selfish of me because my GV bombing is cack, But as well as anti GV I would like to see the "original JP233" against field ack and carriers

[Rich52]

You'll never see it. The IL2 has been slowly gelded and the game has gone largely GV. PTABs, if modeled correctly, would cause no end of whining. Let me see, 1, no F3, 2 now in fighter hangars, 3 NS-37 AP has less hitting power. After all this I doubt they will allow us to chuck 200 PTABs out the bomb bay.

Oh, and #4 they changed the distance you can even see the GV.

[Lusche]

Let me see, 1, no F3, 2 now in fighter hangars, 3 NS-37 AP has less hitting power.

No change has been applied to the NS-37

[lyric1]

No change has been applied to the NS-37

http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/index.php/topic,274113.0.html

[Wmaker]

Yep, they got unsynced which didn't affect their accuracy too much IMO. What Lusche probably meant that their hitting power hasn't seen any chances which Rich52 claimed.

[Lusche]

http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/index.php/topic,274113.0.html

But that was 3 years ago and didn't affect the killing capability with the NS-37 at all. The "hitting power" is still the same.

[lyric1]

But that was 3 years ago and didn't affect the killing capability with the NS-37 at all. The "hitting power" is still the same.

Well since you want to get specific now then no. 

[Tilt]

+1

It was the combination of the IL2m3 and the PTAB that made it such a deadly air borne threat to ground armour from mid 43 onwards not modelling it is like not giving the Spit Hispanos IMO.......................... .

[Butcher]

You'll never see it. The IL2 has been slowly gelded and the game has gone largely GV. PTABs, if modeled correctly, would cause no end of whining. Let me see, 1, no F3, 2 now in fighter hangars, 3 NS-37 AP has less hitting power. After all this I doubt they will allow us to chuck 200 PTABs out the bomb bay.

Oh, and #4 they changed the distance you can even see the GV.

The F3 mode was for a reason, I don't see real pilots using F3 mode to spot ground vehicles secondly people were using Il2s for base defense in F3 mode while in attack mode - which is strictly for bombers.

NS-37 is simply not sync'ed - does not mean the killing power was reduced what so ever, a decent IL-2 pilot can score easily 5 GV kills with little skill.

[Dover]

The F3 mode was for a reason, I don't see real pilots using F3 mode to spot ground vehicles secondly people were using Il2s for base defense in F3 mode while in attack mode - which is strictly for bombers.

NS-37 is simply not sync'ed - does not mean the killing power was reduced what so ever, a decent IL-2 pilot can score easily 5 GV kills with little skill.

F3 is great while trying to spot GV"s though
now in a IL2 i don't know if its right cuase i believe the f3 was to simulate the fact that in bombers you have more than one set of eyes viewing all angles of the sky

[Rich52]

"Rich" used to fly the IL2 exclusivey, and only against GVs unless some fighter pilot was stupid enough to get in front of me. And you had to be pretty bad even with F3 to get kilt by an IL2. In fact you had to be pathetic. There was only one IL2 jock who used the thing as a fighter, "we all know who", and even with him you had to be either pretty bad, or pretty dumb, to get shot down. The A-20 is faster, climbs better, rolls better, probably turns better, and has a better gun package against fighters then the IL2, but still this "IL2 vs fighters" myth continues. The truth is the GV'ers didnt like getting killed by a tank killer aircraft that actually killed tanks in WW2.

And there were only a few of us tank specialists in IL2s and mobs of Tankers who thought they should get a pass. So thats why a plane with a bomb door/rear gunner is in the FH with no F3, thats why it doesnt hit as hard with its NS-37s "I dont care what anyone says", and thats why its on its way to being a semi-Hangar Queen, "we'll call it a Princess".

Tell me you never used F3 to spot GVs and I'll just laugh at you. BTW Butcher the last 4 tours youv gotten 13 IL2 kills, and I didnt even check what you killed. So I guess your talking about somone else.

The F3 mode was for a reason, I don't see real pilots using F3 mode to spot ground vehicles secondly people were using Il2s for base defense in F3 mode while in attack mode - which is strictly for bombers.

NS-37 is simply not sync'ed - does not mean the killing power was reduced what so ever, a decent IL-2 pilot can score easily 5 GV kills with little skill.

[Fish42]

And you had to be pretty bad even with F3 to get kilt by an IL2. In fact you had to be pathetic. There was only one IL2 jock who used the thing as a fighter, "we all know who", and even with him you had to be either pretty bad, or pretty dumb, to get shot down. The A-20 is faster, climbs better, rolls better, probably turns better, and has a better gun package against fighters then the IL2, but still this "IL2 vs fighters" myth continues.

Never really flew her without F3, but I never had to much of a problem dogfighting with the Il2. The 37s have great balistics and it will turn inside most fighters for 2 or 3 turns while it holds some E.

http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/newscores/killsin.php?playername=Fish42&kcnt=110&selectTour=LWTour144&pindex=50
http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/newscores/killsin.php?playername=Fish42&kcnt=72&selectTour=LWTour145&pindex=50

[Butcher]

Tell me you never used F3 to spot GVs and I'll just laugh at you. BTW Butcher the last 4 tours youv gotten 13 IL2 kills, and I didnt even check what you killed. So I guess your talking about somone else.

As a tanker Rich, I really don't use Il-2s unless the Vehicle Hanger is down - if you check the previous 15 tours...you'd notice I have the same pattern.

Here are my kills when the VH is down:
147:
Il-2   10   0   0   2

Tour 146: no GV kills from the air

Tour 145: 1 kill in an Il-2

Tour 144:
A-20G   4   5   0   0
Il-2   2   4   2   2

143:
Il-2   2   5   0   1
A-20G   3   15   1   1

Last tour I flew with a series number was 144:
A-20G   48   21   3   7
Il-2   22   8   0   7
Panther G   878   31   12   28

[bustr]

You are discovering the short comings of the NS-37.

48mm/400m/60 degrees

Not many of you have ever upped an IL2 offline and tried to kill tanks from the same shallow angles you attack them online. The best attack angle is about 30 degrees from 400 yards down into the engine compartment.

The IL2 killed most heavy tanks using bombs. The NS-37 was best effective against lighter ground vehicals and equipment. The PTAB coupled with our style of game play would render GV's almost obsolete as a game play option. HTC could be mean and limit each bomb bay to 4 so it would be limited to good dive bombing skill and not simple carpet bomb gameiness. And we all know we would get as stinkingly gamey as possible with full loads of PTAB if HTC set no limitations.

In the game we attack tanks from too shallow an angle because we now spend much of our time hiding from potential wirbels and the tank driver sitting in "commander" mode waiting to blow us out of the air with a single main gun shot. Dry erase dots on the monitor anyone. We used to be able to attack from a high angle becasue we could see the icons out to 3k. This allowed us to concentrate rounds down into the engine compartment with it's very thin armor covering.

Now we are shooting at angles too flat into armor the 37mm AP was not desinged to penetrate. Nothing has happened to the 37mm AP rounds. Our game play was changed for us where it comes to attacking GV. We now attack at real world angle of attacks becasue we have semi real world visual limitations that made dropping bombs on tanks the primary method for IL2 to kill them. We get slaughtered in our IL2's at about the same rates the russians did attacking GV's and guns shooting back at them.

As for furballing in the IL2. There was a reason the rear gunner was incorperated in WW2. Then the germans changed to attacking them from underneath. Where possible they got fighter escorts and still they lost a boat load of them.

[Lusche]

Now we are shooting at angles too flat into armor the 37mm AP was not desinged to penetrate. Nothing has happened to the 37mm AP rounds. Our game play was changed for us where it comes to attacking GV. We now attack at real world angle of attacks becasue we have semi real world visual limitations that made dropping bombs on tanks the primary method for IL2 to kill them. We get slaughtered in our IL2's at about the same rates the russians did attacking GV's and guns shooting back at them.

Has the reduced icon range really such a big impact? Not on finding the tanks but on the way thy are attacked? I mean, bombing them had always been the #1 way to kill them in planes, and I find myself using the same angles in my Hurri D as before. It didn't take long to adjust for the short icon ranges. It's just more difficult to find them in the first place, particularly when they have cover with engine shut down. But I like that, much fun!