Lusches AH Stats Megathread

[Shuffler]

I have seen groups take of that are tasked with nothing but hunting goons.

[Bruv119]

Goons have become an endangered species:

(Image removed from quote.)

In the last three tours, only about 12% of all recorded base captures had been made by C-47.

some of this can be explained by the amount of GV spawns on the maps we are using.  Mindano used to be great because people HAD to fly goons to most bases.   Small maps would also reduce the chances of getting in un-detected.   

[bozon]

m3s have a much larger chance to reach the city and deliver the troops.

1) goon is detected 6k away, 3.5k if flying really low, but then a low dot is immediately suspected as a goon. m3 has very short icon range and is indistiguishable from a whirbl. Who wants to fly within 800 yards to see the ID tag?

2) goon has to drop the troops from 800+ feet. While they float down, they alert every GV and plane in the area. M3 can drive undetected all the way to the flag. While doing so, it is invisible to planes and defending GVs often have a broken line of sight to the M3 and its troops.

3) Goon has a long flight time from the nearest base that had not had its troops disabled. The distance to the M3 origin base is irrelevant - only the distace of the spawn to the town matters. The base can be 2 sectors away, or 10 miles away, but the GVs will spawn at a similar distance from the target town.

4) m3 typically has a shorter drive time to destination than goon flight time to destination. This means m3 will get killed and spawn repeatedly untill the defenders run out of ammo and have to land. When the defenders kill the c47 it is usually AFTER it wasted his long flying time.

5) good is totally defenseles when spotted. m3 can drive into indestructibles and wait to be resqued.

Is it any surprise that goons are not used when m3s are available?

[Lusche]

Is it any surprise that goons are not used when m3s are available?

No. 

[Devil 505]

m3s have a much larger chance to reach the city and deliver the troops.

1) goon is detected 6k away, 3.5k if flying really low, but then a low dot is immediately suspected as a goon. m3 has very short icon range and is indistiguishable from a whirbl. Who wants to fly within 800 yards to see the ID tag?

2) goon has to drop the troops from 800+ feet. While they float down, they alert every GV and plane in the area. M3 can drive undetected all the way to the flag. While doing so, it is invisible to planes and defending GVs often have a broken line of sight to the M3 and its troops.

3) Goon has a long flight time from the nearest base that had not had its troops disabled. The distance to the M3 origin base is irrelevant - only the distace of the spawn to the town matters. The base can be 2 sectors away, or 10 miles away, but the GVs will spawn at a similar distance from the target town.

4) m3 typically has a shorter drive time to destination than goon flight time to destination. This means m3 will get killed and spawn repeatedly untill the defenders run out of ammo and have to land. When the defenders kill the c47 it is usually AFTER it wasted his long flying time.

5) good is totally defenseles when spotted. m3 can drive into indestructibles and wait to be resqued.

Is it any surprise that goons are not used when m3s are available?

Not a surprise, but it's not a good thing for the game either.

[scott66]

I guess the next thing you know people will be screaming for the  m3 to be perked appears to be the most hated GV in the game.. It's the one that will resup strats and town too fast and now cause it brings the troops 

[Devil 505]

I guess the next thing you know people will be screaming for the cause m3 to be perked appears to be the most hated GV in the game.. It's the one that will resup strats and town too fast and now cause it brings the troops : noise

Perking would be bad, but perhaps applying aircraft icon rules to it would help balance out it's uber stealth. (same for Wirbelwinds too)

[caldera]

Perking would be bad, but perhaps applying aircraft icon rules to it would help balance out it's uber stealth. (same for Wirbelwinds too)

Or bringing back 1.5k icons for FLAKs and M-3s.  Different icon ranges is not without precedent, now that we have the Storch.

[scott66]

Or bringing back 1.5k icons for FLAKs and M-3s.  Different icon ranges is not without precedent, now that we have the Storch.

agreed

[Becinhu]

The icon range is way too short on gvs you can't even see a tank parked on the road in town until you are within 1000 ft. So if it's a AAA unit you have just given him a free shot while you circle around. The short icon range also creates the issue of instead of upping to defend a base people now just mass spawn m3s to keep the ack up so the three individuals trying to defend can just circle in ack that never dies.


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[SPKmes]

Perking would be bad, but perhaps applying aircraft icon rules to it would help balance out it's uber stealth. (same for Wirbelwinds too)

Yes....
Especially wirbs....seems to be a thing these days to camp under a furball with engine off
 M3's not so much but there should be some compensation for strafing an open topped vehicle carrying troops...troops are invincible when in a M3 compared to a goon which if your glare at it on a flyby the wings fall off

[The Fugitive]

Maybe its due to me running 2048 textures and having anti-allison off but I can circle a field at 5K and pick out the tanks on and around the field. No icons, no firing, just the shapes. I cant tell which is which but I dont need to get THAT close to hit them with a 1k lber   

[Devil 505]

Maybe its due to me running 2048 textures and having anti-allison off but I can circle a field at 5K and pick out the tanks on and around the field. No icons, no firing, just the shapes. I cant tell which is which but I dont need to get THAT close to hit them with a 1k lber   

I'm sure Allison is grateful you turned this off. 

[Lusche]

This is the combat data for all 'ground combat vehicles' (=tanks+tank destroyers+m8). It shows how well they were doing against each other, kills & deaths against other GV (M3, Wirbel and so on) or planes were not counted. Just all 'tank' combat.



1-Jagdpanther
2-Jagdpanzer 38 (t)
3-Jagdpanzer IV/70
4-M-18
5-M-8
6-M4A3(75)
7-M4A3(76)W
8-Panther G
9-Panzer IV F
10-Panzer IV H
11-Sherman VC
12-T-34/76
13-T-34/85
14-Tiger 2
15-Tiger I


The trend that could be seen after last years update continues: The three Jagdpanzer basically don't play a role anymore, and the T-34/85 really dominates the gameplay now. The new terrain engine has change everything.

[bozon]

Thanks again Lusche.
I am completely ignorant about tanks. I don't even know what the "forward" and "backward" keys are. So, maybe some can explain to me:

1. As a pilot defending against GVs attacking his airfield I had the impression that M4 is the most popular tank. The stats tell otherwise. Perhaps they are used mostly for attacking bases?

2. Why did the tank destroyers disappeared with the arrival of the new terrains? Is that because of shorter free lines of sight?

3 Do wirbs and ostwinds pose any danger to tanks at short ranges?