Author Topic: FSO is about who you know not what you know  (Read 4588 times)

Offline VuduVee

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Re: FSO is about who you know not what you know
« Reply #75 on: March 03, 2013, 08:28:45 AM »
Never got a side I didn't like.

Never got a ride I wasn't happy with.

All is well in the Universe.  /close thread


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go troll somewhere else cool guy.

Offline HighTone

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Re: FSO is about who you know not what you know
« Reply #76 on: March 03, 2013, 09:46:33 AM »
No matter how hard I tried I couldn't get my Yak-9T to turn into an A6M.

The LCA is a 100% Axis PTO squad.

Everything else is just passing time.


 FSO rocks.


Carry on  :salute

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Offline hammer

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Re: FSO is about who you know not what you know
« Reply #77 on: March 03, 2013, 09:48:43 AM »
Maybe I'm missing the issue here. Is it about rotation, plane/mission assignment, who's in charge of particular mission within a frame, or something else? My impression is that you are advocating for a system in which everybody has to change sides so that it is "fair".

If I understand what you want correctly, then in my example from earlier in this thread, the first frame would look as I described it with 120 people who requested allied flying allied, 70 people who requested axis flying axis, and 10 people who wanted to fly allied having to switch to axis to make the numbers work. Remember that in this particular scenario, the numbers called for more allied than axis. Since this is Friday Squad Operations, let's go back to squads and say 3 large squads, 4 medium squads, and 4 small squads fly allied, while 2 large squads, 2 medium squads, and 4 small squads fly axis. 2 of the small squads that are flying axis requested allied but were switched to make the numbers work. So, right now, we have 10 people, or 5%, flying for the side they didn't want to fly for.

The second frame is where your system would kick in. Two of the large squads, 2 of the medium squads, and all 4 small squads who wanted to be and were assigned to be allied have to switch to axis. Meanwhile, all of the squads who were axis in the first frame switch to allied, including the 2 squads who wanted to be allied in the first frame but were forced to switch. Now we have 150 people, or 75% of the playing population, flying for a side they don't want to.

In the third frame, it really gets complicated. Now, both large allied squads who were switched to axis get to switch back to allied but, because there is still a large allied squad who hasn't switched, that allied squad and one of the large axis squads gets switched back to axis, meaning there are two large squads "unhappy". There are still 2 medium allied squads who haven't switched, so they both go to axis, meaning there are 4 medium squads "unhappy", and all 4 of the small squads who were switched go back to axis, meaning the original 2 small squads who wanted to be allied to begin with. That puts 90 people, or 45% of the population, in the "unhappy" group.

With this system, we can see that about 1/2 of the axis squads have to stay allied for two frames so that all of the allied squads have their chance to rotate to axis once. Remembering this scenario called for more allies, than axis, these numbers could be reversed - the smaller side is the one that will have to spend more time as the other. Regardless, we haven't achieved "fair" because some squads have to be "unhappy" for 2 frames, while some are only unhappy for one. From a numbers perspective, we've managed to make 100% of the FSO population unhappy at least once during these frames, and about 50% were unhappy during 2 out of 3 frames. That doesn't bode well for the future of FSO!

The reality is that normally, when numbers are off, they are off in favor of the allies. This usually means a squad that wanted to be allied is asked to fly axis. I can't speak to what the numbers usually are, but forcing a large allied squad to swap with a large axis squad does nothing to fix the numbers discrepancy. Forcing anyone who voluntarily flies for the less populated side to fly for the most popular side makes no sense whatsoever. In the end, it will come down to asking a squad from the popular side to go to the other side. If you don't want to be in that position, make a habit of requesting the less popular side and establish yourself as a team player there.

Regards,

Hammer
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Offline Squire

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Re: FSO is about who you know not what you know
« Reply #78 on: March 03, 2013, 09:51:02 AM »
In fairness all squads can get a period where they get hard assignments and/or not the best ride. If you genuinely feel that a set of orders is not fair to your squad you should email the CiC and request a change. Just keep it civil and explain the situation. That said we all have to do our part when getting assigned strike planes and the 2nd line aircraft. If you feel that the problem is persiting contact the FSO Team and we will have a look at it.

If you guys have any problems in FSO at all we are here to help. PM or email us anytime.

FYI my squad has had Me 410s, Ju 88s and IL-2s in the last three frames. We still had fun though.
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Offline ImADot

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Re: FSO is about who you know not what you know
« Reply #79 on: March 03, 2013, 09:52:48 AM »
I see two topics in this thread...

Squads switching (or getting switched) between Allied and Axis.

This is done either voluntarily by a squad, or by the CM Admin who designed the event to balance the side numbers according to the design of the event. As stated before, more squads want to fly Allied, so if the numbers require a shift, the CM will move a squad. I believe most of the time, it would only require a shift of one or two small squads; if a squad gets moved "an unfair" number of times, it should be addressed by the CM team.


Squads being given "crappy" rides or missions.

This is entirely a matter of the assigned squad performing their CiC duties and has nothing to do with assigning a squad to fly Allied or Axis. Some players are better at that duty than others, and like it or not, there will always be favoritism.


Edit:
I have also seen a number of posts that make it sound like squads can be moved from one side to the other from frame to frame during a 3-frame event. To my knowledge, nobody is moved during the month except in very very rare occasions.
« Last Edit: March 03, 2013, 09:57:10 AM by ImADot »
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Offline hammer

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Re: FSO is about who you know not what you know
« Reply #80 on: March 03, 2013, 10:03:22 AM »
I have also seen a number of posts that make it sound like squads can be moved from one side to the other from frame to frame during a 3-frame event. To my knowledge, nobody is moved during the month except in very very rare occasions.

Ah-so. Didn't realize that. Just change frames in my examples to months!  :D

Regards,

Hammer
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Offline 1Canukk

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Re: FSO is about who you know not what you know
« Reply #81 on: March 03, 2013, 10:13:25 AM »
      There ways of bringing  certain thing to attention that a group or an individual feel that needs addressing , but to start with an opening line like  "FSO is about who you know not what you know" and not get any positive reaction to your concern is understanding , CIC , is a group that volunteers there time to organise Fridays "FSO" and to think that a select group get preference over the rest is  , BS . Instead of going down this road , the CIC group are always looking for new members give it a try and we will give you the same respect.

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Offline VuduVee

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Re: FSO is about who you know not what you know
« Reply #82 on: March 03, 2013, 10:24:29 AM »
I see two topics in this thread...

Squads switching (or getting switched) between Allied and Axis.

This is done either voluntarily by a squad, or by the CM Admin who designed the event to balance the side numbers according to the design of the event. As stated before, more squads want to fly Allied, so if the numbers require a shift, the CM will move a squad. I believe most of the time, it would only require a shift of one or two small squads; if a squad gets moved "an unfair" number of times, it should be addressed by the CM team.


Squads being given "crappy" rides or missions.

This is entirely a matter of the assigned squad performing their CiC duties and has nothing to do with assigning a squad to fly Allied or Axis. Some players are better at that duty than others, and like it or not, there will always be favoritism.


Edit:
I have also seen a number of posts that make it sound like squads can be moved from one side to the other from frame to frame during a 3-frame event. To my knowledge, nobody is moved during the month except in very very rare occasions.
the 2nd part is what i was talking about. the smaller squads get these rides and assignments that are doomed to fail almost every week. even tho we perform our duties well as possible in junk rides and play hard, we still get no credit(better rides every once in a while) and are used only as "filler" as stated before, so, as stated before our contribution is "insignificant". so even tho we put as much into FSO as everyone else, we will always be second fiddle no matter what we do. no matter that we've been a part of fso for a long time, we are still used only as fodder/filler for the big squads. it seems pointless to continue FSO if we're not given our proper dues.

Offline VuduVee

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Re: FSO is about who you know not what you know
« Reply #83 on: March 03, 2013, 10:32:23 AM »
     There ways of bringing  certain thing to attention that a group or an individual feel that needs addressing , but to start with an opening line like  "FSO is about who you know not what you know" and not get any positive reaction to your concern is understanding , CIC , is a group that volunteers there time to organise Fridays "FSO" and to think that a select group get preference over the rest is  , BS . Instead of going down this road , the CIC group are always looking for new members give it a try and we will give you the same respect.
i woulda got the same answer i got here. and if you read , im not the only one. its out in the open now. it cant be hidden or covered up by using private messages.

Offline WxMan

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Re: FSO is about who you know not what you know
« Reply #84 on: March 03, 2013, 10:55:41 AM »
AlBundy

I don't know how you feel your squad has been slighted.  Last month your squad got your preferred rides 2 out of 3 frames.  If you think that you got a bad deal this past frame. Talk to your CO, becuase he never updated your ride request for this month. It shows Spits as the preferred ride, and I see no Spitfires for this month event.
« Last Edit: March 03, 2013, 11:00:54 AM by WxMan »
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Offline hammer

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Re: FSO is about who you know not what you know
« Reply #85 on: March 03, 2013, 11:19:28 AM »
...becuase he never updated your ride request for this month. ...

Translated by whoever as "we don't care what you do with us this month" perhaps?
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Offline cohofly

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Re: FSO is about who you know not what you know
« Reply #86 on: March 03, 2013, 12:10:51 PM »
Translated by whoever as "we don't care what you do with us this month" perhaps?
Bettter translated as "It doesnt mattter if we change our preferences or not we are small and we are at the mercy of the large squads.".
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Offline Krusty

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Re: FSO is about who you know not what you know
« Reply #87 on: March 03, 2013, 12:42:52 PM »
If you have such utter apathy towards FSO participation.... Why are you still here? Surely you care enough, so you should talk to your CO. I've been in those small squads many times. In fact I think that the largest squads should be broken up into units no larger than 12. However, this entire thread is nothing but a frustrated rant.

If you're at the breaking point, quit FSO. If you're ranting, talk to your CO about ride choice and missions available.

Offline pops57

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Re: FSO is about who you know not what you know
« Reply #88 on: March 03, 2013, 12:45:23 PM »
Simple solution but with nearly unimaginable whining and crying,etc. Split up the big squads give them multiple missions and fill out those missions with the smaller squads. But put on your ear plugs because I think the crying and name calling would be epic loud and long! :O

Offline Krusty

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Re: FSO is about who you know not what you know
« Reply #89 on: March 03, 2013, 12:47:48 PM »
Frankly I have a problem with those big squads... Putting some 30-40 people in one mission is way overkill. You can't divert them elsewhere. They may split up into flights on their own, but are still steamrolling anybody they find, and are still on the same mission.

I think they ought to have been divided up into A, B, C flights, etc all with separate orders in different areas.