Change maps more often,plz

[HawkerMKII]

Greebo made the most recent map and he took a lot of crap for it. People complained about colors, lay outs any thing you could think of. Why would someone WANT to make a map after seeing what he went through. He said if he dropped everything else and was pumped to do another one it would still take months. Now if HTC dropped everything to make a new map we would get what 2, 3 a year? At which point people would be complaining about them with in a couple weeks and looking for new maps again because the same crappy style of play we have now would be on the new maps and so nothing would change. On top of that, to get those few "new maps" we wouldn't get any new planes or vehicles, nor would there be any updates to the art work of existing plane set. Thing of how THAT would go over.   

I like Greebo's map, the best one in the line up. But if HT can have a team to update aircraft and the game in general, why not have some one to make maps, if the players have to make them why not somehow make it easier to do. Seems to me if HT staff would do it they would know the in's and out's right from wrong of making a map, less time to debug a player submitted map, yes-no?

[sax]

Maps should fit every style of game play.

Very few in the rotation do.

[Greebo]

There were some players who complained CraterMA's arena map colours were too bright and that was fair criticism. So i sent HTC a dulled down map and since they have applied it I've not heard anything more about it. Other than that I've had a lot more positive feedback than negative about CraterMA. I wasn't expecting universal approval but even if I had got it I still wouldn't be making another map.

The reason I don't intend to make another map is that there isn't much I could do differently than on my first one. I'd be using the same few base types, fleets, strats and a choice of two sets of terrain tiles. There's only so many ways you can lay out the fields and spawn points. If there was a bunch of new stuff that could be applied to MA terrains, (bridges, new bases, strats etc.) then it might give me and other map makers some incentive to make one.

[TDeacon]

if that was true then they would not be asking for a change, would they?  These kinds of posts are ridiculous. Are you saying that having a new map would bother you some how?

Last I checked I had a job and it is not creating maps. That should be the game developers job. You know, the one we pay?  HT can say yes or no to requests as they see fit but what compels a player to blame or even attack the other customers for requesting new stuff makes me wonder.

Some of us feel that the constant complaints by certain players about “stale” maps masks the real problem, which is a stereotyped and myopic style of game play on the part of these same players.  In such a case, yes, “they would be asking for a change”, but without justification.  It is always easier to blame a problem on outside factors, than on one’s own behavior. 

Although there are always exceptions, I think that based on what I see posted here, most of the complainers ignore the original core of this game (derived from its predecessors back to Air Warrior), which is simulation of individual plane (and later vehicle) combat.  Unfortunately, since it requires effort to improve one’s skill in such combat, and instant gratification is now the norm, many have joined hordes engaging in strategic sweeps of the map in order to “win the war”.  I postulate that in such cases, the Base A, Base B, Base C, etc. sequence gets boring – hence the perceived “need” for new maps.  This is the real problem. 

Of course, if new maps (supporting all styles of game play) were “free”, then I would be all for it.  Unfortunately, the resources needed to produce them are limited, the knowledge on how to do so to support all game play styles (including GVs) is mostly absent, and in any case many of us are more interested in new planes, GVs, etc.  We have this preference perhaps because we are to some degree in touch with the “core” elements of game play referred to above. 

MH

[TDeacon]

There were some players who complained CraterMA's arena map colours were too bright and that was fair criticism. <snip>

Actually, I liked that part of it.  On my equipment, at least half of the maps are not colorful enough.  I guess the squeaky wheel gets the grease... 

MH

[Zacherof]

Is that your rat?

[Tinkles]

I think if HTC were able to lower some of the requirements for their maps I would be willing to make one and perhaps a few others would be able to as well.

Personally, I think we should have a lot more things to work with than what we do. You can only come up with so many variations with few parts before you start to duplicate. That is what we have here. No matter the map, it's the same thing, high alt mountains into canyons. Some with or without water. Big maps, small maps. etc etc.  If we had more things to work with, we could have more variations of maps and different map styles to suit each style of player.  

People want to fly the same stale mission profiles over and over and compel HTC to change something instead of varying thier mission profiles to include earning a new map.

While I agree with this, I don't as well. Here's why.    You can capture a base by leveling the town with lancs, with p38s or even a 'fun' mission in spit 1s. However, you still need the town down, the town deacked, and troops to capture it.    So if you go by the mentality of winning the war, you have to do the same (sometimes repetitive) things over and over again. The only thing that changes is the map, but the way of capturing bases and winning the war stays the same.    I will submit another wish on this later, need time to think on it.

if that was true then they would not be asking for a change, would they?  These kinds of posts are ridiculous. Are you saying that having a new map would bother you some how?

Last I checked I had a job and it is not creating maps. That should be the game developers job. You know, the one we pay?  HT can say yes or no to requests as they see fit but what compels a player to blame or even attack the other customers for requesting new stuff makes me wonder.

No, he's saying that sometimes the player has to put forth initiative if they want something different. You can give one kid a stick and they would have a blast, give another kid a stick and they would ask "what am I supposed to do with this"?   Some things a developer can't change, no matter what they do or how hard they try, it is sometimes up to the player to make the difference.


We are not asking you to create maps, we are asking those who want to create maps, to create maps.  If a kid wants a sandwich and you make it for him, and they don't like it. Have them make their own sandwich!  The fine employees of HTC are doing the job, that we pay them for. Everyone has their right to their own opinion, no need to flame someone else if their opinion is different than yours.


No intent to flame or degrade or insult in this post.

Tinkles

<<S>>

[The Fugitive]

I like Greebo's map, the best one in the line up. But if HT can have a team to update aircraft and the game in general, why not have some one to make maps, if the players have to make them why not somehow make it easier to do. Seems to me if HT staff would do it they would know the in's and out's right from wrong of making a map, less time to debug a player submitted map, yes-no?

I would love to be hired by HTC to do nothing but build maps. Of course Hitech has already said that if he hired someone to build maps he'd have a laundry list of other things he'd need done first, so it would be a while before they could get to maps.

I understand that the set pieces are limited for a Main arena map, but the way the base lay out should be pretty endless. Sure your going to repeat some things more often than not, but each map will have a spot or two that is just a bit special. Greebos map is the Tank town in the crater, Festers is CV battles and the line of V bases, Ndisles is it's tank town and so on. I think the things that would "make" new maps are these little things that crop up like V135 on Trinity.   

[dedalos]

Lol, nice back pedaling.  He said they want to run the same missions and therefore they ask for new maps witch does not make any sense no matter how u try to twist it.

On the stupid sandwich example, look at it this way. An adult paid you for a sandwich in your sandwich shop. After many years of the same sandwich he is asking that maybe you can provide some other sandwich on the menu.  Your response would be make your own? 

As for the fine HT employees, I never said they are not. My argument is against players flaming and shooting down any request for anything new like maps or graphics.

How many more planes do we need?  The models have been done for years right?  A new map or graphics would not hurt anyone will they? 

[Tinkles]

Lol, nice back pedaling.  He said they want to run the same missions and therefore they ask for new maps witch does not make any sense no matter how u try to twist it.

On the stupid sandwich example, look at it this way. An adult paid you for a sandwich in your sandwich shop. After many years of the same sandwich he is asking that maybe you can provide some other sandwich on the menu.  Your response would be make your own? 

As for the fine HT employees, I never said they are not. My argument is against players flaming and shooting down any request for anything new like maps or graphics.

How many more planes do we need?  The models have been done for years right?  A new map or graphics would not hurt anyone will they? 

"People want to fly the same stale mission profiles over and over and compel HTC to change something instead of varying thier mission profiles..." Is what Icepac said. Pretty much doing the same thing over and over again, then wondering why it gets old and boring.  New maps aren't the answer in terms of changing the gameplay, unless you do it in a different way.   

Which is where my.. example came into play. New maps were asked for, Greebo made one. It received heavy criticism, but the majority liked it overall. Point being, if you don't like how someone else did something, then YOU do it and see if it's any better.

"Last I checked I had a job and it is not creating maps. That should be the game developers job. You know, the one we pay?"   Try not to insult people. Doesn't help you in the long run.


We need more planes yes. But HTC is limited on resources. So I understand if they only make a few planes instead of a new map, or add something different to the game that is needed. Sure there are many things that are needed and wanted in the game.  I think of it as the job of the customer, the player.. to understand their position and do whatever we can to help.

Tinkles

<<S>>

[dedalos]

You are missing the point I think. If every one wrote their own AH because they did not like something there would one person in every arena. Further more, people don t have the time or the expertise to create a game like AH. That is why we pay some one that did it. This is nit a charity. It is a paid service. We can make requests and the service provider can say yes or no. I dont see were u or your friend come into the equation.

It is the equivalent me saying if u dont like reading the requests, then dont read them.

I pay for the sandwich so I dont have to make my own. Same sandwich for over 10 years.

[HawkerMKII]

Maybe the question is,,,,,,new maps or add different things to old map, like many have asked for, rail yards etc?

[Tinkles]

You are missing the point I think. If every one wrote their own AH because they did not like something there would one person in every arena. Further more, people don t have the time or the expertise to create a game like AH. That is why we pay some one that did it. This is nit a charity. It is a paid service. We can make requests and the service provider can say yes or no. I dont see were u or your friend come into the equation.

It is the equivalent me saying if u dont like reading the requests, then dont read them.

I pay for the sandwich so I dont have to make my own. Same sandwich for over 10 years.

Out of curiosity, what sandwich would you eat for 10 years? Personally, a BLT for me 

 

Maybe the question is,,,,,,new maps or add different things to old map, like many have asked for, rail yards etc?

I would personally like to see bridges be used and put into the terrain and used for tanks to get across. We have trains, just not in any place where people see them, because the only places they are located at, are at areas where you need to be 20k+ to live long enough to hit your target.  Then those poor vessels at the ports, just sitting there, perhaps making them useful would have some benefit.

We have the puzzle pieces, just have to put them together.  Personally, I would be happy if just ONE map had the above, as a 'tester'. If it goes OK with everyone, then go map by map and update it. If it doesn't go well, then officially say "This didn't work". And move on. So we don't get more duplicate wishes in the future.

Tinkles

<<S>>

[The Fugitive]

You are missing the point I think. If every one wrote their own AH because they did not like something there would one person in every arena. Further more, people don t have the time or the expertise to create a game like AH. That is why we pay some one that did it. This is nit a charity. It is a paid service. We can make requests and the service provider can say yes or no. I dont see were u or your friend come into the equation.

It is the equivalent me saying if u dont like reading the requests, then dont read them.

I pay for the sandwich so I dont have to make my own. Same sandwich for over 10 years.

I think your missing the point. If you go to Subway and get a ham and cheese, or go to any other sandwich shop and order a ham and cheese, it's STILL a ham and cheese.

Running the same old NOE, or horde mission on a new map is going to get you the very same thing, bored.

You are paying for what HTC provides, a server connecting you to many others in a virtual world where you can fight others with out really hurting any one.... well other than there feelings and we see a LOT of that! No where does it say they will ADD content, but they do. Should they add maps? not my call as I'm not party to their plans or business model.

I am very sure on the other hand that if the players do something other than the "same old thing" they WILL find more fun in this game, and it's not up to HTC to provide that.

[shoresroad]

All this talk of sandwiches and now you've made me hungry for a Subway and I can't get one cause its 11:30pm and they're closed