II./JG52 109E4

[GhostCDB]

Unit: 2./JG 52
Pilot: Oberleutnant Helmut Benneman (Staffelkapitan) Caffiers, France, October 1940.

I had the hardest time ever figuring out where things were for the 109, considering this was the first german aircraft I have skinned. But I figured out where everything was. I fixed the major things that I found after taking the screenshots and reviewing it carefully. I am kinda at a stand still about what color blue it should be because different profiles show different shades of blue.

Profile I used : http://wp.scn.ru/en/ww2/f/32/2/13

Another reference used : http://static.imodeler.com/uploads/2013/01/Image5.jpg









I forgot to turn the wind off and when I spawned from hanger the wind blew me into the hanger door   Then I proceeded to type lol forgetting I was in offline mode.

Hopefully this skin can see BoB 

 

[FTJR]

Are the upper wings completely blue?

Scribd is your friend, try this for starters, but there is a lot more information there

http://www.scribd.com/doc/89058468/Luftwaffe-Camouflage-1935-40

Regards

[GhostCDB]

Are the upper wings completely blue?

Scribd is your friend, try this for starters, but there is a lot more information there

http://www.scribd.com/doc/89058468/Luftwaffe-Camouflage-1935-40

Regards

I didn't use scribd, but I didn't find out what color it is supposed to be. Thank you for bringing that to my attention.
Found it here : http://www.cptfarrels.com/COD/Bf109E-3/Bf-109E-3.html

Will update the skin and finish it. Will post final results by tonight (US) .

[Devil 505]

First off, that profile is pure crap. The colors and paint pattern are completely incorrect.

Here is a much better one.


Now here is a reference pic of the real aircraft.


Now you have a better idea of the pattern, now let's move on to colors. I'll give you the name of the color and the red/green/blue values that I use for my Luftwaffe colors.

RLM 71 Dunkelgrun (Olive green) Red:65 Green:69 Blue:57 Hue:80 Saturation:17 Value:27
RLM 02 Grau (Gray-beige)  R:113 G:108 B:89 H:48 S:21 V:44
RLM 65  Hellblau (Blue-gray) R:149 G:163 B:162 H:176 S:9 V:64
RLM 04 Gelb (Yellow) R:243 G:177 B:46 H:40 S:81 V:95

Good luck.

[Krusty]

There's a lot to comment on for this... Not all good. Please take this as constructive criticism.

Don't use artists' color profiles for colors. They can be printed off-color, then re-scanned with the wrong color settings, and turn out far different than intended, and also they can just be wrong from the person that created them.

Use them as inspiration only. Use wp.scn.ru only as inspiration and then find OTHER references to that plane/profile and build off of them.


Second, there is a lot of inaccurate stuff on that skin.

Not only are the colors not quite right, but you haven't put any on top of the wings. The yellow nose isn't the right shade and isn't quite perfect, and the side mottling is rather garish and "hard" edged. You copied the profile rather closely, but sadly that profile is not accurate. It's just a general one to show an approximation of what the plane would have looked like.

The mottled spots would probably look a bit more like:
http://www.nakatomitower.com/ahskins/images/screenshots/109e4_9.jpg

This is for a different game, but is a different interpretation of that plane's markings:
http://www.cptfarrels.com/COD/Bf109E-3/JG52/Bf109E-3_Bennemann_JG52s.jpg
Perhaps they understated the side mottling a bit too much, but falls within the standard techniques of the time.

Other skins from that other game which show side mottling effects which would apply to your plane:
http://www.cptfarrels.com/COD/Bf109E-3/JG3/Bf109E-3_Rau_JG3s.jpg
http://www.cptfarrels.com/COD/Bf109E-3/JG51/Bf109E-3_White-7_JG51s.jpg

There are examples of the side mottling being more "dot-like" in shape, but it was still applied by hand and without masks or pre-shaped stencils. It's just hard to come up with an example on short notice for this response, otherwise I'd have included it here. The best I can find is this:
http://www.cieldegloire.com/as_allemands/jg52_109.jpg
But imagine the mottling was more solid, more opaque, and less transparent than this profile suggests.

To help with the colors, you're going to want to take a look here:
http://www.ipmsstockholm.org/colorcharts/colorcharts.asp
Specifically the sub-section on German colors is here:
http://www.ipmsstockholm.org/colorcharts/stuff_eng_colorcharts_germany.htm

This will give you a much better starting point for colors.

Also, there's just a lot of detail missing on the skin. The fuel triangle on the port fuselage, and things like that. You also have a very faded and fuzzy squadron emblem on the port nose. You'll need to clean this up a bit and also put it on the starboard side. Both sides should face "forward" (i.e. mirrored). You also left a chunk of green on top of the nose which ought to be yellow, at least according to your profile.

And the left and right "wing lights" are just wrong as well. These were stationed on the front "corner" of the wingtip, wrapping from top to bottom.

I think it's fair to say you have an interest in skinning, and that's good. It will keep you going. The first skins are always the hardest because you're learning the ropes. I think, however, that you need to do a lot more research to "get it right" before you submit a skin.


As a foot-note, I wouldn't bet on this, or any other newly-submitted skin being in-game in time for the upcoming scenario. Chances are due to the turnaround times involved that we'll be using only the existing in-game skins for that scenario. BUT, if you get a finalized skin in-game it will be there for future events, further down the line.

[GhostCDB]

 

Actually didn't take long to fix. I named all of the layers and it worked out great because it was easier to find which things needed to be fixed.

Thanks for the help. That was a huge fail on my part. 

[GhostCDB]

UPDATE

[Krusty]

While I think it's an improvement, I think you still need to do more research into Bf109s and their camouflage patterns. They used a standard scheme, and even though there were variations, the BOB-era tended to stick to that scheme for upper surfaces.

You've just made up some zig-zags for the green. That's a start. Next is to try to match the correct patterns. The underside color was not the color used for the top of the wings. The same 2 colors on the dorsal spine were used on all upper wing surfaces. Speaking of which, your camo lines on the left and right dorsal spine don't match up against each other when they meet in the middle. Your green camo demarcation is crisp on the tail fins and fuselage, but very soft and fuzzy on the wings. It would be more towards the "crisp" end (but not a sharp border, there was some slight feathering when the paint was sprayed).

You still have a large green square in front of the windscreen that ought to be yellow along with the rest of the nose.

You're still lacking in basic details. It's essentially a paint bucket fill of solid colors. The over-stated rivets don't really help distract the eye much from this. I think you need to work a bit on the weathering to help break up this solid-fill look. The weathering you have is sometimes random. The streaks under the belly are nice, but the little odd "clouds" here and there seem too random.

Overall it's hard to give too much of a critique on the details because they're rather hard to see in the screenshots. It would help to take a screenshot with the sunlight towards the side of the picture you're taking, and at a closer distance. Instead of moving the view in, try ZOOM and then use increase/decrease zoom to adjust it from there. It helps get you in closer to the details for a screenshot and reduces the fisheye look when you just use view position keys to do the same.

[FTJR]

Overall dont be disheartened, people will help you if you ask, just keep at it.

Also make a note of how you do things, because as you stumble across things that work, you'll want to repeat them in future, and its better to make a note of how you got your desired effect, because you wont, believe me, remember in 6 days time, let alone 6 months  after you've done it.

[macleod01]

Also make a note of how you do things, because as you stumble across things that work, you'll want to repeat them in future, and its better to make a note of how you got your desired effect, because you wont, believe me, remember in 6 days time, let alone 6 months  after you've done it.

THIS

THIS IS GOSPEL

Although I only have the one skin in game (Ironically also an Emil) I am working on a 111 skin and I find myself making a lot of small mistakes that I made first time round, or forgetting how to do simple things such as where to save the skin and even learning new things like Shift-Click for rivets! This makes life so much easier. If you keep a record of the things you try, the next skin will seem so much easier.

As other people have said, don't get disheartened. Skinning is not easy. People think it is just doodling in paint. As you are finding out, it really isn't. Research, research, research. The more you do the easier life will be. Get stuck into books on the BoB, that will give an idea of the camouflage used on the upper surfaces. I say BoB for the fact that there is a lot more documentation about that than say the Battle of France. But just read and search for photos, not profiles. They are very often wrong. With my current skin, I found 3 matching profiles. When I compared them to a photo I thought there was minor discrepancies. Turns out the whole colour scheme was wrong on every profile! Do not trust them.. Not to say they don't have their merits, but don't assume they are correct.

Just keep at it, and listen to the advice given. Krusty has a lot of skins in the game as does Greebo. If they suggest something, then it will only be to make the skin better. Even if they nitpick at it, it is all for the good.

[No9Squadron]

As a person whose modded other games but yet to make a skin in AH, this thread is really useful.

Without reading Krusty's posts, the only thing I really noticed was the upper wing pattern being creative rather than historical. You're doing well, it's impressive to me, just keep working on it.

[GhostCDB]

Skin In-Game, Enjoy

[Krusty]

But did you fix the issues before submitting, or did you submit it just to get it in?

[GhostCDB]

But did you fix the issues before submitting, or did you submit it just to get it in?

Oh, yeah I fixed it. haha A lot, I just deleted the entire skin and re-did it. And made guidelines based off of what you and a few others said.

[GhostCDB]

But did you fix the issues before submitting, or did you submit it just to get it in?

Although when I look at it, I see a few things I should probably fix after doing more skins.

The more skins I do, the more things stand out to me.