F4U Turning surprise

[Widewing]

The flying brick outhouse...

[save]

That is a big mofo droptank only a blind engineer could love 

[Widewing]

Another view, same Hellcat. F6F-3, early production variant. 377 to 383 mph at MIL power. A bit lighter than the F6F-5, but less power and not as aero clean. The -5 had cleaned up aero, revised windscreen and enough power to push beyond 400 mph at critical altitude.

[Gman]

I can't find any decent pics online of the F6F and the F4F side by side, either airborne or on the ground.  I've seen both of them up close, but only separately, and the thing that greatly surprised me was how large the Hellcat was.  I'd always had this assumed idea that it was just an advanced version of the Wildcat - uh, no.  The Hellcat wasn't much smaller than the P47, it's incredible how nimble it is, and how well it rates/radius in turns with respect to how it looks, and what it must weigh.

Like I said, the only picture I could find was of a Brit F4F in the foreground, and an F6F in the background, so the Wildcat looks deceptively larger, even though you can still tell it's much smaller.

Anyone have a good example of such a pic?

[mtnman]

I can't find any decent pics online of the F6F and the F4F side by side, either airborne or on the ground.  I've seen both of them up close, but only separately, and the thing that greatly surprised me was how large the Hellcat was.  I'd always had this assumed idea that it was just an advanced version of the Wildcat - uh, no.  The Hellcat wasn't much smaller than the P47, it's incredible how nimble it is, and how well it rates/radius in turns with respect to how it looks, and what it must weigh.

Like I said, the only picture I could find was of a Brit F4F in the foreground, and an F6F in the background, so the Wildcat looks deceptively larger, even though you can still tell it's much smaller.

Anyone have a good example of such a pic?

This page shows a top view comparison:

http://www.aviatia.net/ww2versus/f4f-wildcat/f4f-vs-f6f/

[Gman]

That's actually not to bad of a picture, even though it's a bit of artwork, not an actual pic, that top down view gives a good view from that angle of the comparison I'm looking for side by side, or in this case, nose to nose from the top.

That pic brings up an interesting tidbit, it shows as the armament loadouts that the F6F-5N can have 2 20mm, I'm assuming hispano, and 4 .50 cal guns.  That would be a great armament, and if that variant performed as good as our current Hellcat does in game - heh, with that armament package it would be pretty popular I would wager.

[Widewing]

I can't find any decent pics online of the F6F and the F4F side by side, either airborne or on the ground.  I've seen both of them up close, but only separately, and the thing that greatly surprised me was how large the Hellcat was.  I'd always had this assumed idea that it was just an advanced version of the Wildcat - uh, no.  The Hellcat wasn't much smaller than the P47, it's incredible how nimble it is, and how well it rates/radius in turns with respect to how it looks, and what it must weigh.

Like I said, the only picture I could find was of a Brit F4F in the foreground, and an F6F in the background, so the Wildcat looks deceptively larger, even though you can still tell it's much smaller.

Anyone have a good example of such a pic?

F8F-2, FM-2, F3F-3, F6F-5, F7F-2N. Note the Bearcat... Nearly same size and weight as the F4F-4, it had more than twice the horsepower.....

[Brooke]

Wow, those are some gorgeous pics. 

[Brooke]

Sheldon's Hellcat song:

Hell kitty,
Fast kitty,
Big ball of fur.
Deadly kitty,
Sturdy kitty,
Purr, purr, purr.

[Karnak]

FYI, dive differences are not nearly as different as people seem to think.  I recall reading an American evaluation of the A6M and the separation gained by the American aircraft diving away from was much less than one would expect, being something like 400 yards.  400 yards is useful, but we're talking about the A6M.  A P-47 vs Fw190 is going to be a much, much closer thing.

[Gman]

Perfect, thanks WW, those are great examples, exactly what I was looking for.

The Bearcat must have been incredible for the time.  Imagine flying an F4F Wildat from the 42/43 era, then jumping right into the Bear - what a difference a couple of years made back then, it must of felt unreal.

I still would like to know if we could get that 20mm armed variant of the Hellcat.  I realize that is probably as likely as getting the 4 20mm armed Spitfire, but it would be interesting to know how many 20mm armed F6F's served in the war.  Something from memory seems to tell me that they were often night fighters, with that big bulbus white radar hub on one wing, but I could be mistaken.  Anyhow, a Hellcat with 2 20mm and 4 50 would be nuts if it had the same performance as what he have now.

[Saxman]

The only F6F armed with 20mm was the -5N night fighter variant. You'd be losing far more performance from the radome than the extra firepower would really be worth.

[Gman]

Ok, thanks Sax.  Like I said, I thought I had remembered something about that, I just wasn't sure if there was another day fighter variant as well. 

[Saxman]

I THINK I read that standard -3 and -5 were capable of mounting the 20mm in the inboard gun position as well, but that this configuration was never used on the day fighters.

[Widewing]

The only F6F armed with 20mm was the -5N night fighter variant. You'd be losing far more performance from the radome than the extra firepower would really be worth.

The typical F6F-3N/5N lost 17 to 20 mph in speed. Add to that another 400 lbs of radar and associated gear, plus the extras weight of the cannons... They were effective night fighters, and were used when needed during daylight. The performance penalty was not huge in the Pacific war, but it would be a bigger deal in the game.