Scoring

[TonyJoey]

Kill points already achieves this goal.

[Lusche]

You see, many players will specifically only fly attack sorties, waiting until they see a good opportunity to get a bunch of fighter kills. They then switch to fighter mode (or log onto an alternate account) and pad there score, then either park the name and log off, or switch back to attack.

http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/index.php?topic=341952.45

[bustr]

From the linked 2012 discussion we gain a smidgen more insight to the scoring as related to "The Game" it scores for. At least from the creator's perspective.

The two insights from Hitech:

Insight One

The score system perfectly reflects a persons skill at playing the game.

But it does not do a very good job at  reflecting a persons ability a cooking.

HiTech

Insight Two

Do you play "The game" or do you just fly in an arena?

HiTech

----------------------------------

So what is Hitech's "The Game" opposed to the "The Game" posters in this discussion want the stat collection functions changed to reflect?

[Slade]

Kills/sortie on the other hand, that should DEFINITELY be eliminated. It is nothing other than a measure of how regularly a player uses the rearm pad. Whatever it is supposed to measure is measured better by kills per hour.

BNZ's quote here may be the most useful thing I've seen in a long while on this topic.  That would be a good change.  

[Lusche]

BNZ's quote here may be the most useful thing I've seen in a long while on this topic.  That would be a good change.  

Always being a curious mind, I took a quick look at how this would have changed the top 10 fighter ranks of last tour.

First, the top 10 as is:

TonyJoey  
Snailman  
angus  
rocky    
paladin3  
okie          
cmex          
cargnico  
lynx            
grizz        

And now the top 10 with K/S eliminated:

TonyJoey
Snailman
angus
ROCKY
Paladin3
OKIE
Cargnico
2cmex
Lynx
Grizz

[Skyyr]

Always being a curious mind, I took a quick look at how this would have changed the top 10 fighter ranks of last tour.

First, the top 10 as is:

TonyJoey  
Snailman  
angus  
rocky    
paladin3  
okie          
cmex          
cargnico  
lynx            
grizz        

And now the top 10 with K/S eliminated:

TonyJoey
Snailman
angus
ROCKY
Paladin3
OKIE
Cargnico
2cmex
Lynx
Grizz

It's not a matter of eliminating K/S, K/D, or any other stat. Anyone who ranks top 10 is going to do so because all of their stats are relatively high (and are unweighted); therefore, removing the same stat from everyone is almost always going to result in the same set of results.

The suggestion's intention is not to change the list, but rather weight the stats so that, purely for example, someone with a 9.99 k/d ratio with 1000 kills scores is weighted higher than someone with a 10.0 k/d and 20 kills.

[TonyJoey]

Kill points already does that.

[Lusche]

It's not a matter of eliminating K/S, K/D, or any other stat. Anyone who ranks top 10 is going to do so because all of their stats are relatively high (and are unweighted); therefore, removing the same stat from everyone is almost always going to result in the same set of results.

I have a feeling that this is just an assumption on your side not based on actual data?

That being said, it's not like you say at all. Eliminating K/S had the top 10 almost unchanged. But eliminating Kill Points for example would have changed the top 10 of last tour quite a lot, even bringing someone into the top5 with only 3(!) fighter sorties.
The top 10 would suddenly largely made up by players with very low sortie numbers. (And yes, i ran the numbers)
So we can see that kill points already do have a large impact and are balancing the whole fighter rank thing in LW.

[Skyyr]

I have a feeling that this is just an assumption on your side not based on actual data?

That being said, it's not like you say at all. Eliminating K/S had the top 10 almost unchanged. But eliminating Kill Points for example would have changed the top 10 of last tour quite a lot, even bringing someone into the top5 with only 3(!) fighter sorties.
The top 10 would suddenly largely made up by players with very low sortie numbers. (And yes, i ran the numbers)
So we can see that kill points already do have a large impact and are balancing the whole fighter rank thing in LW.

You're asking for data, but that's the thing - I've already proved it's possible through the prior examples. The fact that it's possible at all is the problem. That said, it does happen - look at ranks 11-50. You'll find several pilots with only 4-8 hours of flight time and only tens of kills.

The underlying problem is that it's possible to game the system because it pulls stats without context. Changing it to a weighted system removes the ability to game it, as it requires consistent gameplay to maintain those ranks.

The only change being advocated here is a reasonable weighting preference given to those with larger sample sizes. That's not a random, arbitrary wish - that's fundamental to statistics in general.

[Skyyr]

Kill points already does that.

It indirectly causes it, but does not directly modify the weight of K/S or K/D. But even then, kill points itself is modified by other factors that have nothing to do with flight performance. So yes, it modifies it, but not in a contextually-meaningful way.

Also, factor in that it is completely pointless to continue improving score, literally, one point past the #2 position. Any effort past that point is wasted. Weighting the scores, on the other hand, actually makes it beneficial to continually improve score, as weight goes up as quantity increases.

[Lusche]

You're asking for data, but that's the thing - I've already proved it's possible through the prior examples.

So did I, I already have said that this is possible - but also I said it's less frequent and more importantly, much less effective as people (and you) tend to believe. (had you visited the link I provided?)
So a few players made it into top 50 with only a few sorties.

Well, take away Kill Points, and the top 50 will be full of them. Even more so, suddenly there are a lot of players in the top 10 with only very few sorties. This absolutely contradicts your theory that kill points are not weighting things at all. They are, and quite so.
When Kill Points had no such effect, nothing much would change when I eliminate it from the rank calculation. But the opposite is happening.


And I'm not just takign a look at a few selected players - I run the rank calculations for all 'active pilots' (those with at least one kill or death in anything) just like the HTC rank calculator does.

[LCADolby]

Play the game and enjoy the fight. You don't get a trophy for number 1 anyway, it's a thankless easily forgotten task.

Score means nothing, a high ranked player can still be pounded into the dirt in the DA.

[caldera]

[Debrody]

rofl

By the way i find it highly abusive that there is a group of players who only play for the K/D (ergo they never fight in an air combat game, avoiding any opponent who has the chance to shoot back), they come here, make a suggestion that score should only be determined by K/D, but nooohoooo they arent doing it for any selfish reason (blatant lie).

Maybe its only my blood, but i cant stand liars.

[Wmaker]

By the way i find it highly abusive ....

Oh the irony...