Author Topic: Advertising on SimHQ  (Read 5162 times)

Offline Changeup

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Re: Advertising on SimHQ
« Reply #30 on: June 19, 2014, 07:02:27 PM »
Ah yes.  That will certainly attract and encourage people to join the game.  :rolleyes:

Yes it will.  They will see the skills required to be competitive in this game or they may already have them and they will be humbled by them.  They will see the level of difficulty and rise to it by dying over and over and over.  Sound familiar? lol.  I'm sure it does...

Its how we all started, bar none, so to skip this step is akin to trying to run before you walk.  But you know this already because you have been through this process like 99% of us.

"Such is the nature of war.  By protecting others, you save yourself."

"Those who are skilled in combat do not become angered.  Those who are skilled at winning do not become afraid.  Thus, the wise win before the fight, while the ignorant fight to win." - Morihei Ueshiba

Offline Zerstorer

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Re: Advertising on SimHQ
« Reply #31 on: June 19, 2014, 07:37:26 PM »
Yes it will.  They will see the skills required to be competitive in this game or they may already have them and they will be humbled by them.  They will see the level of difficulty and rise to it by dying over and over and over.  Sound familiar? lol.  I'm sure it does...

Its how we all started, bar none, so to skip this step is akin to trying to run before you walk.  But you know this already because you have been through this process like 99% of us.



You missed my point.

BTW - Before you assume....try flying in their world using their rules and engine sometime.  Join a IL2 CLOD server, or even some of the older IL2 servers on HyperLobby.  Let me know how it goes.
The Once and Former Fulcrum

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Offline TequilaChaser

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Re: Advertising on SimHQ
« Reply #32 on: June 19, 2014, 09:11:23 PM »
You missed my point.

BTW - Before you assume....try flying in their world using their rules and engine sometime.  Join a IL2 CLOD server, or even some of the older IL2 servers on HyperLobby.  Let me know how it goes.

Hey Fulcrum, although it's been awhile for me, I have fully indulged flying IL2 and it's expansion packs, years back...

Now I am becoming what ya'll call a dinasour, and only have about roughly 30 to 40% of my gaming/fighting skill now from what I once could muster... but I will feel very good to lay down the same challenge that Changeup has done, already knowing, I have no worries or second thoughts of showing
a opponent the tower, repeatedly... That is how much different AH is from everything since AW SVGA and WB.... I stand by that.... and I assert to you I have in-depth compared every type flightsim since, except world of warplanes...

TC and I apologize if that comes across to cocky...
"When one considers just what they should say to a new pilot who is logging in Aces High, the mind becomes confused in the complex maze of info it is necessary for the new player to know. All of it is important; most of it vital; and all of it just too much for one brain to absorb in 1-2 lessons" TC

Offline TequilaChaser

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Re: Advertising on SimHQ
« Reply #33 on: June 19, 2014, 09:20:21 PM »
In regards to Ack Ack's post... back in beta up to even mid 2000's, AH had Andy Bush as well as Badboy writing new articles to be published at SimHQ , up til beta of AH2 anyways...

It is this exact community that did not bother to post or add comments, is the reason for the way people at the SimHQ forums think of AH the way they do...

TC
"When one considers just what they should say to a new pilot who is logging in Aces High, the mind becomes confused in the complex maze of info it is necessary for the new player to know. All of it is important; most of it vital; and all of it just too much for one brain to absorb in 1-2 lessons" TC

Offline TequilaChaser

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Re: Advertising on SimHQ
« Reply #34 on: June 19, 2014, 09:22:56 PM »
Word of mouth has always been the best advertisement...

To simplify my last post!


TC
"When one considers just what they should say to a new pilot who is logging in Aces High, the mind becomes confused in the complex maze of info it is necessary for the new player to know. All of it is important; most of it vital; and all of it just too much for one brain to absorb in 1-2 lessons" TC

Offline Changeup

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Re: Advertising on SimHQ
« Reply #35 on: June 19, 2014, 11:04:43 PM »
You missed my point.

BTW - Before you assume....try flying in their world using their rules and engine sometime.  Join a IL2 CLOD server, or even some of the older IL2 servers on HyperLobby.  Let me know how it goes.

I'm assuming nothing Fulcrum.  I have flown in their world.  Only about 40 hours worth but it was (in this order):

Boring
Unchallenging
Gamey
Forgiving as hell
Historically insignificant
Not something I would be proud of being good at

I need give you no other feedback.  If you've flown as you say you have, you'd know this already and spend less time making *points.
"Such is the nature of war.  By protecting others, you save yourself."

"Those who are skilled in combat do not become angered.  Those who are skilled at winning do not become afraid.  Thus, the wise win before the fight, while the ignorant fight to win." - Morihei Ueshiba

Offline Gman

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Re: Advertising on SimHQ
« Reply #36 on: June 19, 2014, 11:22:33 PM »
Agree with Changeup.

edit - Tequila, SimHQ didn't write much about Aces High until after it was out of beta.  Andy Bush is a friend of mine, and actually wrote for us at combatsim.com prior to writing at SimHQ.  I introduced him and the other friends I had at SimHQ to Aces High, after several articles had already been written by us (it was our favorite sim/game period).  You're right though, at our site and at SimHQ when they got around to covering AH, very little support was shown by the actual AH community there.  There are various reasons for this, IMO AH attracts a certain type of player and person, that isn't necessarily just a "sim" player, where as Simhq/combatism type readers were more attracted overall to the Falcon 4/DCS sort of pace.  It's like living in a big city or the country - the two types don't often mix in my experience.  


I posted something similar to this over there at SimHQ last week.

I worked at a competitor site to SimHQ back when they started, and we were a larger (hence hated) site than they were in the beginning, with a fair amount of animosity between our owner and the SimHQ people.  They even posted this long diatribe on their entry page how they weren't going to be a "commercialized" site like ours, and have only simulation "fans" write reviews, to avoid bias in their view.  It was pretty funny stuff, I personally didn't care, and had friends and former writers that worked at SimHQ I got along great with.

One such was their editor in chief at the time, "Spoons" Sponauer I believe his name was.  He was a very experienced sim guy like all of us were, and had flown everything sim-ish just like all of us had from the B17 Intellivision game and everything else up until around 2001, when this was going on.  I had been flying AH since 1999, and had gone through the whole humbling experience already that Changeup describes.  I had been taken under wing by Citabria/Fester, and had improved pretty rapidly.  I offered to bring some of the SimHQ guys over to show them what I was talking about way back then, how offline, or even small number multiplayer sim pilots at our site at the time (combatsim.com) and SimHQ had NO idea what competition and good flying even was, as the MMO environment of Aces High, and formerly Warbirds, AW, and even FA were a breed apart, and above the average sim guy in terms of ability and knowledge.  

After letting the guys from SimHQ fly around a bit, I took them into the MA, where they were promptly demolished by average joe AH pilots.  I then did some 1v1's one with, and killed them in a few turns, or less, every time.  "Spoons" actually wrote about this experience, and how humbling it was, right after this happened.  I have the article around someplace, I'll post it, but the editor senior writers from SimHQ at the time all agreed that their eyes were really opened after flying in a MMO game, and that it humbled them big time.  
« Last Edit: June 19, 2014, 11:27:00 PM by Gman »

Offline Zerstorer

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Re: Advertising on SimHQ
« Reply #37 on: June 19, 2014, 11:34:23 PM »
I'm assuming nothing Fulcrum.  I have flown in their world.  Only about 40 hours worth but it was (in this order):

Boring
Unchallenging
Gamey
Forgiving as hell
Historically insignificant
Not something I would be proud of being good at

I need give you no other feedback.  If you've flown as you say you have, you'd know this already and spend less time making *points.

Word of mouth has always been the best advertisement...

To simplify my last post!


TC

Respectfully, you are both still missing my point(s).

1.) It's the difference between a simulator and a game.  AH is a combat simulator to be sure, but does it simulate the additional workload needed to fly, manage the engine, mixture, etc etc etc....say like IL2 CLOD, or the newer IL2 Battle of Stalingrad?  No.  ACM is ACM, but its more difficult when you have to take those items into consideration and manage that workload in addition to your fight.  I haven't flown DCS P51, but I have flown (and fly) DCS A10, DCS FC2 and FC3 and they are challenging.

2.) My second point is simple:  Completely disregarding and disrespecting other's experience and favorite simulations isn't being a good ambassador....it simply confirms one of the critiques of the AH community I (and others it seems) have heard or read about.
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Offline TequilaChaser

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Re: Advertising on SimHQ
« Reply #38 on: June 19, 2014, 11:42:26 PM »
I'm so old I had forgot about combatsim, GMan, until you just posted...

I do remember and most likely can find the PDF archives of Andy's and Leon's articles they wrote..

Thank you for refreshing my memory!

TC
"When one considers just what they should say to a new pilot who is logging in Aces High, the mind becomes confused in the complex maze of info it is necessary for the new player to know. All of it is important; most of it vital; and all of it just too much for one brain to absorb in 1-2 lessons" TC

Offline Widewing

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Re: Advertising on SimHQ
« Reply #39 on: June 20, 2014, 12:07:39 AM »
Respectfully, you are both still missing my point(s).

1.) It's the difference between a simulator and a game.  AH is a combat simulator to be sure, but does it simulate the additional workload needed to fly, manage the engine, mixture, etc etc etc...

There isn't much workload flying in combat... Truly. Especially in a fighter like the P-51.

Before combat, approaching an area where the enemy may be encountered, there are a number of things one must do. Gun switch on. Gunsight on, rheostat adjusted. Select fuel tanks, pickle off drops. Prop to max rpm, mixture to auto rich. Supercharger should already be in automatic. Oil and coolant doors, automatic. From there on, it's just stick, rudder and throttle. Workload is generally confined to transiting to and from. Pilot workload in combat is minimal. Moreover, as one gets familiar with the airplane, normal operation becomes routine, pretty much second nature. Checklists and procedures. Well trained pilots can find and operate all controls and systems, blindfolded. Aces High deliberately eliminates all the preparatory things. You take off ready to fight. All we have is fuel management and prop control to aid in the former. Remember, Aces High is a combat simulator, not a flight simulator.....
My regards,

Widewing

YGBSM. Retired Member of Aces High Trainer Corps, Past President of the DFC, retired from flying as Tredlite.

Offline TequilaChaser

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Re: Advertising on SimHQ
« Reply #40 on: June 20, 2014, 12:09:00 AM »
Respectfully, you are both still missing my point(s).

1.) It's the difference between a simulator and a game.  AH is a combat simulator to be sure, but does it simulate the additional workload needed to fly, manage the engine, mixture, etc etc etc....say like IL2 CLOD, or the newer IL2 Battle of Stalingrad?  No.  ACM is ACM, but its more difficult when you have to take those items into consideration and manage that workload in addition to your fight.  I haven't flown DCS P51, but I have flown (and fly) DCS A10, DCS FC2 and FC3 and they are challenging.

2.) My second point is simple:  Completely disregarding and disrespecting other's experience and favorite simulations isn't being a good ambassador....it simply confirms one of the critiques of the AH community I (and others it seems) have heard or read about.


1.) No, AH does not require time wasting to go through a check list procedure for starting or readying for take off, I'm sure it could and would if hitech wanted to go that route, though.... and be every bit the same if not better!

as for the second part of the first point you are trying to make, It is really not that much more difficult to add extra immersion to flying such as DCS or MSFS, you want to know how I know? because I was flying actual Navy flight simulators in both NAS Memphis and NAS Cecilfield from 1985 through 1989.. I was an AD ( Aviation Machinist mate ) and I was both Low Power and High Power Turn qualified for the  A-7 corsair and S-3A Viking, and I did my Training on F-4 Phantoms and A-4 Skyhawks... after I was finished with my scheduled sim training, I could play in the sim until the next person arrived, usually one of the pilots or another Mech, from another squadron......

I have not witnessed anything to ever come close to that in online sims and even come close to being as difficult, which it was not after going through the steps , repetitively, it becomes second nature, just as it does for real life fighter pilots or online dreamers...

as for

2.) I can and do have respect for those that love their flight sims, regardless of the name or company that developed them... and you have no idea of what has been posted in alpha or beta hidden forums of how a bunch of us here and in other games have strived to help the developer improve on their game and such... I am not speaking for everyone, but I am speaking for a bigger majority of Aces High than you might realize, that feel the same as me, and has no hatred or nose stuck up at other sims....... and I still stand by my words......

don't judge me until you know me, right now you are judging!

<S> and cheers!

TC
"When one considers just what they should say to a new pilot who is logging in Aces High, the mind becomes confused in the complex maze of info it is necessary for the new player to know. All of it is important; most of it vital; and all of it just too much for one brain to absorb in 1-2 lessons" TC

Offline TequilaChaser

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Re: Advertising on SimHQ
« Reply #41 on: June 20, 2014, 12:21:26 AM »
Quote
1.) No, AH does not require time wasting to go through a check list procedure for starting or readying for take off, I'm sure it could and would if hitech wanted to go that route, though.... and be every bit the same if not better!

let me back up a step here...if you want some extra immersion factor in AH, turn off Auto Take-Off, turn off Combat-Trim, and always launch from the Hangar, manually adjusting your trim while you taxi out to the runway, and then launch manually..... this is how AH was in the beginning, it had nothing else... do this for a week, then tell me you want to enjoy AH like this!  what do you say? and I promise you , it is a lot easier to do it today, than in the beginning...

cheers

TC
"When one considers just what they should say to a new pilot who is logging in Aces High, the mind becomes confused in the complex maze of info it is necessary for the new player to know. All of it is important; most of it vital; and all of it just too much for one brain to absorb in 1-2 lessons" TC

Offline MrRiplEy[H]

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Re: Advertising on SimHQ
« Reply #42 on: June 20, 2014, 07:36:53 AM »
There isn't much workload flying in combat... Truly. Especially in a fighter like the P-51.

Before combat, approaching an area where the enemy may be encountered, there are a number of things one must do. Gun switch on. Gunsight on, rheostat adjusted. Select fuel tanks, pickle off drops. Prop to max rpm, mixture to auto rich. Supercharger should already be in automatic. Oil and coolant doors, automatic. From there on, it's just stick, rudder and throttle. Workload is generally confined to transiting to and from. Pilot workload in combat is minimal. Moreover, as one gets familiar with the airplane, normal operation becomes routine, pretty much second nature. Checklists and procedures. Well trained pilots can find and operate all controls and systems, blindfolded. Aces High deliberately eliminates all the preparatory things. You take off ready to fight. All we have is fuel management and prop control to aid in the former. Remember, Aces High is a combat simulator, not a flight simulator.....

That being said, the P38 pilots have complained about the time it took for them to configure their plane for combat if they got bounced. In some cases it was long enough to get them killed. Compare that to the automatic function of a FW190 and all of the sudden the butcher bird starts to get real life advantages that are never visible in this game.
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Offline Triton28

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Re: Advertising on SimHQ
« Reply #43 on: June 20, 2014, 07:45:35 AM »
That being said, the P38 pilots have complained about the time it took for them to configure their plane for combat if they got bounced. In some cases it was long enough to get them killed. Compare that to the automatic function of a FW190 and all of the sudden the butcher bird starts to get real life advantages that are never visible in this game.

If we were simulating engineering feats of the 40's, I'd be down for giving the 190 pilots an advantage.   :)
Fighting spirit one must have. Even if a man lacks some of the other qualifications, he can often make up for it in fighting spirit. -Robin Olds
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Offline Zerstorer

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Re: Advertising on SimHQ
« Reply #44 on: June 20, 2014, 08:58:03 AM »
1.) No, AH does not require time wasting to go through a check list procedure for starting or readying for take off, I'm sure it could and would if hitech wanted to go that route, though.... and be every bit the same if not better!

as for the second part of the first point you are trying to make, It is really not that much more difficult to add extra immersion to flying such as DCS or MSFS, you want to know how I know? because I was flying actual Navy flight simulators in both NAS Memphis and NAS Cecilfield from 1985 through 1989.. I was an AD ( Aviation Machinist mate ) and I was both Low Power and High Power Turn qualified for the  A-7 corsair and S-3A Viking, and I did my Training on F-4 Phantoms and A-4 Skyhawks... after I was finished with my scheduled sim training, I could play in the sim until the next person arrived, usually one of the pilots or another Mech, from another squadron......

I have not witnessed anything to ever come close to that in online sims and even come close to being as difficult, which it was not after going through the steps , repetitively, it becomes second nature, just as it does for real life fighter pilots or online dreamers...

as for

2.) I can and do have respect for those that love their flight sims, regardless of the name or company that developed them... and you have no idea of what has been posted in alpha or beta hidden forums of how a bunch of us here and in other games have strived to help the developer improve on their game and such... I am not speaking for everyone, but I am speaking for a bigger majority of Aces High than you might realize, that feel the same as me, and has no hatred or nose stuck up at other sims....... and I still stand by my words......

don't judge me until you know me, right now you are judging!

<S> and cheers!

TC

My comments concerning not showing respect to others simulations was not directed to you, but rather Changeup in response to his post on the Simhq forum. Sorry if that wasn't clear.

The Once and Former Fulcrum

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