To contest myself or not?

[Changeup]

Well, I really didn't have to you see, since it was they that did it.  Only one player, the CO, was actually banned from all events, but with him they banned the squad name, and forced the remaining uninvolved players to reform under a different person and a new name - which is called forcibly disbanding your squad.

This whole "rah rah" be aggressive, barge your way in, type of advice only counts so long as you completely agree with what those who are saying it say or do.  Any contrary opinions, much less arguments voiced, and you risk going the same way as KN/Perdweeb did.

Firing for effect with this next statement:

Grizz and Perdweeb have a lot in common and the community lost a ton with these guys.

[Wizz]

This thread is crap. Lock it mods before it turns into a flame war. Seriously this gonna get ugly...

[Gman]

Why Wizz?  FYI I completely agreed with all you said in your previous post.  Sweeping things under the carpet, and not discussing them openly without risk of a PNG, much less removal from actual parts of the game (events) are part of what is wrong with this picture.

IF AH is going to have this bright new future with "legions" of new players signing up for the new game/model, attitudes need to change, or it's never going to happen.

Many have stated similar things, regarding Grizz, Perdweeb, and a host of others who are gone now, for the most ridiculous of reasons.  I wouldn't have said a thing about it, but when I see one of the architects of the dismissal of one of these players start to say things about having a thick skin and so on, when he had anything but - it's a little much. 

[Randy1]

A really good way to get involved is with the "pickup missions" we have in the game.  i remember my first mission I joined.  I was so afraid I would screw up.  Earl, with the Devil Dogs was running the mission.  He said over the vox after I told him this was my first mission, "Don't worry if you miss. You will get it next time."  Every mission I have been in on since is made up of guys and girls that just do the best they can.  If you miss or screw-up it is no real problem.  If you don't know how to do something just ask.  Lots of friendly advice.

[FLS]

Well, I really didn't have to you see, since it was they that did it.  Only one player, the CO, was actually banned from all events, but with him they banned the squad name, and forced the remaining uninvolved players to reform under a different person and a new name - which is called forcibly disbanding your squad.

This whole "rah rah" be aggressive, barge your way in, type of advice only counts so long as you completely agree with what those who are saying it say or do.  Any contrary opinions, much less arguments voiced, and you risk going the same way as KN/Perdweeb did.

I don't understand your "rah rah be aggressive" comment.

If a squad leader is banned I believe you can reform under the same squad name. I took you to mean everyone in the squad was banned but you're saying that didn't happen.

From my experience I believe any contrary opinion is acceptable to HTC as long as it's presented with the respect everyone is entitled to. Sanctions result from personal insults and trying to force acceptance of other points of view.

[Guppy35]

Firing for effect with this next statement:

Grizz and Perdweeb have a lot in common and the community lost a ton with these guys.

Totally different ballgame between those two.  No comparison between Grizz and Perdweeb

Disrupting for the sake of being disruptive isn't helpful or constructive to anyone. 

[Gman]

Hey Guppy, glad you're back around.

That's the standard I always here - disruptive for the sake of disruption. 

If that's the case, where is the evidence?  Should you not be able to criticize any facet of the game you're paying to play?  That's the point I'm making, ROC is saying to the OP in this thread to toughen up and so on - where was that with him and the CM team?  It wasn't like Perdweeb was acting like Midway with piles of nonsense being posted - there was always a critical point regarding game design or features at the root of it, not just "you're my fighter pilot hero" types of nonsense involved. 

[Arlo]

Dunno why you're comparing apples to bricks and trying to turn the thread into a Perdweeb/KN persecution thang. PD was pretty much an attention diva and got what he tried so hard to get for years. He coulda turned over the squad. That's got nothing to do with telling new players to approach the game with confidence. Please don't look for excuses to infuse a topic with unrelated unresolved issues.

Thanks.

[Changeup]

Totally different ballgame between those two.  No comparison between Grizz and Perdweeb

Disrupting for the sake of being disruptive isn't helpful or constructive to anyone.

Sorry for baiting someone and that someone ended up being you Cork. 

I look at it like this:  there are reasons for both disruptions
and according to modern legend, Grizz created quite a disruption too right?  I mean his disruption is what got him banned, not his simple conviction that the 12 hour rule was BS. 

In that context they are identical...it's a matter of perspective. 

[Gman]

I'm only pointing out the hypocritical nature of telling a "new player", that isn't really "new", to be "aggressive, barge in, have a backbone" and so on to improve his lot, all things that Perdweeb did to the extreme, is the way to go, when this very attitude and method being recommended is something ROC didn't like.  At all.  Having access to the site/area away from HTC where CMs have discussed things for years makes the picture pretty clear on that score.  I was merely responding to the OP and his issue surrounding the cliques of AH.  And it wasn't like Perdweeb was the only victim of that.  SheGotYa, and many other players - where are they now, and why?

If it was amended to say "be aggressive, barge in, so long as you don't do or say anything I don't like", that would be much better and accurate advice to the OP. 

So far as it being apples/bricks, it still comes down to attitude and interaction between players, something the OP said very clearly was his primary issue.  I wouldn't have even posted had ROC not posted, giving advice was is contrary to his past behavior when it comes to said interactions. 

I'll give Arlo what he wants, and let him tell me what I can and can't say, and drop it now.  So long as I get to tell him he has to promise not to post any more pictures or memes for the day, it's a deal.

[Guppy35]

Hey Guppy, glad you're back around.

That's the standard I always here - disruptive for the sake of disruption. 

If that's the case, where is the evidence?  Should you not be able to criticize any facet of the game you're paying to play?  That's the point I'm making, ROC is saying to the OP in this thread to toughen up and so on - where was that with him and the CM team?  It wasn't like Perdweeb was acting like Midway with piles of nonsense being posted - there was always a critical point regarding game design or features at the root of it, not just "you're my fighter pilot hero" types of nonsense involved.

I would have agreed with that when I first encountered it, but as the years of the same BS went on and on despite everyone bending over backwards to try and accommodate, it became nothing but disruption for the sake of stirring the pot.  And it was like clockwork from scenario to FSO and on and on. 

I wasn't paying attention to the boards when the Grizz stuff went down so it's hard to comment on that.  Grizz would give me a hard time off and on and it was usually when I was taking things too seriously.  But it wasnt for the sake of just stirring things up and personally I never felt like I couldn't get along with Grizz

Perdweeb made it clear that his intent was to undermine and disrupt events.  You ask for evidence.  I'd imagine you'd be surprised at all the PMs that were sent and if we had the forums for the events going back you could easily track it.   

Understand the Perdweeb act went on a long time and folks put a ton of effort into trying to make it work.  In the end the powers that be said that's enough and drew the line and he couldn't respect that.  No one to blame but himself

And do understand that you are pointing at ROC now, but the list of folks who just misunderstood Perdweeb is long.  I made the list, shifty, Nef, Fencer, and on and on. 

[Wizz]

Why Wizz?  FYI I completely agreed with all you said in your previous post.  Sweeping things under the carpet, and not discussing them openly without risk of a PNG, much less removal from actual parts of the game (events) are part of what is wrong with this picture.

IF AH is going to have this bright new future with "legions" of new players signing up for the new game/model, attitudes need to change, or it's never going to happen.

Many have stated similar things, regarding Grizz, Perdweeb, and a host of others who are gone now, for the most ridiculous of reasons.  I wouldn't have said a thing about it, but when I see one of the architects of the dismissal of one of these players start to say things about having a thick skin and so on, when he had anything but - it's a little much.

I said lock it because look what this topic is becoming and it's just gonna burn lol  for example the last few post about this squad ban thing. Just see this getting nasty is all

[Volron]

[ROC]

Gman, Aggressive and disruptive are two very different things.  Maybe someday you might figure that out, but I doesn't matter to me if you do or not.  Have a wonderful day

[FLS]

My suggestion to the OP is make friends with a newbie. Start a squad. Request training. Practice with your squad mate.