One second after

[Brooke]

By the way, I suspect that the threat is the same for Europe, that Europe also would today be as vulnerable to EMP.

So, while the EMP commission's report is about the US, I think it would be a useful read and consideration for Europeans as well.

[WaffenVW]

I guess Europe and other high tech societies are just as vulnerable as the U.S.

I've done some reading on the EMP threat since I found this scenario intriguing. The threat to transportation, it seems, is overstated. Most cars would survive the typical strength of a nuclear EMP (22-30 kv/m). Water infrastructure has already mostly been hardened against EMPs and can be run on backup generators if the power grid is disrupted.

You can download the reports here: http://www.empcommission.org/

The potential EMP vulnerability of automobiles derives from the use of built-in elec-
tronics that support multiple automotive functions. Electronic components were first
introduced into automobiles in the late 1960s. As time passed and electronics technolo-
gies evolved, electronic applications in automobiles proliferated. Modern automobiles
have as many as 100 microprocessors that control virtually all functions. While electronic
applications have proliferated within automobiles, so too have application standards and
electromagnetic interference and electromagnetic compatibility (EMI/EMC) practices.
Thus, while it might be expected that increased EMP vulnerability would accompany the
proliferated electronics applications, this trend, at least in part, is mitigated by the
increased application of EMI/EMC practices.
We tested a sample of 37 cars in an EMP simulation laboratory, with automobile vin-
tages ranging from 1986 through 2002. Automobiles of these vintages include extensive
electronics and represent a significant fraction of automobiles on the road today. The
testing was conducted by exposing running and nonrunning automobiles to sequentially
increasing EMP field intensities. If anomalous response (either temporary or permanent)
was observed, the testing of that particular automobile was stopped. If no anomalous
response was observed, the testing was continued up to the field intensity limits of the
simulation capability (approximately 50 kV/m).
Automobiles were subjected to EMP environments under both engine turned off and
engine turned on conditions. No effects were subsequently observed in those automobiles
that were not turned on during EMP exposure. The most serious effect observed on run-
ning automobiles was that the motors in three cars stopped at field strengths of approxi-
mately 30 kV/m or above. In an actual EMP exposure, these vehicles would glide to a
stop and require the driver to restart them. Electronics in the dashboard of one automobile
were damaged and required repair. Other effects were relatively minor. Twenty-five
automobiles exhibited malfunctions that could be considered only a nuisance (e.g.,
blinking dashboard lights) and did not require driver intervention to correct. Eight of the
37 cars tested did not exhibit any anomalous response.
Based on these test results, we expect few automobile effects at EMP field levels below
25 kV/m. Approximately 10 percent or more of the automobiles exposed to higher field
levels may experience serious EMP effects, including engine stall, that require driver
intervention to correct. We further expect that at least two out of three automobiles on the
road will manifest some nuisance response at these higher field levels. The serious mal-
functions could trigger car crashes on U.S. highways; the nuisance malfunctions could
exacerbate this condition. The ultimate result of automobile EMP exposure could be trig-
gered crashes that damage many more vehicles than are damaged by the EMP, the conse-
quent loss of life, and multiple injuries.

[WaffenVW]

Don't get me wrong. It would still be the worst disaster ever, but at least we can play road warrior with AC and power steering!

[Brooke]

The part about the vehicles was the only part that made me thankful.

[WaffenVW]

Well, that also means that diesel generators will be fine. Thus nuke plants will have cooling, hospitals will have power, farmers will have tractors and combines, there will be food in the store, police cars and fire trucks work, the national guard will be motorized rather than marching on foot, trains and ships and cranes will be working... Internal combustion engines working is a major, major deal.

[Rolex]

Let's not forget the carnage as the Social Media Addicted go insane and start jumping off bridges when they can't check their Texts, Tweets, Facebook and Instagram droppings for a whole 5 minutes...

[ghi]

Ghi,
I am sorry, but take your politics and stick them in your arse.

You right, thanks for reminding me ! spread love !

[morfiend]

I guess Europe and other high tech societies are just as vulnerable as the U.S.

I've done some reading on the EMP threat since I found this scenario intriguing. The threat to transportation, it seems, is overstated. Most cars would survive the typical strength of a nuclear EMP (22-30 kv/m). Water infrastructure has already mostly been hardened against EMPs and can be run on backup generators if the power grid is disrupted.

You can download the reports here: http://www.empcommission.org/

  I was sure Ford had worked on shielding the EECIV system in the late 70's and all systems since!

   They have/had a emf/emc room to test the systems,you could hold a florescent bulb in your hand and it would light up like a Tesla experiment. I thought our resident Ford guy would have mentioned this.

  Then there are all the old diesels that require no electricity to run but you'd have a heck of a time hand cranking it over,it could be done and would run as long as it had fuel and air.


 All Canadians have been issued lead foil to line our Igloos as a precautionary measure,we'd hate to see our wifi go down!




     

[Serenity]

Let's not forget the carnage as the Social Media Addicted go insane and start jumping off bridges when they can't check their Texts, Tweets, Facebook and Instagram droppings for a whole 5 minutes...

This is actually a very legitimate point. Everytime Facebook or Google have gone down at the source, I here local police coming on the news and radio BEGGING people to stop calling 911 because they're Facebook doesn't work.

[Bodhi]

WaffenVW,
The tests done by the Commission are very vague and according to their own admission, they could not test to ultimate failure at high level E1 pulses owing to them needing to return the vehicles in an operational condition.  Further, the tests were conducted on vehicle in excess of 12 years old at this point.  Microprocessor technology is expanding at a rapid pace and most new vehicles these days are loaded with them. 
 
As for your diesel generators all working, the Soviets tried that with them during tests in the 60's.  According to the Soviets: "during Soviet high-altitude nuclear tests over Kazakhstan in 1962, rugged diesel generators having no solid state parts were burned out by E1 EMP.  In an important international electromagnetics conference in 1994, after the breakup of the Soviet Union, General Vladimir Loborev delivered an important technical paper in which he stated, "The matter of this phenomenon is that the electrical puncture occurs at the weak point of a system.  Next, the heat puncture is developed at that point, under the action of the power voltage; as a result, the electrical power source is put out of action very often."  This illustrates that even vehicles without an electronic ignition or other electronic components are not completely immune from EMP.

Interesting site to read from on this:
http://www.futurescience.com/emp/vehicles.html

[Brooke]

Yep, the report is pretty clear that many vehicles would be knocked out.

My comment above was just that, at least in the lower ranges of the EMP, some vehicles would survive, and that's a big deal (compared to zero vehicles surviving).

Also, I'm not sure having generators will matter if your electrical wiring is burned out in your building.

[Rolex]

Or if you can't get diesel fuel to those temporary generators...

A solar event seems more likely to bite us somewhere on the planet, than a man-made EMP. I learned the lesson of having blankets, food and water after the earthquake of 2011 in Japan. Now that I have a decent stash, I'm protected by the gods of irony against ever needing to use it.

[WaffenVW]

Unlike a nuclear EMP a solar flare/storm produce a very long pulse frequency which is only hazardous to very long wires like power lines, not electronics. The power grid is still fubar, but cars and most other electrical devices will be fine.

[Brooke]

Unlike a nuclear EMP a solar flare/storm produce a very long pulse frequency which is only hazardous to very long wires like power lines, not electronics. The power grid is still fubar, but cars and most other electrical devices will be fine.

Yep -- cars should be OK.

Things plugged into outlets without surge protection might be ruined.  Not sure if surge protectors would be enough or not (as I haven't looked into the details).

[WaffenVW]

Doubtful, but the fuses should prevent any serious damage to your wiring.