Perk the 88-mm

[guncrasher]

bustr I have landed over 100  in my 5 incher.



semp

[nrshida]

This post has wandered some boundaries that if anyone thought Hitech would take it seriously. The real wish is to have all auto and manned ack along with anti aircraft vehicles removed from the game. It's hard to show some nameless individual how uber you are and how lame they are in the face of your uberness if they won't stop towering you with the press of a button. It just ain't fair.......  

Lolz Bustr, you've really got a bee in your bonnet about skilful AH pilots. It's not like that at all, just a discussion about the balance between air and ground combat. The name of the game isn't 'Hugs All Round and Stay on the Ground if it Scares You' now is it 

bustr I have landed over 100  in my 5 incher.

Don't wory about it Semp. It's the personality that counts! 

[LCADolby]

Man-able ack should be removed for the sake of gameplay. The "he's too good, so i'll shoot him from a AAA to stand a chance" argument I think I began to read doesn't wash with me. AcesHigh needs players on the field of battle in GVs or Aircraft.

[Zimme83]

I dont see man acks as a problem, they are a last resort when the field is overwhelmed and then its the 37mm that are the most effective. But even then they are most of the time less effective than the auto ack and are very easy to kill.

[bustr]

Either you want bodies paying the light bill or you get your own version of a uber utopia until there are about 12 of you left just before Hitech closes the doors and buys a chicken ranch to pay his hanger fees. Or, along the way as the numbers of light bill payers increases, so do the numbers willing to spend more time in a ride rather than in a manned gun. Forcing people to do what they don't want helps them close their wallet and vote with their feet.

Most of the game population that pays the light bill has no interest in getting very good at the  game, and will sit in a manned gun and pop you when you show up. They don't "care about" spending the time getting good at ACM and they don't want to feed themselves all night long to players who they will never be able to shoot down. Manned ack and mobile ack keeps them paying the light bill rather than feeling their only purpose in the game is to pad your score.

That is why I built them a training arena to help them to stay in our game. Numbers breed numbers which will attract more players that want to play this game your way. If you don't like manned ack, don't fly near it. They guy obviously doesn't want to duel you in the MA.

[elc7367b]

I fly fighters, bombers, drive ground vehicles and use manned guns. I love the 88. Have found that some fear it more than auto ack as I have obseved them targeting the 88 first. Perhaps the puffs of black smoke were too close for comfort. Knocking down the orbiting fighter waiting for the vulch is always a thriil, especially if it was from 88mm of pure love.  Learn to use all aspects of the game.  Getting kills in an 88 is a chalenging diversion at times. Something for the wishlist...I would like to see tallies of kills by manned guns of differing types.

Muttman

[MajWoody]

bustr I have landed over 100  in my 5 incher.



semp

I wouldn't have admitted that if I were you.     

[nrshida]

Either you want bodies paying the light bill or you get your own version of a uber utopia until there are about 12 of you left just before Hitech closes the doors and buys a chicken ranch to pay his hanger fees.

This is just black & white thinking.

Most of the game population that pays the light bill has no interest in getting very good at the  game,  and will sit in a manned gun and pop you when you show up.

Perhaps a game centred on air combat would be better off without them then. Or without the guns at least.

They don't "care about" spending the time getting good at ACM

Why should laziness, the pursuit of instant gratification and ego preservation / amplification be allowed to be promoted and reinforced over the main thrust of the game without criticism or comment? As a rebuttal to your continued attack and assignment of blame to the now minority faction of players who have actually bothered to learn ACM:

There is a cohort of players who have played this game for years. Their go-to solution to any ACM problem is to try to drag you through ack, drag you over a Whirble, dive to the deck and run to friendlies or their own base. Of course they’ll be the first there when you’re already engaged, or the first to cap a field with their self-promoting comments on channel 200. I’ve fought or forced a lot of them to fight, often by starting from very disadvantaged position and only turning the knob up to 11 when they're sure you're an easy kill and their ACM is beyond pathetic. They have mistakes in their basic understanding let alone the intermediate principals.

This faction makes DAMN SURE the ‘fights’ go their way to a far more successful extent than the ACM-heads because no amount of advanced ACM can force a person to fight if they always retain the option to disengage. Better energy position, faster planes, faster diving planes, a mass of friendlies, only flying near ack, only flying with wingmen, capping a field. It’s almost trivial to counter someone with better ACM and in my opinion the trend is now on doing this. I don’t mind a percentage of this as variety is important but if the majority play this way it is the end for advanced ACM. The faction I describe promote this as the best method, or funniest of all, realistic.

ACM is well documented. Endless texts and movies on YouTube and we do have a training corps after all. The player group which you berate so hard, with such conviction, those top sticks who could be arsed and have the energy and will to get better are ironically often (not all) the first to offer help if they are actually asked or even if they spot a player who is interested in ACM but untrained. It is pretty well supplied for free to anyone who shows an interest in advanced ACM and has a reasonably-sized ego.

So stop preaching Bustr, about a small faction of skilful players who are damaging the game. There’s a far bigger and more odious faction who are making DAMN SURE the game goes their way at the expense of everybody else's ideas about gameplay.

[nrshida]

And just one last comment about ACM. The notion that Shaw is the seminal text is B/S in my carefully considered opinion. I know and have faced sticks with ACM considerably more advanced than that text describes. AH is (or at least was) a living repository of pre-one-to-one-thrust ratio ACM. Let me flip your point about 'what would happen if all those that have no interest in spending the time getting good, left': in my opinion the ACM heads are now decidedly in the minority. What's the rest of the player base going to do once they've left from utter boredom and frustration? Take pot shots at each other from neighbouring field guns?

[Oldman731]

The faction I describe promote this as the best method, or funniest of all, realistic.

Nothing new there, the debate has raged back and forth between the simulators and the sportsmen for decades.  The game accommodates both, although it seldom completely satisfies either group.

I've never forgotten my first encounter with an ack-runner, probably late 1995 or early 1996.  I went onto the AW BBS the following day and asked if others perceived that this was poor game play.  Virtually all of the responders said it was not.  Sure taught me a lesson.

- oldman

[LCADolby]

And just one last comment about ACM. The notion that Shaw is the seminal text is B/S in my carefully considered opinion.

Deadstik used to go on about that Shaw's book time after time when I first took him under my wing. I don't think I have heard him mention it in years. I think he got the idea was a barrier to his continued growth.

[guncrasher]

nishida perhaps those of us who don't care about ACM are better off without you.  and funny you complain about other instant gratification.  after all that is what you want.  actually only thing you want.


semp

[nrshida]

Nothing new there, the debate has raged back and forth between the simulators and the sportsmen for decades.  The game accommodates both, although it seldom completely satisfies either group.

I really don't care. I really don't care at all how people want to play. I appreciate variety. Some of the best fights I've ever had have been from someone's who's adept at a different branch of ACM to mine. Skill is the thing that interests me and always has. The skilful expression of a difficult art form. What is objecitonable is the notion that those at least trying to push their own boundries are ruining the game for the 'majority' of players, as some seem to be asserting. What a load of Tottenham that is. A steaming pile of Hotspur.

Perhaps this conflict has existed for more than a decade, but the numbers now are so low. When I can usually fly there might be less than 30 online and less than 15 in the air. If most of them are avioding combat then you may as well bog off and do someting else.

Deadstik used to go on about that Shaw's book time after time when I first took him under my wing. I don't think I have heard him mention it in years. I think he got the idea was a barrier to his continued growth.

We sort of came up together Mr. Dolby. You started before me a little bit I think. Interested one day to hear how your development of ACM went.

About the book, bought it, read it, read it again, read it again, highlighted bits, crossed bits out, tore bits out, annotated it, added my own new sections and eventually tossed it out in the trash.  It does describe all of the principals very well but does not describe some of the advanced techniques certain AH players have developed or been taught (in some cases). Neither do many of the sections apply to AH-period ACM.

I've studied very hard even though I've got learning disabilities. After six years I think I'm finally starting to fit the final pieces into the puzzle. The most advanced ACM out there isn't that complicated theoretically (well DrBone can do it, so I can't be  ). A lot of it is very creative and counterintuitive. The execution of it does require practice. If you're massively practicing a sub-set of it (as I did) you are going to eventually run into a player who has practiced a superset set and then you're going to be left thinking 'how did he do that'? Then those fellows will always have a head start on you. That's been my experience at least.

[nrshida]

nishida perhaps those of us who don't care about ACM are better off without you.  and funny you complain about other instant gratification.  after all that is what you want.  actually only thing you want.

I don't think we've ever fought, we just don't share the same timezone so you will not know that there was a long time, about three or four years when I only took about half the shots I was offered. I have and do routinely let aircraft I've damaged go, routinely broken off a one-on-one when one of my countrymen joins in without asking (against another skilful stick) and have spent countelss hours hanging my arse over the proverbial Tom and Jerry fence letting all and sundry take a bite so I can learn a particular piece of ACM. I have died hundreds if not thousands of times 'unecessarily' to stick around and fight it out. Sometimes I can no longer count the opponents I am fighting. I do not even know how most of the scoring system works. I addition I have given hours of my limited free timehelping players who have asked me to help them improve their ACM. Stopped fighting and flown only with them - no shooting. I have written countless, long emails and PMs explaining what and how a particular player might benefit from working on and have sent countless annotated AHF films for the same reason. Whatever I have learned at great cost, I have shared.

Instant gratification, Semp, has been the farthest thing from the main part of my AH journey or main activities.

[guncrasher]

you have no clue what instant gratification is.  your 3 page thesis proves it.  you are more into it than you care to admit.



semp