Uber skilled MA vets

[bustr]

When AH3 goes live, there will be enough free 2 week newbie interest to improve the odds of getting easier kills for less effort. Chances are it will lull a number of the vets back into 1v1 range with them not minding as much getting caught by the vets they have been avoiding.

Then it is up to us to cultivate the newbies or, do our usual of running them out of the game to pump up our egos while blaming Hitech for building a crappy game like we always fall back on.

[FishBait]

When AH3 goes live, there will be enough free 2 week newbie interest to improve the odds of getting easier kills for less effort. Chances are it will lull a number of the vets back into 1v1 range with them not minding as much getting caught by the vets they have been avoiding.

Then it is up to us to cultivate the newbies or, do our usual of running them out of the game to pump up our egos while blaming Hitech for building a crappy game like we always fall back on.

I really appreciate your passion, bustr. And I absolutely agree that if the old vets collectively changed their mindset and went about improving the new-player experience, it would yield in-game improvements for everyone concerned.

However, I don't think it's realistic to approach the problem from a 'players need to change' point of view, because nothing you do or say is going to make enough of a difference to matter. Players are going to play the way they want. I & others browbeat them for not fighting, you and others browbeat them for not leading, and what changes? Nothing.

It is not an insult to HTC or the creative minds backing it to suggest that the game itself needs to be responsible for both recruiting new members and - more importantly - giving them reason to stay (all without completely alienating the existing user base). And I'm sure they're aware of the fact that they can't just hope everyone cares enough about their creation to temper their natural instincts. It would be a very bad business model indeed to rely on the membership to 'act right' in order to retain new players.

We can gripe all we want about how today's gameplay turns off new players - and I absolutely believe it does - but if the issue isn't addressed from within the game itself, I don't hold out much hope for everyone to come together and agree to be 'better players' for the sake of the game. It's not their baby - they don't feel responsible for nursing it - and they shouldn't have to. Most people do not pay $15 / month to take on a PR job. If it's allowed by the game and it's what they like to do they're going to do it.

None of this is to say I disagree with your thoughts. I wish everyone would listen to you... the game would improve dramatically. But they aren't, at least not to the extent necessary to make the kind of change we'd all like to see.

[Tumor]

I venture many vets had more fun back when they didn't know how to read the outcomes and spent more time diving into the fray. And now, we get a post like this one.....

For me, it's more... had more fun back then for a minute or two, just to have it dashed by some gang/picker/ho/etc, so I choose otherwise.  I can still fight.  The difference is, I choose the terms whenever possible.  The terms I choose typically do not afford my opponent an opportunity to impress me with his or her internet badassery...which is just as likely to come from a <front quarter deflection shot> better known as a friggin HO, or some other lame gamey excuse for ACM.  I'm absolutely certain this irritates the ever lovin peepee out of the typical users of gamey lamey excuses for ACM... but that-is-the-point. 

But, when is someone going to define this fight thing everyone keeps whining about not finding.  Just so we'll all know.  Hey, JMHO but it appears to me this so-called fight, is usually someone failing miserably to line up nicely for you to shoot at, which I happen to know for a fact happens all the stinkin time.  Or... maybe it's that Sticky McJerkalot contest that seems so popular.  Is it that thing where you ram your plane into totally ridiculous negative G maneuvers that clearly out-clever AND impress the poop out of EVARBUDY?  Really, we need to straighten this stuff out... just so we're all on the same page. 

[Wiley]

But, when is someone going to define this fight thing everyone keeps whining about not finding.  Just so we'll all know.  Hey, JMHO but it appears to me this so-called fight, is usually someone failing miserably to line up nicely for you to shoot at, which I happen to know for a fact happens all the stinkin time.  Or... maybe it's that Sticky McJerkalot contest that seems so popular.  Is it that thing where you ram your plane into totally ridiculous negative G maneuvers that clearly out-clever AND impress the poop out of EVARBUDY?  Really, we need to straighten this stuff out... just so we're all on the same page. 

From what I've seen, the gist of it is we're all apparently supposed to be below 3k AGL, having committed 1v1 fights.  Shooting from in front of the 4/8 line makes you a Bad Person^tm.  That will catch most of the definition.

I'm just happy when my opponents try to kill me.  It's up to me to manage the gang/HO/whatever else.

I didn't come in here as a completely green noob, but I really don't see much difference between now and when I came here as far as vets crushing new guys.  It happened back then, it happens now.  Trainers are just as available today as 7 years ago from what I see.

I don't see the kinds of guys like Levi that people talk about going in under 6 or 7 enemies and killing them all then flying home these days either.  Now maybe the Levi level guys were just freaks and one time occurrences, but I don't see that level of play in here anymore.  I'd say the top top guys today might be less capable than the ones of yore are reputed to be, but that could be the Bill Brasky effect as well.  Haven't seen them can't say.

Wiley.

[FX1]

H2H was a good start for a new players wanting to try out the game. You could tweak the plane set and also items like ammo load out. I feel that it would be to HTC interest to bring back something similar so that people can have a fun no pay arena to develop their addiction.

Btw I don't see anyone landing high 12 plus kill sorties like back in the day. Personally I haven't match any of my old stats and feel that because of the level of game play that we have today those days are gone. I had multiple sorties in a 16 with 16 kills.

[bustr]

We have had guys admitting the only reason they became a subscriber was because Hitech eliminated the free to play H2H arenas. Free to play creates a freeloader community with our kind of game with people getting their fix and never moving into the subscriber arenas. AH3 has many things we tested since Aug 2014 with some of them having nothing to do with getting your ego slaughtered 24x7.

[Hajo]

In AW they had an arena for new people.   Once you reached a certain number of points you could not re enter the new player arena.

You either had to go to relaxed real or full real.  I was rightly assumed you would be flying against others that were new to the game also.

As I remember it was about 10,000 points.  Maybe not a bad idea now.  And if you tried to log in to the newbie arena after reaching that point you were not allowed.

[The Fugitive]

You were allowed in, but you didn't get any bullets. I use to spend an hour or so being a tough target for newbis. Helped me learn to avoid, helped new player learn to fight, and made a bunch of friends, many of which joined my squad when they came over to the other arenas.

[dirtdart]

Funny thread in a way. If you take Shuffler's analogy to Nintendo Cheat Codes, that was probably the substance of new guy conversation in the MA for years. "There is no way a K4 can outclimb a mustang"..."that guy probably hacked the code to make his plane lighter"..."he has the warp button on his joystick"..."he has a bot aiming for him"... and so on and so forth.

It would seem though that his other point is valid as well, for the un-educated. Guy builds mustangs as models for years. Saw every program on them. Joins AH and immediately feels like the game is off when he can't demolish a Ki-43 in a turn fight. It is the game, not the plane. That why squads are so important to the game. It was not until I was with the few that I really began to understand what the planes could really do. With the swampdragons, we focused on raids, so I got good with rockets and bombs. The few on the other hand flew fighters more than anything else and did training. It was then I learned about torque, managing throttle, what planes cannot turn right in a dive, etc.

IMHO, if you want the game to survive, you have to 1. not be a dick and 2. not be selfish. There will always be turds in the game who enjoy picking guys off the runway, but for most it is just a phase. The game became much more fun to play what someone taught me, over time, how to fight. Heck, I used to roll a P-38 with the 80th, just to get tips on crashing on the runway without exploding, to land some 38 kills <S> fellahs.

No restriction will help. The perk rides, really are not that big of an advantage unless they are in the hands of a few of the players who have reverted to score-wh mode.

Personally I just got back from the middle east, again, and am going to get some family time in before getting back into the game. I left the game because my last two jobs would have AH competing for my fractional family time (MAJ KD for vets).

In the end, it is and remains the people that would draw me back to the game. For 10-years or so, I made some good on-line firends. Had a chance to meet a couple in person. The community is what would pull me back, more so than the game. Really, how many WWII airplane nerds are out there? Can your kids/wife distinguish the lines of a P-51 vs. P38? Lol.

Don't be a dick, welcome new people in, invest time getting to know the new folks. If it had not been for SLAYEM, H, and the other swampy's I don't know how long I would have stayed in the game.

[Gman]

^ ^ ^ ^ Good points, agreed.

In AW they had an arena for new people.   Once you reached a certain number of points you could not re enter the new player arena.

You either had to go to relaxed real or full real.  I was rightly assumed you would be flying against others that were new to the game also.

As I remember it was about 10,000 points.  Maybe not a bad idea now.  And if you tried to log in to the newbie arena after reaching that point you were not allowed.

I missed the AW era, playing offline sims instead and hadn't heard of this until now.  You might be on to something, indeed (that's my British word for the day), perhaps not a bad idea now.  Particularly with AH3 coming, and a strong possibility of an influx of new blood, which HTC will want to keep for at least that 1 -2 year period they've described their business model being based on for the meat of their turnover/clients.   

Should wishlist this one IMO.

[Scca]

^ ^ ^ ^ Good points, agreed.


I missed the AW era, playing offline sims instead and hadn't heard of this until now.  You might be on to something, indeed (that's my British word for the day), perhaps not a bad idea now.  Particularly with AH3 coming, and a strong possibility of an influx of new blood, which HTC will want to keep for at least that 1 -2 year period they've described their business model being based on for the meat of their turnover/clients.   

Should wishlist this one IMO.

They have this concept in iRacing. The problem is, what if there's no one in the arena?  When I tried iRacing, there was no one to race at my level, so I quit.

[wil3ur]

Well, an interesting perspective was had this weekend.  My nephew was in town visiting and was interested in this game and wanted to fly and kill some things. So I get him strapped in and show him the basic controls.  He was OK, but completely new to the sim world.  After a couple flights he managed to find an engagement and augered.  At which point I received a PM from a very happy 1star noob saying "BHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA" to which I politely replied I have my nephew in and he's learing to fly, the response was "Tell him I said, "BHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA"!.

So yea, being that this is the internet, people still want to be an stooge to an 8 year old.

Classy folks.

 

[Someguy63]

At which point I received a PM from a very happy 1star noob saying "BHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA" to which I politely replied I have my nephew in and he's learing to fly, the response was "Tell him I said, "BHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA"!.

So yea, being that this is the internet, people still want to be an stooge to an 8 year old.

Classy folks.

 

What an ass.

It's pathetic really...

[Ack-Ack]

^ ^ ^ ^ Good points, agreed.


I missed the AW era, playing offline sims instead and hadn't heard of this until now.  You might be on to something, indeed (that's my British word for the day), perhaps not a bad idea now.  Particularly with AH3 coming, and a strong possibility of an influx of new blood, which HTC will want to keep for at least that 1 -2 year period they've described their business model being based on for the meat of their turnover/clients.   

Should wishlist this one IMO.

For years I've advocated the creation of a new player's arena styled after Air Warrior's new player's arena.  There are dozens of posts I've made through the years on this forum asking for the new player arena to be created as a way to help retain new players and to aid them in getting over the steep learning curve before entering the Lords of the Flies mentality of the MA.  The new player arena in AW did help retain a large number of new players as once they left that arena and jumped in one of the main arenas, they were more confident of being successful than they were before taking advantage of the new player arena and less likely to quit the game out of frustration due to the game's difficulty.  Once a new player gets over that hurdle, they are more likely to remain a paying customer.

[bustr]

The DA furball lake filled that roll for a few years. There were whole squads in there and some even thought they were better at the game than the MA vets who dropped in from time to time. I guess they were if it was 12v1 or HOing. But, it gave them a community and for the most part kept them out of the MA. Wasn't a bad place to do a few warm ups before facing the sharks in the MA.