Author Topic: Please dial down the puff ack and manned ack accuracy  (Read 6359 times)

Offline The Fugitive

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Re: Please dial down the puff ack and manned ack accuracy
« Reply #60 on: September 29, 2016, 07:17:04 PM »
Are there any stats to prove that fighters are not the most popular in the game anymore? I don't know that what you arre implying is actually the best idea.

I also think that changing the game toward a more tank and ground oriented game, won't help the #s because there  is too much other competition for that type of gameplay. I'm not saying Hitech shouldn't work to make it as good as it could be. But shutting out the players that once made the furballs vast and the aircombat exciting, will only lead to more players logging off or canceling in boredom.

I agree with a lot of what Junky wrote except the score part. I don't think field gun scores really matter. I also do think the map does make a big difference. Other than that, I think he made some great points regarding that the fighter aspect to the game has not been "helped" and the maps have not been modeled to create better fights. That's just my opinion. I like some of the current maps, but I'd really like to see more condensed maps being created so that flying times are a bit shorter between bases. It would make a HUGE difference.

I also agree with the whole M3 thing. It's just a tease when you are trying to capture a base and it's a non stop cat and mouse game with no real combat action involved.

The more you see people racing to manned guns and getting cheap kills, or racing to hop in tanks instead of fighters, the game just staggers and the fights slowly die. Again, this happens because people don't see enemy tanks on the map, which causes the perception that there are no fights on the map. That is not what I want to see. I think Hitech has a great model and game for air combat. I don't want that part to diminish. Brining back the fighter aspect to the game would bring a lot of customers back and bring new players who just enjoy open map air combat. It would make the fights look bigger on the maps thus bringing more and more people to the fight, regardless of the type of game play they want to utilize. I've always thought tanks should be used as support for the fighters and not vice versa, if the game changes to a fighters supporting tank type game, I don't think the #s will increase and I think you will continue to see staggering fights.

Thats the point tho, your looking at it from a "fighters" point of view. You see the fighter guys leaving, you see the lack of fights, you see the players running to ack, jumping in guns or GVs and so on.

Look at from the base grabbers point of view. There are plenty of missions, luckily most are NOE so they are quicker. Grabbing bases is fun and much easier to do with a big group of players. Better chance of you making it in as there are more targets for those sharks that seem to show up. Gv spawns are not to far so if they get shot down, it is easier to avoid those sharks when your in a GV

The them there is nothing wrong with the game other than there seems to be too many sharks, but luckily they seem to be quitting..... cant wait until they are all gone! They are happy with a couple hundred players and most of them sucking in fighters because for them to play, less fighters make it easier.

My argument would be look at numbers in the MA long ago vs where they are today...there were more furballers and more profit coming in from what we could tell by general late war numbers. From the people I personally interact with, it's the air combat guys who have been leaving from the game when they used to have way more then just 30% of the player base. I understand your logic but is Aces High really going to compete with world of tanks for a tank simulator? No the maps are too big to add that sort of detail to the ground game. They can however compete with War Thunder because of the flight model and IL2 because they overall WW2 combat simulation is better(they may have a more real flight model but for a lot that's not the only thing they are looking for....that's based off what I was told from people playing il2, never tested it's flight model because I'm not sure Id run that game well.)

Yes 10 years ago we had more fighter/furballers, we also didn't have buffs or GVs for awhile either. As those other things were added, players expanded what they played in, new player joined up just for the GVs.

Can AH3 compete with all those other flight games and tank games? Sure, why not? I think what AH3 has far out shines those other games in the "FULLNESS" of what is provided.

Personally I'd like to see more fighters that fight. I hope for the day when that part of the game comes back around again as Im sure it will. Back in the old day when we had all those furballs I was a very poor player. Atleast now if they were to come back I might be ok at it  :D I also look forward to missions that have more of a plan than "grab the fastest cannon bird that can carry a bomb, run NOE and every one hit the FH and VH"

The point is that HTC isnt going to change anything to push people back into fighters. Many players are here to just GV, or run NOE and drop FH and VHs. It is what they are paying their $15 for. How long would you guys be playing the game if the rule was you had to run 2 buff missions for every fighter you took up? Not long I suspect because you don't like running buffs. Thats ok, but don't expect GV guys to be happy being forced to fly fighters either.

It is what it is.

Offline Slade

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Re: Please dial down the puff ack and manned ack accuracy
« Reply #61 on: September 30, 2016, 05:49:26 AM »
Quote
It's mostly the manned acks I'm talking about.

That is my finding too.  Manned ACK is uncannily accurate in AH3.

This is my observation using multiple and diverse data points, i.e. multiple bases, players, plane orientations etc.

+1 to change this.  Thanks.
« Last Edit: September 30, 2016, 05:51:21 AM by Slade »
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Offline DmonSlyr

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Re: Please dial down the puff ack and manned ack accuracy
« Reply #62 on: September 30, 2016, 09:25:33 AM »
Thats the point tho, your looking at it from a "fighters" point of view. You see the fighter guys leaving, you see the lack of fights, you see the players running to ack, jumping in guns or GVs and so on.

Look at from the base grabbers point of view. There are plenty of missions, luckily most are NOE so they are quicker. Grabbing bases is fun and much easier to do with a big group of players. Better chance of you making it in as there are more targets for those sharks that seem to show up. Gv spawns are not to far so if they get shot down, it is easier to avoid those sharks when your in a GV

The them there is nothing wrong with the game other than there seems to be too many sharks, but luckily they seem to be quitting..... cant wait until they are all gone! They are happy with a couple hundred players and most of them sucking in fighters because for them to play, less fighters make it easier.

Yes 10 years ago we had more fighter/furballers, we also didn't have buffs or GVs for awhile either. As those other things were added, players expanded what they played in, new player joined up just for the GVs.

Can AH3 compete with all those other flight games and tank games? Sure, why not? I think what AH3 has far out shines those other games in the "FULLNESS" of what is provided.

Personally I'd like to see more fighters that fight. I hope for the day when that part of the game comes back around again as Im sure it will. Back in the old day when we had all those furballs I was a very poor player. Atleast now if they were to come back I might be ok at it  :D I also look forward to missions that have more of a plan than "grab the fastest cannon bird that can carry a bomb, run NOE and every one hit the FH and VH"

The point is that HTC isnt going to change anything to push people back into fighters. Many players are here to just GV, or run NOE and drop FH and VHs. It is what they are paying their $15 for. How long would you guys be playing the game if the rule was you had to run 2 buff missions for every fighter you took up? Not long I suspect because you don't like running buffs. Thats ok, but don't expect GV guys to be happy being forced to fly fighters either.

It is what it is.

Do you need a Snickers Fugitive? You sound like a lil ole grandmother.

I bet if you spent one Friday or Saturday night riding along with me in my plane, I could show you how to A. Avoid HOs properly, and gain the upper hand. B. I could show you to fight against these sharks and even become one by using proper tactics that are successful. This game has always been filled with great players. It's always been challenging as hell. That's why I still play it. The sharks are not the problem. People are allowed to be good at the game. I got my arse beat by the best for years to learn how to be a good fighter, and be good in the MA. I know how the MA works quite well, which is why I'm a Top 4 fighter for 10 months running. I know how people fly and their tendencies for actions. Getting in a manned ack won't encourage anyone to learn better tactics. It must be a vicious cycle never learning how to be better but always taking the easy way out getting in a manned gun.

See, I believe that if the the bases were closer, it would create much larger fights around multiple bases, that would eliminate hard core vulching and ganging bases. It would make it harder for gangs to be successful. This would make it so "sharks" don't have a big advantage attacking uppers because bases are closer from the back fields to counter from a fairer alt. Also, if there is a lot of action around multiple bases, you can see the excitement level grow around that area. It would create lower fights which would create faster game play and quicker action times. It would solve 95% of the low action complaints and build a more exciting and bigger player base.
« Last Edit: September 30, 2016, 09:28:08 AM by DmonSlyr »
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Offline The Fugitive

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Re: Please dial down the puff ack and manned ack accuracy
« Reply #63 on: September 30, 2016, 04:12:46 PM »
Do you need a Snickers Fugitive? You sound like a lil ole grandmother.

I bet if you spent one Friday or Saturday night riding along with me in my plane, I could show you how to A. Avoid HOs properly, and gain the upper hand. B. I could show you to fight against these sharks and even become one by using proper tactics that are successful. This game has always been filled with great players. It's always been challenging as hell. That's why I still play it. The sharks are not the problem. People are allowed to be good at the game. I got my arse beat by the best for years to learn how to be a good fighter, and be good in the MA. I know how the MA works quite well, which is why I'm a Top 4 fighter for 10 months running. I know how people fly and their tendencies for actions. Getting in a manned ack won't encourage anyone to learn better tactics. It must be a vicious cycle never learning how to be better but always taking the easy way out getting in a manned gun.

I spent a Saturday afternoon fighting against you once. We were in 109s and I was hoping to learn something from you as you fly them a lot. 6-8 fights.....all of which you won... and I was getting to the point that the fights were lasting longer and while I may not have been pushing you, you weren't killing me. Next thing I know you fire on a HO and I go down. I asked "Why the HO?" you said "It was the only way I could get you." That was the last fight I had with you that day. I would have spent the afternoon padding your score, but you went and HOed. At that point, I figured whats the point and moved on to some other fight.

Many people in here don't have THAT much will to go head to head with another player. I like a good fight and as long as I was getting them I was game, win or lose. Others feel like they suck in a fighter and just wont bother to learn more. I can't tell you how many times I've read or heard someone say "I suck in fighters thats why I only fly buffs." or the same but "run GVs" instead of flying. Most people are not like you. They don't care to learn to get better in a fighter because they think themselves a "lost cause" already, no point in wasting the time. Silly way to look at it, it is just a game and practice and time will make you better. But they dont look at it that way.

Other people just don't care to fly, period! They are here to drive GVs and piss off fighter jocks with long range gunnery. There is nothing that could be down to get them in a plane and fight. Its not why they are here.

Quote
See, I believe that if the the bases were closer, it would create much larger fights around multiple bases, that would eliminate hard core vulching and ganging bases. It would make it harder for gangs to be successful. This would make it so "sharks" don't have a big advantage attacking uppers because bases are closer from the back fields to counter from a fairer alt. Also, if there is a lot of action around multiple bases, you can see the excitement level grow around that area. It would create lower fights which would create faster game play and quicker action times. It would solve 95% of the low action complaints and build a more exciting and bigger player base.

If the bases were closer it would give the sharks quicker access to the attack on the base. As it is now, missions drop the FHs because they cant/wont fight against ANY defense. This is why on "island" maps you see so many NOEs. Very few mountains to fly over on the ocean so even a real newb can stay under the dar.

The only thing that will bring in quicker action is better numbers. As the numbers go up so will the number of players who like to fight. So will the number of missions that will be run. Get 400 players in the MA again and you wont have any complaints about fights..... well ok a few as there are those who just love to complain.  :devil
« Last Edit: September 30, 2016, 04:16:45 PM by The Fugitive »

Offline caldera

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Re: Please dial down the puff ack and manned ack accuracy
« Reply #64 on: September 30, 2016, 06:54:48 PM »
If you get hit by a 37mm field gun, you are too close to the field.  Longest hit I've ever recorded on single engine aircraft was 3.5k - and only 3 or 4 times in ten years.  Anyone upping when an enemy fighter is that close is only ringing the dinner bell for a vulching.  Back off and let them come to you, if you really want a fight.

Now, 88mm guns should either have their firing angles restricted to very steep angles for bomber defense, or just scrapped altogether.  People taking long range potshots at fighters with the 88s are nothing but griefers.
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Offline Slade

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Re: Please dial down the puff ack and manned ack accuracy
« Reply #65 on: October 01, 2016, 07:41:03 AM »
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People taking long range potshots at fighters with the 88s are nothing but griefers.

...and in AH3 they are hitting with AMAZING accuracy.

I think some that never thought about a career as a field gunner have discovered a new vocation.  :rolleyes:

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Offline JimmyD3

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Re: Please dial down the puff ack and manned ack accuracy
« Reply #66 on: October 01, 2016, 12:35:36 PM »
If you get hit by a 37mm field gun, you are too close to the field.  Longest hit I've ever recorded on single engine aircraft was 3.5k - and only 3 or 4 times in ten years.  Anyone upping when an enemy fighter is that close is only ringing the dinner bell for a vulching.  Back off and let them come to you, if you really want a fight.

Now, 88mm guns should either have their firing angles restricted to very steep angles for bomber defense, or just scrapped altogether.  People taking long range potshots at fighters with the 88s are nothing but griefers.

I must confess, I AM A GRIEF'ER. Don't really hit anything much, but I am getting better at it.  :aok
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Offline JunkyII

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Re: Please dial down the puff ack and manned ack accuracy
« Reply #67 on: October 01, 2016, 05:33:01 PM »

Now, 88mm guns should either have their firing angles restricted to very steep angles for bomber defense, or just scrapped altogether.  People taking long range potshots at fighters with the 88s are nothing but griefers.
Agree
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Offline Slade

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Re: Please dial down the puff ack and manned ack accuracy
« Reply #68 on: October 02, 2016, 08:49:55 AM »
Maybe I was wrong or they have been in 37 pounders.

I spent some time in an 88 and am hitting as terrible as ever.  Maybe as luck would have it,  I simply ran into multiple and consecutive bases that had great fields gunners.  :old:

More time and posts from others could be helpful on this topic.
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Offline lunatic1

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Re: Please dial down the puff ack and manned ack accuracy
« Reply #69 on: October 02, 2016, 10:13:07 AM »
About 4 or 5 times now I've been instantly towered with 3-5 kills without even a second to think. I'm about 7-10K away from a CV or a base and all the sudden im sitting in the tower in awwe. I don't want this to sound like a complaint, buts it's gotten to the point where people are just being sniped out of the sky with easy to aim puff acks. I don't mind if people have the ability to defend like that. But being able to snipe planes with 1 easy to aim ack that far away just kills the mood.

No, in AH2 if a plane was attacking your field-it just luck if the eney plane got a fuel hit.
i like the way it is now. i don't care if i get shot down by field-town or fleet ack.
esp when most countries hord the bases they want-you gotta have some defense..and i think they should add more guns to the single VH V bases
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Offline DmonSlyr

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Re: Please dial down the puff ack and manned ack accuracy
« Reply #70 on: October 02, 2016, 11:52:38 AM »
No, in AH2 if a plane was attacking your field-it just luck if the eney plane got a fuel hit.
i like the way it is now. i don't care if i get shot down by field-town or fleet ack.
esp when most countries hord the bases they want-you gotta have some defense..and i think they should add more guns to the single VH V bases

My wish is mostly about manned acks, and mostly the 88 or 5 inch in general. Hoards should be defended against from squads from a back base. Hoarding bases is part of the game, it is part of war. Puff acks should be hard to shoot. It should invariably be a "luck" shot. The AI puff is actually alright. I flew around a CV ack as I was defending my own base the other day. Didn't get a lick once in a 25 minute sortie in my 109. BUT, the manned 88 ack on a CV or field should be very difficult to actually hit someone with, if it's going to bring the scrutiny it creates with a 1 shot kill.
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Offline Randy1

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Re: Please dial down the puff ack and manned ack accuracy
« Reply #71 on: October 02, 2016, 12:36:57 PM »
You really need the 88 to push back vulchers that are there for only one reason.  If you cannot even get the wheels in the well, the 88 can give you some room to at least get to turning speed.

Offline Ack-Ack

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Re: Please dial down the puff ack and manned ack accuracy
« Reply #72 on: October 02, 2016, 02:54:54 PM »


Now, 88mm guns should either have their firing angles restricted to very steep angles for bomber defense, or just scrapped altogether. 

That's a terrible solution, since the German 88mm had no such restrictions in real life.
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Offline caldera

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Re: Please dial down the puff ack and manned ack accuracy
« Reply #73 on: October 02, 2016, 02:59:21 PM »
That's a terrible solution, since the German 88mm had no such restrictions in real life.

And they didn't shoot at 109s either.  It would be a concession to game play.
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Offline Ack-Ack

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Re: Please dial down the puff ack and manned ack accuracy
« Reply #74 on: October 02, 2016, 03:04:47 PM »
And they didn't shoot at 109s either.  It would be a concession to game play.

No, it wouldn't be a concession to game play.  What it would be is a concession to those players that want to make it easier for themselves to either attack a base or attack enemy near the base without danger of acks shooting them down.  Using "and they didn't shoot at 109's either." is a rather stupid counter point since in this game we do not re-create WW2, so your argument is irrelevant.
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