Author Topic: After 10 years. Time for a new Bang for buck system  (Read 6325 times)

Offline Skuzzy

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Re: After 10 years. Time for a new Bang for buck system
« Reply #30 on: December 11, 2018, 08:55:59 AM »
The bit coin crazies did mess up the market, really badly.  When they suddenly stopped buying video cards, distributors got stuck with enormous inventories of product they cannot move due to new cards coming out.  NVidia refuses to take any of the old inventory back, and it appears they have kept the new card prices very high to try and drive people to buy up the old inventory.

Prices have also been impacted by the high cost of memory chips.  The on-going investigations into price fixing have shown the memory makers have been working together on that,...again.

Horrible time to need a video card.
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Offline Bizman

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Re: After 10 years. Time for a new Bang for buck system
« Reply #31 on: December 11, 2018, 10:03:13 AM »
For the motherboard, Gigabyte is just one of those having a good name. I've been as happy with mine as you have been with yours for the last decade so it was a natural choice for the price. Asus and MSI build good boards as well. The main specs I'd look for are Japan/Military capacitors for durability and a Z### chipset for overclocking capability, plus full size ATX for expansion cards and better cooling due to larger surface area. Also, if there's a bunch of boards with a slightly different ending in the name, I'd choose the cheapest one unless there's a feature I'd definitely want. The chipset tells the speed of the motherboard buses, add-ons like Wi-Fi, not to mention lighting only add to the price.

For the manirelli build... I'm not a great fan of liquid cooling, partially because transporting them in winter conditions for hours to meetings might cause freezing, potentially harming the hoses etc. For the same price you'd get an at least equally powerful and more silent Noctua air cooler. The pros and cons of SSD's have already been discussed in this thread as well as the size of a HDD. The video card... There's been talk that the 20## series is way overpriced compared to the performance gain over the 10## series. There's new features which may or more likely may not become mainstream in games. Instead of a GTX2070 I'd choose a 1070 and save $180, or a 1070Ti and save $120. That can be upgraded in the future if needed.
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I've got an older system by today's standards that still runs the game well by my standards.

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Offline Spikes

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Re: After 10 years. Time for a new Bang for buck system
« Reply #32 on: December 11, 2018, 10:25:31 AM »
That build is a bit over your price range but could be slimmed down to get within it. As Bizman said, the 2000 series cards are overkill and overpriced at the moment. The RTX stuff will more than likely take a couple generations to take off, if at all.

I think with any $1200 build it would be ridiculous to not have an SSD boot drive. Even a $120gb one is like sub-$30.
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Offline TequilaChaser

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Re: After 10 years. Time for a new Bang for buck system
« Reply #33 on: December 11, 2018, 04:12:16 PM »
I personally don't mind using "Crucial" (they make Micron as well as some other stuff) SSD's for my boot drive in my computers.... I have 3 different machines that have been running since April 2011 for 1st PC, August 2011 for other 2 PCs, and only one issue that was fixed via a firmware update on the 2nd build...not sure how I even missed it because the 1st and 3rd PC builds have the same SSD as the 2nd build...and I somehow managed to update them yet missed updating the 2nd build and it took me 6 months to figure out what was going on...LOL

But I recommend that you back your SSD boot drive up to a storage HD including maybe doing a disc image every few months at least.....  I do weekly backups myself

Edit: not all SSDs are the same... Some manufacturers are better than others, and within any given SSD manufacturer's product line, you will find some great/good products then there will be some not worth your time or money.... You really want to research and read up on what is what regarding SSD products and the different types of attaching ie... Sata, pcie, M2 etc.....


Hope this helps


TC
« Last Edit: December 11, 2018, 04:19:53 PM by TequilaChaser »
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Offline Skuzzy

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Re: After 10 years. Time for a new Bang for buck system
« Reply #34 on: December 12, 2018, 06:25:29 AM »
Just FYI TC, Micron makes Crucial, not the other way around.
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Offline Denniss

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Re: After 10 years. Time for a new Bang for buck system
« Reply #35 on: December 12, 2018, 06:28:59 AM »
On SSDs you may want to buy from a company that is actually using its own flash chips not some brand that may use a wide variety of flash chips.
Those firstline brands would be Samsung, Crucial(Micron) and AFAIR Western Digital with Sandisk/Toshiba under their hood.
Of the second line rebranders but usually with good support/warranty I personally prefer Kingston.

Something to be care of when selecting SSD: some cheaper versions are without DRAM cache that may suffer some performance penalties, the new QLC flash type is rather slow and intended for big and reasonably priced data storage SSDs + no experience yet about the expected lifetime (1st gen TLC had lots of problems so I'd wait for 2nd gen QLC to be sure)

Offline DREDIOCK

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Re: After 10 years. Time for a new Bang for buck system
« Reply #36 on: December 12, 2018, 07:08:22 AM »
CPU/motherboard question.

I see the CPUs require 300 series compatible motherboards.
Unfortunately on Amazon I dont see any of the motherboards listed as being (300 series) compatible but rather say "8th generation compatible"
Is 300 series and 8th Gen the same thing?
. What I am going ot do it just put a parts list out there and whatever they gt they get and Ill just get the difference myself. But I know their preferred method of shopping is Amazon. Soooo...
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Offline Denniss

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Re: After 10 years. Time for a new Bang for buck system
« Reply #37 on: December 12, 2018, 10:24:10 AM »
8th gen Intel Core CPU require 300-series motherboards

Offline Bizman

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Re: After 10 years. Time for a new Bang for buck system
« Reply #38 on: December 12, 2018, 01:14:53 PM »
Drediock, just go to https://pcpartpicker.com/list/ and start building. The compatibility check should be on by default so your compilation should work. How well, depends on the speed of the components.
Quote from: BaldEagl, applies to myself, too
I've got an older system by today's standards that still runs the game well by my standards.

Kotisivuni

Offline DREDIOCK

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Re: After 10 years. Time for a new Bang for buck system
« Reply #39 on: December 12, 2018, 06:40:40 PM »
POWER Suppplies.
Skuzzy.
I know you are a stickler and pretty particular on the things. Which ones are worth looking at these days?
Seasonics? EVGAs?.....
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Offline Spikes

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Re: After 10 years. Time for a new Bang for buck system
« Reply #40 on: December 12, 2018, 07:12:52 PM »
I've liked the EVGA Supernovas over the last few years. EVGA warranty and support can't be beat.
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Offline Skuzzy

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Re: After 10 years. Time for a new Bang for buck system
« Reply #41 on: December 12, 2018, 08:14:01 PM »
You are correct.  I am very picky about power supplies.  As the driving DC voltage continues to drop, ripple and noise that used to be fine at 5V, is no longer acceptable at 1.5V.

The Seasonic Titanium series is about the best there is in power supplies.  With dynamic load regulation it allows the supply to run cooler and cleaner when the power demand is at low levels.   This is something that has plagued systems with high end video cards which pull all manner of power levels.  Ripple and noise are virtually non-existent, across the board.  A 12 year warranty is also pretty nice.

Most of EVGA's power supplies are made by FSP (the Supernova line, for example).  They are considered an average power supply manufacturer.  Nothing bad about them, just a middle of the road supply.  Should be cheaper than the comparable wattage Seasonic.
« Last Edit: December 12, 2018, 08:17:13 PM by Skuzzy »
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Offline DREDIOCK

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Re: After 10 years. Time for a new Bang for buck system
« Reply #42 on: December 13, 2018, 06:37:17 AM »
Thank you everyone for the input.

Cases.
 What is with the fixation of a bottom mounted power supply? Why? Is there a technical reason for this?
I kinda prefer them to be at the top so as to provide easy and fast access to the main power switch without having to crawl under my desk.
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Offline Bizman

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Re: After 10 years. Time for a new Bang for buck system
« Reply #43 on: December 13, 2018, 07:33:38 AM »
The bottom mounted PSU takes its cooling air from the bottom,  preferably through a filter. The PSU gets cooler air that way and it also allows for more efficient air outflow from the top.

One caveat: Ensure that there's enough air below the case! Some have very low feet inherited from the older design and even the higher legged models should not be put directly on a thick carpet. A metal grid flower pot tray with wheels seems like a perfect solution for those.
Quote from: BaldEagl, applies to myself, too
I've got an older system by today's standards that still runs the game well by my standards.

Kotisivuni

Offline DREDIOCK

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Re: After 10 years. Time for a new Bang for buck system
« Reply #44 on: December 13, 2018, 09:03:16 PM »
Ok here is the parts list Im leaning toward putting forth

Anyone see any problems before anyone orders anything?

CPU =
Intel Core i5-9600K Desktop Processor 6 Cores up to 4.6 GHz Turbo Unlocked LGA1151 300 Series 95W
https://www.amazon.com/dp/B07HHLX1R8/?tag=pcpapi-20

OR

Intel Core i5-8600K Desktop Processor 6 Cores up to 4.3 GHz unlocked LGA 1151 300 Series 95W
https://www.amazon.com/dp/B0759FKH8K/?tag=pcpapi-20

CPU Fan/Cooler
ARCTIC Freezer 13 CPU Cooler - Intel & AMD, 200W Cooling Capacity, 92mm PWM Fan
https://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16835186039&Description=ARCTIC%20Freezer%2013%20CPU%20Cooler%20-%20Intel%20%26%20AMD%2c%20200W%20Cooling%20Capacity%2c%2092mm%20PWM%20Fan&cm_re=ARCTIC_Freezer_13_CPU_Cooler_-_Intel_%26_AMD%2c_200W_Cooling_Capacity%2c_92mm_PWM_Fan-_-35-186-039-_-Product

Motherboard = (MUST SAY 300 SERIES Compatable)

Gigabyte - Z370P D3 ATX LGA1151 Motherboard
https://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813145048&Description=Gigabyte%20-%20Z370P%20D3%20ATX%20LGA1151%20Motherboard&cm_re=Gigabyte_-_Z370P_D3_ATX_LGA1151_Motherboard-_-13-145-048-_-Product

Video Card
Gigabyte - GeForce GTX 1060 6GB 6 GB WINDFORCE OC 6G Video Card
https://www.amazon.com/dp/B01JNUO6BG/?tag=pcpapi-20

Memory
CORSAIR Vengeance LPX 16GB (2 x 8GB) 288-Pin DDR4 SDRAM DDR4 2400 (PC4 19200) Memory Kit Model CMK16GX4M2A2400C14R
https://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820233833&ignorebbr=1&nm_mc=AFC-C8Junction&cm_mmc=AFC-C8Junction-PCPartPicker,%20LLC-_-na-_-na-_-na&cm_sp=&AID=10446076&PID=3938566&SID=

Hard Drive
Seagate 2TB 64MB Cache 7200RPM SATA2 3.0Gb/s (Heavy-Duty) Internal Desktop 3.5" Hard Drive -NAS/RAID/PC/DVR
https://www.amazon.com/Seagate-7200RPM-Heavy-Duty-Internal-Desktop/dp/B01A8KTK5M/ref=sr_1_fkmr0_4?s=electronics&ie=UTF8&qid=1544661819&sr=1-4-fkmr0&keywords=Seagate+2TB+64MB+Cache+7200RPM+SATA2+3.0Gb%2Fs+%28Heavy-Duty%29+Internal+Desktop+3.5%22+Hard+Drive+-NAS%2FRAID%2FPC%2FDVR

CDrom drive
Asus DRW-24D5MT Internal DVD Super Multi DL Black Optical Disc Drive
https://www.amazon.com/DRW-24D5MT-Internal-Super-Multi-Optical/dp/B019F6FV5S/ref=sr_1_1?s=electronics&ie=UTF8&qid=1544755961&sr=1-1&keywords=Asus+-+DRW-24D5MT+DVD%2FCD+Writer

Power supply
Seasonic FOCUS Plus 650 Platinum SSR-650PX 650W 80+ Platinum ATX12V & EPS12V Full Modular 120mm FDB Fan 10 Year Warranty Compact 140 mm Size Power Supply
https://www.newegg.com/Product/ProductList.aspx?Submit=ENE&DEPA=0&Order=BESTMATCH&Description=SeaSonic+-+FOCUS+Plus+Platinum+650+W+&N=-1&isNodeId=1

Case
Antec Gaming Series Three Hundred Two Mid-Tower PC/Gaming Computer Case with 9 Tool-Less Drive Bays, 2 SSD, 120/140mm Fans x 2 Pre-Installed, 4 Fan Mounts for ATX, M-ATX and Mini-ITX
https://www.amazon.com/Antec-Three-Hundred-Two-Pre-Installed/dp/B006TVQTHW/ref=sr_1_38?s=electronics&rps=1&ie=UTF8&qid=1544743942&sr=1-38&keywords=mid+tower+case+with+fans&refinements=p_85%3A2470955011

OR

ROSEWILL ATX Mid Tower Gaming Computer Case, supports up to 400 mm long VGA Card, comes with two fans pre-installed - Front 120 mm Fan x 1, Rear 120 mm Fan x1 (TYRFING)
https://www.amazon.com/ROSEWILL-Gaming-Computer-supports-pre-installed/dp/B01BITI11G/ref=cm_cr_arp_d_product_sims?ie=UTF8

Windows operating system
Windows 10 Pro 64-bit - OEM
https://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16832588491



Death is no easy answer
For those who wish to know
Ask those who have been before you
What fate the future holds
It ain't pretty