Thoughts.

[FLS]

Remember =Geff=? He used to fly in DOA, he put on aerobatic competitions in the Training Arena. You could fly in 2D or 3D back then. In 2D the smoke lasted longer.    I flew as FLS in AW, FA, and WB/DOA. 

We can schedule training now for any time zone. Just not any time in any timezone. If we had enough interest we could do clinics too.

[save]

Remember =Geff=? He used to fly in DOA, he put on aerobatic competitions in the Training Arena. You could fly in 2D or 3D back then. In 2D the smoke lasted longer.    I flew as FLS in AW, FA, and WB/DOA. 

We can schedule training now for any time zone. Just not any time in any timezone. If we had enough interest we could do clinics too.

oh, yes he was a RL aerobatic pilot, he did a show for us at EuroCon a few years ago.

When Eurotrainers was established - most us had IRL  flying experience or had aviation experience , =dobs= was our head trainer (he was a backseat F15 pilot) - =daff= was an aerobatic pilot, I flew  taildraggers for  20 years , =olli= was a ppl, ==YT== was air traffic controller, and =wiz= was an retired RL German F104 pilot (he was in the same squad as Erich Hartmann post ww2, oooh , those storied he had  ) and =webs=, later we added =vati=, =dhy==, and =flu= and =kuis=.

[Ciaphas]

Oh, he was a WSO. Cool.


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[Ciaphas]

So they should only see the Training Arena. 

No, they should see in Training, WWI, MA in the first tab and AVA and custom arenas in their respective tabs. if they are premium or on their two week trial. After that, if they are not premium and not on their two week trial they should see: Training, WWI in the first tab and AVA and custom arenas in their own respective tabbed locations.

The reason we have appointments for training is because the trainers are volunteers, who like to play the game.  Waiting to train somebody is a pointless waste of time. We have done it anyway just in case it helps someone.

There is no line of players waiting for training.  That's not a problem that needs solving at this time.

Turns out, training is an issue that needs to be solved. People may not make appointments because this is a game and who makes appointments for game training? As CptTrips mentioned: That might work with a system for them to mark themselves available/unavailable like cab drivers., a system of marking yourself available to help/train would not hurt someones play time, as the trainer would mark themselves available or not available. It's value added for the new players, besides if you only want to train people once in a while and by appointment, why are you a trainer? To take on the role of a trainer, you are saying I will help and train the denizens of AH3 when they ask for help not when it's a convenience for you.

We call those guys "players" not low level trainers. We appreciate their help. 

If you are simply a player, then step away from the training role and let people in there that will be trainers above being a player.

A trainer needs to understand what a trainee is trying to do, what they're actually doing, and what they need to do. And has to be able to explain it.  You cover what's in the training material but the main thing is getting the trainee to understand the things that aren't intuitive like the lead turn, lift/drag curve, and A2A gunnery.

At the same time you help with the game you also represent HTC the business. I doubt HTC would want less qualified trainers.

There are all levels of training that is needed. From the dude trying to get wheels up without auto pilot for the first time, to the dude trying to master bouncing bombers without dying.

Adding a "live roster" for trainers that are currently online will greatly increase the use of the training arena. There have been times when I first started that I popped in the TA for some help and simply listened to the crickets until I left and went back to the MA to get clubbed. It wasn't until I flew with the Chawks, the 91st that I learned some of the finer points to the style I played. The TA did absolutely nothing for me as trainers where never around when I logged in to the TA. Sure they may have been online in the MA or DA but I was none the wiser for getting their attention.

So yes, accessibility to the trainers is garbage in it's current setup and it is in need of an overhaul.

[Ack-Ack]

And people are supposed to just sit there for hours and hours in empty arena hoping someone stops by for some training?

That would be dedication. 

If you pay them they will but then would the cost benefits outweigh any negatives? 

[FLS]

Adding a "live roster" for trainers that are currently online will greatly increase the use of the training arena. There have been times when I first started that I popped in the TA for some help and simply listened to the crickets until I left and went back to the MA to get clubbed. It wasn't until I flew with the Chawks, the 91st that I learned some of the finer points to the style I played. The TA did absolutely nothing for me as trainers where never around when I logged in to the TA. Sure they may have been online in the MA or DA but I was none the wiser for getting their attention.

So yes, accessibility to the trainers is garbage in it's current setup and it is in need of an overhaul.

You should have requested training. If there were trainers in another arena they were likely busy, and not waiting for you to call them. Your decision not to request an appointment isn't a training issue. Blaming the system for your behavior is not a reason to change it. We are however considering ways of making it easier to contact us.

[Ack-Ack]

In Warbirds we had training schedules en Euro, and US time zone, we got a free trainers account,we we marked by wings, in my case it was =save=, and we got an extra account when we wanted fly incognito.

While the WB training system was good, the early Air Warrior Training Academy was far superior.  It was a 6 week training course, with included syllabus and training manual that taught new players all aspects of the game, to how to play the game and how to fly/fight and a group of dedicated trainers.  When new players finished the academy, there was a little graduation ceremony to give them a sense of accomplishment and they were more than ready to enter the main arenas and hold their own against the masses.

I've always thought that AH should have the same training system, it would go along way of helping to retain new players and greatly lessen the learning curve they face with the current system.  Unfortunately, I think it would be difficult to implement with just volunteer trainers and you'd have to go the part time employee route to do it properly to make sure all time zones are covered sufficiently.

[Ciaphas]

You should have requested training. If there were trainers in another arena they were likely busy, and not waiting for you to call them. Your decision not to request an appointment isn't a training issue. Blaming the system for your behavior is not a reason to change it. We are however considering ways of making it easier to contact us.

It's an accessibility issue, not a behavioral issue. Why on earth would a new player leave the game, go to a website to schedule some sort of training? The odds of them coming back to the game is minimal.

many players don't have forum accounts and last I checked, creating a game ID has nothing to do with creating a forum ID.

So, once again, it's an accessibility issue not a behavioral issue. The system and the implementation of this system are and have been flawed since it's inception.


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[FLS]

I believe your assumptions are flawed so we'll have to disagree about training. Many new players, and experienced players also, have contacted the trainers for training. They never complained about the difficulty.

I don't know why more people aren't requesting training. I believe that you said you didn't because you chose not to.

Maybe encouraging people to seek training instead of bashing something you never tried would be more helpful to new people.

[Ciaphas]

I believe your assumptions are flawed so we'll have to disagree about training. Many new players, and experienced players also, have contacted the trainers for training. They never complained about the difficulty.

I don't know why more people aren't requesting training. I believe that you said you didn't because you chose not to.

Maybe encouraging people to seek training instead of bashing something you never tried would be more helpful to new people.

Cause the TA is super busy... .

Leaving a game to learn a game is a serious flaw. If training can only be conducted by appointment, remove the TA from the list of arenas.



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[TequilaChaser]

While the WB training system was good, the early Air Warrior Training Academy was far superior.  It was a 6 week training course, with included syllabus and training manual that taught new players all aspects of the game, to how to play the game and how to fly/fight and a group of dedicated trainers.  When new players finished the academy, there was a little graduation ceremony to give them a sense of accomplishment and they were more than ready to enter the main arenas and hold their own against the masses.

I've always thought that AH should have the same training system, it would go along way of helping to retain new players and greatly lessen the learning curve they face with the current system.  Unfortunately, I think it would be difficult to implement with just volunteer trainers and you'd have to go the part time employee route to do it properly to make sure all time zones are covered sufficiently.

Completely Agree

HT asked back in 2000 for the Trainers to get together and create a Training Academy for Aces High, yet it fell on  deaf years until I decided to read every single threads/posts up until I accepted to volunteer to be a Trainer again after AW... So I tried to ressurect HT's wishes and tried to get other trainers on board.....and btw HiTech was going to pay those that got involved with the academy end of it... Out of all the trainers this game has had, only 3 of us gave interested in it in 2004, now jump ahead to 2012... Badboy and I tried to get the ball rolling  again, jump to 2016: Badboy is back as a Trainer and him and I just about ready to go live, but watermelon hits the fan once again and Badboy leaves the game for good and I retired

So it is left up to the rest of all players regardless if you volunteer as a Trainer, CM or not to figure out what should be done...

............................. ............................. ............................. ..........

As for O P,

Dale, sounds good to me


TC / Johnny

[Shuffler]

Cause the TA is super busy... .

Leaving a game to learn a game is a serious flaw. If training can only be conducted by appointment, remove the TA from the list of arenas.



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They train far more than how to use the game. Getting interrupted with other people would not help at all.

PS All arenas are The Game.

[FLS]

Cause the TA is super busy... .

Leaving a game to learn a game is a serious flaw. If training can only be conducted by appointment, remove the TA from the list of arenas.



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Anyone can train in the TA at any time. People use it every day. Removing it would be a silly thoughtless idea.

Where is the flaw in leaving the game to learn the game? That's supposed to be self-evident? Sounds like you just make stuff up.

[FLS]

While the WB training system was good, the early Air Warrior Training Academy was far superior.  It was a 6 week training course, with included syllabus and training manual that taught new players all aspects of the game, to how to play the game and how to fly/fight and a group of dedicated trainers.  When new players finished the academy, there was a little graduation ceremony to give them a sense of accomplishment and they were more than ready to enter the main arenas and hold their own against the masses.

I've always thought that AH should have the same training system, it would go along way of helping to retain new players and greatly lessen the learning curve they face with the current system.  Unfortunately, I think it would be difficult to implement with just volunteer trainers and you'd have to go the part time employee route to do it properly to make sure all time zones are covered sufficiently.

Two big differences. The AW community was full of newbies and there was little information available on ACM. Now we have tremendous resources for self-learning but the community is mostly vets. An academy graduate would find less initial success these days.

I read the AH training academy thread almost 10 years ago, it assumes people want to go to school. I think most players want training to be more fun, less structured.

[Ciaphas]

They train far more than how to use the game. Getting interrupted with other people would not help at all.

PS All arenas are The Game.

The scope of training is irrelevant when a new user has to log out of the game, go to a website, create an account and then request a time for training. By this point you have lost the attention of the new user. A simple clipboard side panel showing which trainers are online and their status (away, busy, available) and allow for a link to PM a trainer to request training is all that would be needed to fix the accessibility to training.

Anyone can train in the TA at any time. People use it every day. Removing it would be a silly thoughtless idea.

Where is the flaw in leaving the game to learn the game? That's supposed to be self-evident? Sounds like you just make stuff up.

There is a massive flaw in a new player having to leave the game to learn how to play the game. Once that player has decided to sub than they will most likely look to youtube, google and maybe the forums to further their knowledge but they can't get there if training is not made available, ingame, upfront with as little hassle as possible.

so... .

This whole conversation is not really focused on veteran players or those that have been playing for a while. this all geared towards those that are on their 2 week free trial.