Flight Stick Recommendation?

[Shuffler]

All my years flying with the same CH gear, Fighterstick, Throttle, Pedals.

[streakeagle]

If you have the money, VKB Gunfighter 3 Stick base is fantastic, especially with an extension (a 20 cm curved extension comes with "Pro" or "Premium" options). You can swap cams and springs to get the feel you want. I have every compatible grip, which includes the Thrustmaster Warthog and Hornet grips with VKB adapters installed in place of their normal base connector.

https://vkbcontrollers.com/?product_cat=vkb-joysticks-and-rudders

The most capable grip in terms of buttons, triggers, and analog axes is the Modern Combat Grip (MCG) Pro. It is styled and arranged similar to Russian fighter jets, which is great for flying the MiG-21bis, MiG-29, Su-27, and Su-33 in DCS. But I find the control arrangement a little awkward/uncomfortable. The grip itself is also a little smaller than what feels comfortable to me, but is does have a "checkered diamond" texture on the side. The vast number of hats, buttons, switches, and analog axes make this grip the best choice if you want to map as much as possible to your grip.

If you prefer the shape, feel, and arrangement of US style grips, the Space Combat Grip (SCG) Pro is a better option. It is somewhere between the Warthog and Hornet grips in control arrangement. Compared to the MCG Pro, it swaps the brake lever for a twist rudder axis, loses a couple of fire buttons, and loses the right side hat for a single button (the analog joystick hat can be swapped out with a regular hat switch or programmed to act like a hat switch), which is still able to fully support US fighter grips button maps like the Warthog and Hornet grips. The grip itself is larger and shaped more like a pistol grip with finger grooves and some texturing, which is very comfortable. I miss having the side hat available for extra button mapping, but otherwise like this grip a lot better for me than the MCG Pro when I am not flying Russian jet fighters.

For WW2 Luftwaffe fans, there is the KG-12 grip which is a reasonable facsimile for the standard shape/size grip for German fighters. But if you want a useful number of buttons and hats, this I is not the grip for you. The hat switch that looks like a fire button doesn't even have a center press function unlike all of the hats on the MCG and SCG grips. It also lacks any kind of texture unlike the real KG series grips. The flip down trigger/safety is nifty, though it doesn't have a switch to sense when it is flipped up or down (unlike the MCG Pro). I like using it when flying the Bf109 and Fw190s in VR. There is nothing better than seeing and feeling the same shape/control arrangement, especially if the stick controls are animated so you see them move when you press them.

The grips below are (from left to right): VKB SCG Premium, VKB MCG Pro, VKB F-14, TM Warthog, TM Hornet, VKB KG-12

[Drano]

Long time CH user have converted to a VKB Gunfighter/MCG-Pro a year or so back. Expensive? Yeah. Not only is it the best stick I've ever had from a buttons, hats and configuration standpoint, the construction of the thing tells me it'll be the last stick I'll ever have to buy!

Still using the CH throttle. It's spiking a bit this week so it's due for another teardown. If only VKB would come out with their throttle that'd stop too. Think it'll be out in about two weeks! That was like two years ago!

Sent from my Moto Z (2) using Tapatalk

[AAIK]

If you are looking for a stick make sure its' sensors are 16 bit+ and not 8 bit. The precision of the higher quality sensors makes a world of difference especially for tiny corrections/movements.

[streakeagle]

If you are looking for a stick make sure its' sensors are 16 bit+ and not 8 bit. The precision of the higher quality sensors makes a world of difference especially for tiny corrections/movements.

TM claims the Warthog is 16 bit, but as implemented, it is really 14-bit. 14-bit is plenty of precision. If you don't use an extension, you would probably never detect the difference between 14-bit vs 16-bit. But their advertising spec is still dishonest.

The VKB Gunfighter Pro has configurable resolution that defaults to 12-bit but may be increased up to 15-bit, which allows the end user to decide on the trade-offs between precision and stability. The configuration software for the VKB is insanely capable.

[atlau]

TM claims the Warthog is 16 bit, but as implemented, it is really 14-bit. 14-bit is plenty of precision. If you don't use an extension, you would probably never detect the difference between 14-bit vs 16-bit. But their advertising spec is still dishonest.

The VKB Gunfighter Pro has configurable resolution that defaults to 12-bit but may be increased up to 15-bit, which allows the end user to decide on the trade-offs between precision and stability. The configuration software for the VKB is insanely capable.

What do you run yours as? I havent changed it

[streakeagle]

What do you run yours as? I havent changed it

When I originally got the stick, I tested it and discovered it had lower resolution than the Warthog. I then discovered from forums that it was configurable. I played with it just to see what 15-bit resolution would be like. Despite others' claims to the contrary, if I have a joy tester open, I can move the stick 1 single increment at 15-bit. To do that, you have to barely breath, but it can be done. So I left it that way.

But over time, I have constantly upgraded firmware/software, which means recalibrating the stick and creating new profiles. I am lazy. It was been working more than well enough at defaults, so I haven't spent any more time overwriting them.

In reality, you don't want "just enough" resolution, you want 2 to 4 times what you can perceive. For instance, you want the pixels in a display to be so small that you can't see them or any aliasing artifacts rather than at the smallest size you can see. So, if I wasn't lazy, I would always run 15 bit on the pitch and roll axes.

While I can see the difference on a joy tester while focusing 100% on moving the stick in the smallest possible increments, I don't know if I can perceive any difference in actual practice. When you watch videos of real fighter pilots making corrections while flying and landing, they can make rather visibly large, obvious movements which are well beyond the default 12-bit resolution. So maybe it doesn't matter all that much unless you are doing precision formation flying like the Virtual Thunderbirds. It would really depend on the sensitivity of the aircraft to small control movements and your ability to make small, but quick changes with almost no visible movement.

[DaddyAce]

CH Fighterstick with Pro Thottle & Pro Pedals.

[Brooke]

CH Flightstick and CH pedals.  I love them and have been using CH sticks and pedals for, I think, about two decades.

[Gman]

I've got all of the various Virpil grips, including the Alpha right now, and you can do the same grip swap with Virpil as you can with VKB.  I don't have the WW2 VKB grip, but I've got the Kosmina pro and the MCG pro with my GF2/3s that I have.  The connector VKB uses is vastly superior IMO as Virpil uses the same one TM does.  That said, getting an adapter for the TM stick for VKB bases is very difficult, I have one, and I've been trying to buy more for 1.5 years now, and it's always, always out of stock.  I do think that the VKB F14 stick is a bit higher quality than the Virpil one too.

Big bonus with VKB is their shipping time.  For the 20 or so various Virpil pieces I've ordered, it's always been nearly a month from the time I hit "ok" to the time it arrives.  I ordered my last Gunfighters from VKB on a Thursday at 10pm, and they arrived on Tuesday after the weekend.  Huge difference in wait times.

[puller]

Omg  a F14 stick 

[streakeagle]

I've got all of the various Virpil grips, including the Alpha right now, and you can do the same grip swap with Virpil as you can with VKB.  I don't have the WW2 VKB grip, but I've got the Kosmina pro and the MCG pro with my GF2/3s that I have.  The connector VKB uses is vastly superior IMO as Virpil uses the same one TM does.  That said, getting an adapter for the TM stick for VKB bases is very difficult, I have one, and I've been trying to buy more for 1.5 years now, and it's always, always out of stock.  I do think that the VKB F14 stick is a bit higher quality than the Virpil one too.

Big bonus with VKB is their shipping time.  For the 20 or so various Virpil pieces I've ordered, it's always been nearly a month from the time I hit "ok" to the time it arrives.  I ordered my last Gunfighters from VKB on a Thursday at 10pm, and they arrived on Tuesday after the weekend.  Huge difference in wait times.

Keeping inventory available for order has been a long-time problem with VKB. It has improved dramatically since I got my first Gunfighter 2/MCG Pro combo. I use the notification system to get out of stock items. They send you an email the day that it is available online. That is how I got my TM to VKB adapters. I waited a long time. The email came. I dropped whatever I was doing and ordered two not even knowing whether or not I would be able to used the 2nd one with the Hornet grip. I had to do a little filing down of a sharp 90 degree edge into something like a 1/4-inch rounded edge, but it fit

It looks like right now, they have nearly everything in stock except the TM adapter. The only grip out of stock was the KG12 which is a total reversal from when it was the only grip in stock. All of the Gunfighter/grip combos appear to available with options for table top, pro short extension (10cm), and pro long extension (20cm curved). It wasn't that way too long ago.

[Gman]

VKB's stock has improved massively, while Virpil's has just sort of remained the same.  Always a crapshoot with Virpil with 100s of others spamming the servers when stock comes available.  VKB - you're right, while the adapter has always been hard to get, recently getting a stick/base has never been faster (I check a dozen various used and new Hotas sites every day a couple times looking to snipe deals).  I haven't actually tried the TM Hornet stick on the VKB bases yet, as I generally just use the VKB sticks on the VKB bases, as I have 6 different Virpil bases to fill up with my spare Warthog and Hornet TM sticks already. 

[Pluto]

Glad to hear VKB is getting it together.  They dropped the ball for a bit with their customer service and inventory.  While I still like my gunfighter, I have pretty much been sticking with my virpil stuff for a while now and loving it, with the exception of the VKB rudder pedals. 

Omg  a F14 stick 

No matter how hard you try puller, youll never be as cool as Maverick

[lunaticfringe]

I've got a slightly used t16000 (like 1 month) I'll send it to you if you want to cover shipping.  (I upgraded to a VKB Gf3)

the last new T16000 joy stick i got lasted 3 days