Author Topic: Would any of you consider this a Head On?  (Read 3385 times)

Offline The Fugitive

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Re: Would any of you consider this a Head On?
« Reply #15 on: May 18, 2022, 07:46:50 AM »
Fugitive, I respect your opinion.  So, if I'm avoiding a HO situation and fire a burst, is that firing in an HO or a deflection shot?  MNM is about the only place I engage in ACM, but my thinking has been that, whenever I believe my rounds have a reasonable chance at hitting my target, it's time to fire.  I'm not trying to be argumentative, but there are players who do not value chivalry and then there are those who go full throttle into the dark side of the game.

Just my opinion, as always.

Eagler, we are talking about Monday Night Madness here. It is my understanding that HO shots are aren't allowed.

Decoy, in my opinion any shot taken nose on nose is a HO. I prefer to maneuver for a shot, aka " fight" against another player. That doesn't always last that long in the MA. If I just wanted kills I'd up a 190 and pick and HO all night. I'm just 10 kills away from hitting 20k kills in the MA, but I'll bet I have less than a 1000 got fights in the same time.

But that's just me, your mileage may vary.  :azn:

Offline Bopgun

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Re: Would any of you consider this a Head On?
« Reply #16 on: May 18, 2022, 08:02:30 AM »
Unless it's stated somewhere I have never seen, it's not against the rules to ho in ma.

Stop crying about it and don't put yourself in a position for it if you don't want it..

If you are in a turny plane or have your buddies around you and you see a lone g2 with gonds coming your way, please expect my ho..sorry my first choice is not to turn fight lol

Anything outside 11 to 1 is not a ho, many not seeing the angle correctly on their fe will complain it is..

If you are alone in any plane and a 109f4 is headed your way, I will not ho

Unless the setup is non ho - see MNM where planes pass by head on all night as hoing is not tolerated  - I expected it as it happens more than it doesn't

Eagler

You know, I couldnít agree more with this post. Well said

Iíve always been of the opinion that the HO absolutely valid tactic when you significantly out gun a more maneuverable opponent. Although there are times Ill forgo a questionable shot to see how a fight will progress, I typically shoot whenever I can get a baddy in my gunsight.
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Offline Eagler

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Re: Would any of you consider this a Head On?
« Reply #17 on: May 18, 2022, 08:12:39 AM »
Fugi thanks..

In my ramblings I failed to see the OP was in MNM :)

In there with the short icons and fog and many turny planes, a non ho shot can become one as you or the other plane can flip on a dime...

Some of them are more like helicopters than fighter planes :)

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Offline FLS

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Re: Would any of you consider this a Head On?
« Reply #18 on: May 18, 2022, 08:28:57 AM »
It's not a HO if you're turning.  It's only a HO if you both fly straight at each other. Where do you draw the line between front aspect and HO? 10 degrees off axis? 45 degrees off? Behind the 6/9 line? If you need a rule make it clear and explicit. The reason it's fuzzy now and confuses so many new people is because it's not a real prohibition in air combat. It's just limited in training for safety.
« Last Edit: May 18, 2022, 08:30:34 AM by FLS »

Offline fuzeman

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Re: Would any of you consider this a Head On?
« Reply #19 on: May 18, 2022, 08:46:57 AM »
 :blank:
Far too many, if not most, people on this Board post just to say something opposed to posting when they have something to say.

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Offline TequilaChaser

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Re: Would any of you consider this a Head On?
« Reply #20 on: May 18, 2022, 09:33:21 AM »
This thread is getting comical hahaha 😆 😂 🤣 😅

As far as Monday Night Madness goes, the last I heard it is and has been curtiuos to not HO and request to not HO, but never knew it to be a standing rule!

As FLS posted,  a true HEAD ON SHOT, from WWII  Era, is 12 o'clock to 12 o'clock and 10į degrees or less cone angle...

Too Damn Funny 😁

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Offline Eagler

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Re: Would any of you consider this a Head On?
« Reply #21 on: May 18, 2022, 09:46:53 AM »
From About 11 to 1 is a ho in my book..whether that is a straight ho or if you end up with that angle after your turn..

It's not allowed in mnm to the point you will be called out for it to the point you'll probably leave if you continue

Most only do it once purposely there as they didn't know any better

It is one of the unique things about MNM that makes it more enjoyable than an another hour in ma..

Not to mention fights are seconds away and not numerous minutes..

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Offline Bopgun

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Re: Would any of you consider this a Head On?
« Reply #22 on: July 22, 2023, 11:53:26 PM »
Was wondering what the Boards think of this? I was accused of HOing my opponent on the kill shot towards the end of the video. I was taught a Head On was when both fighters have a clear firing solution. My opponent claims that "he could have pulled for a shot" but decided not too.

In my opinion its clear I traded my energy advantage for a shot opportunity in a vertical angles fight. My opponent attempted to set up for a lead turn and did not evade the obvious shot opportunity I had gained.

Im posting two examples so no one feels they are being targeted(I feel like this is a set up I use very frequently in the MA) . I'm genuinely curious as to what the community thinks of these.
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Offline LCADolby

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Re: Would any of you consider this a Head On?
« Reply #23 on: July 23, 2023, 05:22:56 AM »
00PK has and will always be a world class clown.

There was no head on, he got; out maneuvered, out flown, out classed, and utterly diddlying pwnd.

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Offline nrshida

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Re: Would any of you consider this a Head On?
« Reply #24 on: July 23, 2023, 07:45:59 AM »
Was wondering what the Boards think of this?

In the 00PK fight there's nothing technical to comment on, just the tragedy of an individual whose own ego limits him. There is no proper way to kill him to avoid a comment externalizing blame. Just kill him.

Fugitive was -e throughout and disadvantaged doubly so with gondolas. He mismanaged his flight-path on the ascent. No offence Fugitive, but you need to think not where things are but where they will be, like very fast drivers who look as far ahead as they can having already processed what corner they are in and what is soon to be.

The Shane fight is interesting. What he says is probably technically correct (although undesirable) as he had enough airspeed to do that but prefers to cross then go high for a minimum radius turn over the top. There is some risk in choosing that. Well anticipated, I'd have taken that shot too.
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Offline Shane

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Re: Would any of you consider this a Head On?
« Reply #25 on: July 23, 2023, 08:01:10 AM »
As to HOs in MNM - I've been apparently accused of doing them...???  So I posted several typical sorties in MNM to show, that, ummm, maybe I don't... you can see them here: https://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/index.php/topic,407770.0.html

As for our TA/LA fight (in MA) the shot you took was a valid MA shot - I did roll over earlier than I was thinking (for the reasons nrshida said - I often cut it a bit closer,tho') giving you the belly shot you took.  However, knowing it was you and we were looking for fun - as opposed to a quick kill - is why you got the comment, and it wasn't even as pointed as it would have been if you were a typical HO boi, lol. 

I'm not against HOs per se, just an over-reliance/dependancy on them. And that's not you.


Was wondering what the Boards think of this? I was accused of HOing my opponent on the kill shot towards the end of the video. I was taught a Head On was when both fighters have a clear firing solution. My opponent claims that "he could have pulled for a shot" but decided not too.

In my opinion its clear I traded my energy advantage for a shot opportunity in a vertical angles fight. My opponent attempted to set up for a lead turn and did not evade the obvious shot opportunity I had gained.

Im posting two examples so no one feels they are being targeted(I feel like this is a set up I use very frequently in the MA) . I'm genuinely curious as to what the community thinks of these.
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Offline The Fugitive

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Re: Would any of you consider this a Head On?
« Reply #26 on: July 23, 2023, 08:26:32 AM »
Was wondering what the Boards think of this? I was accused of HOing my opponent on the kill shot towards the end of the video. I was taught a Head On was when both fighters have a clear firing solution. My opponent claims that "he could have pulled for a shot" but decided not too.

In my opinion its clear I traded my energy advantage for a shot opportunity in a vertical angles fight. My opponent attempted to set up for a lead turn and did not evade the obvious shot opportunity I had gained.

Im posting two examples so no one feels they are being targeted(I feel like this is a set up I use very frequently in the MA) . I'm genuinely curious as to what the community thinks of these.

Technically no, it was not a HO, but that is because I didntpull for the HO and make it a true one.

I entered the fight at a big disadvantage as shida said, but I dont mind that as long as I get a fight. Right away I knew I was against a good player and worked hard to try and equalize our positions. On the final merge I could have dumped my E and thrown the plane into position for a HO, but thats not how I want to win fights. I tried to save E by NOT pulling hard into a nose on position. I thought my opponent was going to fight like I do.....maneuver and force the other guy into a position where a shot is unavoidable from behind the 3-9 line. After all it was just the two of us having a fun fight, there was nothing on the line, neither one of us was going to die.

I guess it was too much to ask. I thought Sis would have pulled up and rolled over again to get me to burn more E avoiding him and then slide in for the shot I couldnt avoid. Yes I called HO because I thought you went for a lame, lazy shot instead of working towards a clean kill shot like I was trying to do.  Its my own fault thinking others would play the game like I try to especially in a 1 vs 1 with nobody else in the sector.

Congrats on another kill Sis, I didnt even spill my gin and tonic  :aok

Offline Dadtallica

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Re: Would any of you consider this a Head On?
« Reply #27 on: July 23, 2023, 09:00:33 AM »
Everyone ďHOísĒ

Itís a very subjective thing considering the varied connections bring the possibility of differences of space and time for each player. You saw a Ho, they see your canopy or are off set from your nose.

Sometimes as mentioned above the bullets that got you were fired well before you got where you are now and then heard the sound which now feels like they are head on.

Iíve also heard most WWII pilots say in docus that they would fire on a plane anytime they had a shot. Plenty of air battles started with both side head on firing at each other.
« Last Edit: July 23, 2023, 09:02:50 AM by Dadtallica »
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Offline nrshida

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Re: Would any of you consider this a Head On?
« Reply #28 on: July 23, 2023, 09:16:12 AM »
A very respectful exchange.  :salute
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Offline GasTeddy

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Re: Would any of you consider this a Head On?
« Reply #29 on: July 23, 2023, 10:13:04 AM »
HOs happened in real WW 2 dogfights as well, so what is this fuss about it?
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