Author Topic: My default sound fiiles from the old days are gone?  (Read 4282 times)

Offline Animl-AW

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My default sound fiiles from the old days are gone?
« on: February 25, 2023, 08:41:57 PM »
Long time ago, more then 14 years, HT liked what I did and asked to buy them from me for default sounds (i think), I just donated them and prolly got free play time.

As I read, it seems they must be done differently. Being a Live Sound Engineer for 42 years of concerts, it was a great pass time for me, second nature.

I'd rather see what Challenge or others have come up with first. Why re-invent the wheel? But I may give it a shot again.

Example, The default 190A8 sound is a great sound but it has a glitch that sounds like a fuel pump going bad. It just needs a quick edit for looping.

Can anyone set me off on the right path without me researching?

Thanks in advance.
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Offline The Fugitive

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Re: My default sound fiiles from the old days are gone?
« Reply #1 on: February 26, 2023, 12:15:19 AM »
All sounds are now run through FMOD in the game. Challenge was the only player to build a set for the game but has since passed away, so any update or help will not be available through him. Its not as easy to just drop in sounds anymore. Once you figure out the program I hear its not all that bad, but timing on loops can cause an issue. Challenge had a problem with his sounds where as a Pony closed the first sound you heard was its gear raising.

Offline Animl-AW

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Re: My default sound fiiles from the old days are gone?
« Reply #2 on: February 26, 2023, 10:51:51 AM »
So sorry to hear about Challenge. RIP

Most of the sounds are clean, IMO. There's really not much I would change. They may even still be my files. Some of them I seem to recognize, but it's been a long time. The biggest issue I had was getting recorded audio of the exact plane or gun it belonged to.

If I remember right, without even looking, the Engine start, run and stop, all had to be found. Back in the day the intardnet was not quite as robust. When I found them most were quite dirty and distorted, many had to be trashed and re-found. Not only were the recordings old skewl mics and techniques, then the compression used in like MP3 files destroyed them more. Old recordings using tape, degrades over time just sitting there. When converted digitally, you got what time left you. Bringing them back to life, every file had to be dealt with individually, each one had it's own issues. It's time consuming to get it right.

The only way I see to make improvements would be to find modern digital recordings in original uncompressed .wav file, many come from air shows, some from documentaries. Some planes don't exist anymore in running condition.

I don't see a major overhaul here, I just picked out very few that could be tweaked.

If peeps don't know how to process sound files, but can find *and verify authenticity*, I'd be willing to work them into the existing set, as long as they are better then the default. They have to be improvements.

I have the time to process files, probably not the time to find new ones. It could be more of a group effort.
If players want to dump some in my lap, I or WE as a group could pick out the best of the best and then I'd process those. If peeps can find sounds of the motors/hydraulics used for flaps and wheels, that goes even deeper into authentic immersion, those are even harder to find. That said, I won't waste time on any file that is not authentic.

I'd be willing to pick up where Challenge left off with his, as long as they are authentic and not computer generated. He took on a huge task, I hope it was a good therapy for him. Maybe we can make his work live on and not go wasted and keep his name attached to them, he earned that credit.

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Offline The Fugitive

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Re: My default sound fiiles from the old days are gone?
« Reply #3 on: February 26, 2023, 12:02:52 PM »
I believe Challenge recorded all his own from shows and friends he knew in the industry. The problem is that once the files have been compiled with the FMOD program they are not editable. I dont think Hitech has the files Challenge used. Contacting Mrs Challenge might be an option, but who knows.

Offline Animl-AW

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Re: My default sound fiiles from the old days are gone?
« Reply #4 on: February 26, 2023, 12:40:28 PM »
I believe Challenge recorded all his own from shows and friends he knew in the industry. The problem is that once the files have been compiled with the FMOD program they are not editable. I dont think Hitech has the files Challenge used. Contacting Mrs Challenge might be an option, but who knows.

I only quickly glazed over the FMOD. There may be a cumbersome work-around the no longer able to edit part. The important part would that he/they kept a copy of the files prior to compiling with FMOD. That would be my plan A. IF his family can even be contacted.

Obviously, I never heard them, but seems to me too much work was put into it to just not do anything with it.
The quicker route could be to just take it AC by AC and post it as each is done, kinda like skins. Waiting for the whole pack could be quite the wait
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Offline oboe

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Re: My default sound fiiles from the old days are gone?
« Reply #5 on: February 26, 2023, 12:49:34 PM »
Challenge's sounds are so much better than the default sounds.  AFAIK, the problem with the P-51 (and maybe some others as well) is that when an aircraft comes into hearing range, you'll hear the engine startup clip first, rather than just hearing the engine sound at an increasing volume as the aircraft approaches.

I hope you are able to work something up, Animl.   

I remember some outfit used to sell CDs of recorded engines - "Rounds Sounds" maybe?   Supposedly they were high quality recordings of different WWII aircraft engines.

Offline Animl-AW

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Re: My default sound fiiles from the old days are gone?
« Reply #6 on: February 26, 2023, 03:43:33 PM »
Challenge's sounds are so much better than the default sounds.  AFAIK, the problem with the P-51 (and maybe some others as well) is that when an aircraft comes into hearing range, you'll hear the engine startup clip first, rather than just hearing the engine sound at an increasing volume as the aircraft approaches.

I hope you are able to work something up, Animl.   

I remember some outfit used to sell CDs of recorded engines - "Rounds Sounds" maybe?   Supposedly they were high quality recordings of different WWII aircraft engines.

I may have run across some CDs, but never acquired them for whatever reason at that time. I have to have at least start, run, and stop segments.

How are you hearing these files, or did he just tell you about them? Did you help test them? It only matters if the copies of the files can be acquired.

Talking in the blind, totally just guessing,..It sounds like it may require a specific time/length of files for looping, and how it sequences them would be good to know. If HT/AH require this software then they should have some description of how it's applied in their game. Someone who's used it successfully is a key to saving time.

That's where I would start. Who is that person? I can learn the software, it's knowing how AH calls on these files to prevent that issue of over-lapping sounds. Figure that out and we're off and running.
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Offline Animl-AW

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Re: My default sound fiiles from the old days are gone?
« Reply #7 on: February 26, 2023, 05:43:34 PM »
Ok I found them and installed them.
I flew the P51, P38, 190A8, and F4U. Great sounds. But I did notice things that could be edited.

Example: inconsistent osculation of the A8 engine due to looping, OR prop noise. It has an irritant in the 4khz-8khz frequencies, especially after a long period. Irritating sounds can mess with your brain after long periods, change your mood. Why mine were smoothed out a touch. I'm not sure if that's suppose to be there, there's a lot to be said with EQing and noise flooring, maybe even a slight touch of compression.

I'm not sure I'd use .ogg file types, I may look into the difference in .acc vs wav. Just remember, the smaller the file, the more likely depth is lost, depending on the compression rate. I'll look into that.

Basically he has what I wished I had to start with years ago. I have some tools to shine them up a bit if I had the individual files.

I'll fly with them for a while and check them out. They have a nice fresh sound to them. I don't see anything too complicated here.
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Offline oboe

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Re: My default sound fiiles from the old days are gone?
« Reply #8 on: February 26, 2023, 06:47:06 PM »
That is great news, Animal.   

I'm not sure if external sounds are separate from internal sounds, but this is where Challenge's sound pack really shines, except for the misplaced startup sound. 


Offline Animl-AW

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Re: My default sound fiiles from the old days are gone?
« Reply #9 on: February 27, 2023, 09:24:36 AM »
I think if Chalenge's fans would like to see his work come to full professional hi-res fruition the #1 goal would be to obtain the original digital files, before they were converted to .ogg or any lossy format. I saw where he suggested he would use that format. This is the leg work his friends would need to take on to make that happen.

The problem with .ogg type files is they are lossy, and not hi-res. They are better then MP3, but nowhere near the hi-res quality of .wav or .aiff, which are lossless.

Here's what happens to the file with higher compression (lossy) when editing and saving, the quality takes a hit every time it's saved.  EDIT>SAVE>Edit>Save>edit>save, edt>sav.

Like a compressed .jpg pic, the quality is lost every time it's saved, use no compression save it over and over with little to no loss. .wav or .aiff (lossless) can be saved many times no loss.

So, IF the choice is made for small lower-res formats, all editing should be done in the likes of .wav or .aiff, and then as THE LAST STEP, after all work is done, before compiling to FMOD, convert the file down.

Your choice is Hi-res or not.
IMO if you're going to put that much work into something that will be heard for hours, mos, yrs...go hi-res. I can write a book on the negative effects on psychology and hearing from using low-res compressed files for long periods, lets just leave it there.

.bank is like a form of .zip file. >IF< I can even get it to decompress and get access to the files it has in it,...there's a good chance they are going to be lossy and not the proper quality to start with, as the hi-res quality MAY have already been lost from the original files. It's a lot of work to make a compressed file sound hi-res again, and sometime it can't be done. That's what I had to do in AW and AH. Time waster, if you can start Hi-res. I think I can safely assume Challenge would want it to be the best possible finished product.

The above is why it's important to get the original digital files, and hope they are in a hi-res format, a lossless format would be great.... because editing will be done.

If his friends and fans can pull that trick off, get the original files, prior to FMOD, then we can talk about how they can be processed.
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Offline steely07

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Re: My default sound fiiles from the old days are gone?
« Reply #10 on: February 27, 2023, 08:03:35 PM »
Bit of a left-field suggestion, could we re-use the AH2 sounds made by Mitsu, I'm looking at them now, they're all .wav format.

Now, there would be some aircraft that didn't exist back then that would need new sounds, and we'd need to credit Mitsu for his work on the orig files, but I don't think he'd mind, afaik he hasn't played in 10+ years.

Let me know if you'd like a look at those files Animi-AW

Salute

Steely
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Offline nopoop

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Re: My default sound fiiles from the old days are gone?
« Reply #11 on: February 27, 2023, 10:18:11 PM »
I had mitsu's sounds. They were pretty damm good.

Worth a listen Animal.
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Offline Animl-AW

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Re: My default sound fiiles from the old days are gone?
« Reply #12 on: February 28, 2023, 08:13:06 AM »
I had mitsu's sounds. They were pretty damm good.

Worth a listen Animal.

Yes Iíve had the thought. I wouldnít want to offend anyone by using their work. But it is a shorter route.
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Offline TryHard

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Re: My default sound fiiles from the old days are gone?
« Reply #13 on: February 28, 2023, 01:05:25 PM »
Bit of a left-field suggestion, could we re-use the AH2 sounds made by Mitsu, I'm looking at them now, they're all .wav format.

Now, there would be some aircraft that didn't exist back then that would need new sounds, and we'd need to credit Mitsu for his work on the orig files, but I don't think he'd mind, afaik he hasn't played in 10+ years.

Let me know if you'd like a look at those files Animi-AW

Salute

Steely

I too wish we had the old sound system back, made it really easy to have all the planes and guns in the game sound nice

Offline TwinBoom

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Re: My default sound fiiles from the old days are gone?
« Reply #14 on: February 28, 2023, 03:01:34 PM »
i have all my sound files just never figured out fmod, b een busy with real life and a streetglide
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