Author Topic: THIS Thread - It SUCK's  (Read 510 times)

Offline Creamo

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THIS Thread - It SUCK's
« on: February 16, 2002, 09:32:46 AM »
They are so over modelled, they are a eyesore.

Find a strat work around for the guns. It is NO FUN bouncing them. They just ping you DEAD.

From now on, they just go to lazer bomb targets, I ain't getting close.

(snif)


Naw, I ain't whining, (yes I am, this sucks) this gameplay feature is pretty bad.
« Last Edit: February 19, 2002, 03:32:23 PM by Creamo »

Offline Staga

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Buff's- THEY SUCK
« Reply #1 on: February 16, 2002, 10:04:06 AM »
Heh Lazs gonna luv you Creamozs :D

Offline Creamo

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Buff's- THEY SUCK
« Reply #2 on: February 16, 2002, 10:16:38 AM »
Naw, he's going to continue to make the obvious a flame session.

Tards will argue, and the Buffs will continue to suck Yak balls.

In the mean time, Buffs will wonder at high speed Doras blasting by, with zero intent of attack. (Oh the realism)

Buffs are WAY gameplay screwed.

I'll give HTC the viewer update priority timeframe, but I ain't going near a buff till 1.10.

What's that say about Strat?

Offline Tac

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Buff's- THEY SUCK
« Reply #3 on: February 16, 2002, 10:18:31 AM »
I agree. Imo, giving the buff more OFFENSIVE firepower with their turbolazer was a bad idea.

Make them eat 3X more damage and be done with it.

Offline Wotan

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Buff's- THEY SUCK
« Reply #4 on: February 16, 2002, 11:03:33 AM »
buffs have sucked for some time where have you been.

Its not their guns that are the main problem its everything involve in them. They give any 2 week wonder to great an impact on gameplay. They are boring to chase around. They make a point of bombing the fhs at 2 bases where theres good fights.

They sucked even more when 2 lanc dweebs could spend 2 hours climbing to 30k to take your dar down. They suck almost as bad as night.
« Last Edit: February 16, 2002, 11:10:17 AM by Wotan »

Offline SOB

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« Reply #5 on: February 16, 2002, 11:41:25 AM »
Creamo, you can't even shoot down a Lanc in your Dora...that's just sad.  Hell, you've even got Tac agreeing with you.  So, what do you think about the Niki?


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Offline Bullethead

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Buff's- THEY SUCK
« Reply #6 on: February 16, 2002, 11:44:35 AM »
I must agree with the general consensus that buffs need work.  While they are not the aerobatic uberplanes they were in AW (thank the Dark Gods), they have the same AW-style LGBs and uberguns, at least the .50cals.

In the January TD, the B17 and B26 had a K/D vs. most fighters of about 60%.  In the same camp, gunners had a K/D well over 1.5 vs. fighters.  Although gunners rarely seem to die when their plane crashes, it still paints a pretty nasty picture.  In a 1 on 1 fighter vs. US buff situation, the fighter is more likely than not to lose.  It's even worse when the buff has a gunner.  

The Lanc and Ju88, OTOH, are MUCH less formidable, however, either due to less latent toughness or only .30cal guns, or both.

So basically, at the bottom line a single B17, without even a gunner aboard, can cruise serenely at 20k over the furballs from 10k on down, beat off the 1 or 2 interceptors willing to come up to them, and then drop individual bombs on individual buildings, crippling their target.  The strategic result is way out of proportion to the number of peole required to achieve it, and their skill level.  

Furthermore, it requires a disproportionate defensive effort to keep this from happening.  Looking at the statistics, it's evident that to be sure of killing a single, 1-man B17 prior to it dropping its bombs, the defenders need to commit at least 2, more likely 3, interceptors.  These guys will be out of other action for the time it takes them to grab alt, reach patrol station, and make their attacks.  Meanwhile, their side has less forces available for stopping jabos, GVs, and goons at lower alts.  So it's a real Hobson's Choice.

To me, the solution to all this must start with making it MUCH more difficult to do precision bombing from high alt.  IMHO, it would be GREAT to go back to a WB-style bombsight in which the buff had to fly straight and level for a long way just to get the thing set up, and then couldn't zigzag over the field to hit dispersed buildings.  I would also require buffs to drop their full load at once--no more individual bombs on individual buildings.

Being of this opinion, I wait the promised 1-man FORMATIONs of buffs with great dread.  IMHO, the LAST thing AH needs is something that makes individual buff drivers any more effective than they already are.  OK, so maybe this 1-man formation will only be able to carpet bomb, all at once with no aiming at individual buildings.  But the result IMHO would still be close to the same in terms of damage done by 1 dweeb.  Furthermore, if the odds say the fighter will lose most of the time against a single buff, always having to fly into the fire of 3 in close formation will be sheer suicide.

Offline Tac

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Buff's- THEY SUCK
« Reply #7 on: February 16, 2002, 01:49:06 PM »
Wotan, get a b17 or lanc with 100 fuel and see if you can do those amazing manouvers. The reason why AH buffs can pull off those sopwith-camel manouvers is because they got 25% gas.

SOB, fly parallel in a front aspect of a buff, d1.6 away. Have the b17/b26 shoot at your. When he hits, those pings will murder your plane. Try shooting someone else with a jug when they are at d1.3 and get some hits.. they wont hurt at all. Increased range and hitpower are indeed in the buff guns. IMO, HTC should ONLY and ONLY give the range advantage to the TAIL gun only.

Buff formations i'd like to see, BUT if the buffs are made to drop all bombs at once, bomb dispersion is set AND the bombsights must be set to automatic release as they were in SWOTL.

(for those that never played SWOTL: you go to bombardiers position, point bombsight so you are ligned up with target, zoom in, when your target fills the bombsight you pressed a button, which started a TIMER. Timer countdown was dependent on alt. When the countdown ended the buff dropped eggs automatically. That made your buff fly straight and level during the bomb run, if you changed flightpath your bombs would miss by hundreds of yards. You could man your guns while the timer clicked away.)

I dont think HTC would give more than 3 or 4 buffs to each player anyway. I AM very concerned about the turbolasers.. if they give all those 4 buffs the same lame concessions of increased range and damage AND if the buff guns STILL shoot through the fuselage, AH will become BUFF WARS

*IMPERIAL MARCH plays on background*...

Offline Hooligan

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Buff's- THEY SUCK
« Reply #8 on: February 16, 2002, 02:23:22 PM »
Creamo the correct term is "fluff".

Hooligan

Offline Wotan

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« Reply #9 on: February 16, 2002, 03:12:08 PM »
I am not talking about there fm or toughnes or lethality all that can be over come. I have killed plenty o'buffs they aren't a problem for me other then they are boring to fight. and they ruin what little time I have to fly by always making a point of hitting the fuel or fhs where I am flying from.

Now this is where the rest comes in cause every buff thread (this ones an exception) usually starts with some whiney Fluffer  cryin about how unappreciated they are. As if we should make even more accomodations for their style while they are absolutely opposed to take any consideration for the style of play most people are involved in.

Go check the main what are the by far majority doing?

They have it so ez now its rediculous. If I ran the world there wouldn't be a one of umm.

I have accepted them for what they are. You have never seen me complain about another ac or try to say you shouldn't fly x plane with the exception of buffs.

Offline eskimo2

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Buff's- THEY SUCK
« Reply #10 on: February 16, 2002, 04:23:05 PM »
Creamo,
Do you realize that your overall fighter K/D in tour 24 was exactly 1.000?
This includes 19 buffs that you shot down at the cost of 5 of your own lives.
That's a K/D of 3.75 against buffs.  WTG!

The average AH  player has a K/D of about 1.5 against B-26S and B-17s.  Against TBMs, 5.0, Lancs, 2.5 , JU-88s, 4.0.  

Personally, I love attacking buffs, especially with a zippy little109.  I find traditional LW tactics pretty imersive and thrilling.   It's a tough challenge, but like you, I usually win.

For further explanation on why buff guns seem so powerful, check out the thread:
The 50 cal. Buff Gun Laser Myth, Part 2: Ballistics andEnergy (General Discussion)

eskimo

Offline popeye

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Buff's- THEY SUCK
« Reply #11 on: February 16, 2002, 04:32:04 PM »
I agree that it should be more difficult to do damage with a buff, but I don't think they should be an easy kill.
KONG

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Offline Tac

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Buff's- THEY SUCK
« Reply #12 on: February 16, 2002, 04:50:09 PM »
Eskimo, I find it extremely hard to believe all that when a buff can shoot my plane out of the sky at d1.6 when im in FRONT of it and flying AWAY from it (in short, the buff is on my 6 d1.6 away) with a few pings. That doesnt happen in an EIGHT 50 cal armed plane when getting shot at d900.

Buff drivers know it, and they verily abuse that. Every buff you meet will start spraying lead at you from d1.7 because they KNOW they will hit and kill.

Offline Yeager

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« Reply #13 on: February 16, 2002, 05:15:48 PM »
Its not the buffs fault (sniff)...its the lethality settings being so juiced up for gameplay that the buffs need an extra 500+ yards of lethal rang to counter fighters.  Plus I think buff guns dont have dispertion.

Y
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Offline Urchin

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« Reply #14 on: February 16, 2002, 05:41:54 PM »
La dee daaaa.......  gimme a break guys.  

Buff .50s are EXACTLY the same as fighter .50s.  You want to squeak and moan about .50s being overpowered, be my guest- but it aint JUST the ones on the buffs, since they are identical to the ones on the fighters.  

GV MGs ARE overpowered on the other hand- the .50 on an M3 is more powerful bullet for bullet than the equivlent .50 on say a P51.