Author Topic: Cougar vs CH Fighterstick/pro throttle (Read 1762 times)

straffo · « **Reply #15 on:** June 06, 2002, 03:11:26 AM »

no I was having one ... (back to X36 because of feeling)

And I've several friend who have the same troubles

as it will happen sooner or later : http://cougar.frugalsworld.com/files/AxisPlaybeta1.zip

Revvin · « **Reply #16 on:** June 06, 2002, 06:45:02 AM »

I've had mine about a month now and used it every day, mostly playing Aces High but also playing sims like IL-2 WW2OL and Falcon4.0 and the Cougar has not become 'loose' and its had a good workout. As to going back to an X36...sorry but that would be a last resort for me as the Saitek stick I had was the worst out of all the sticks I've owned for being loose around the centre. The CH and TM sticks I had have less play around the centre.

I have nothing against CH, as I said above I liked my old CH setup apart from a few niggles but their design's have stayed the same for too long. They need to start looking at stuff like rotaries which even Saitek have, they are great for inputting trim control in other sims (only AH has CT) they need to have lockable buttons to add more functions to the other buttons (like the TQS dogfight switch for instance). CH built quality IMO is second only to TM but for me they've sat on their laurels for too long.

Oh and Straffo do a search on Saitek and you'll find plenty of complaints on other boards about the weird way the centre spring returns to centre and the way the axis movement is not smooth which results in bad gunnery, my XO has one and has had to take it apart to try and solve the problem.

straffo · « **Reply #17 on:** June 06, 2002, 06:59:05 AM »

I was not trying to bash the cougar ...
It just didn't meet my expectation concerning feeling (

Concening the loose part I hope to be use right word (this word seams to be the right translation in my dictionnary

) but when the head of your stick have 1 centimeter dead band it just don't feel right for me ... especially when you've spent about 400 € in it ...
I doubt Rolls Royce have this problem with their cars ..

btw the craptek just appear to work for me(*) ... that's all I need ...
I'm just jealous of the foxy prog

but using hazardscript it'ok for my needs

(*) I know that it's not the case for all people my 1st X36 throttle broke 1 month after my purchase 3,5 year ago ...

Revvin · « **Reply #18 on:** June 06, 2002, 08:18:23 AM »

Straffo> That's been part of the problem, people have been taking that measurement from different places hence the large differences reported, to get the most accurate measurement unscrew the handle from the base and take the measurement from the connector stem on the base.

The gameport X36 had lots of problems so I have read but the USB ones were much better. At first I thought the X36 was quite nice and good quality for the cheap price but after a short while the play around the centre just became too much for me. It's a shame Saitek have let down their customers with the lack of Win XP support, I can't believe they would be so stupid but at least the community managed to sort something out. When I first tried the SGE software I thought it was a great idea to have it all integrated into explorer but soon after my system became a little unstable and would crash while using explorer. While I could'nt prove for certain it was the SGE software it was the last thing I installed onto a pretty reliable system up to that point.

Wanker · « **Reply #19 on:** June 06, 2002, 08:42:50 AM »

As I said before, I loved my CH gear, so you won't find me bashing it at all. But Revvin is correct. The FOXY programming application that comes with the Cougar is outstanding. It has these tutorials that walk you through how to do everything, and they are a huge help in getting you to understand how the programming works. The possibilities in programming the Cougar truly boggles the mind. One great feature for me is being able to set whichever hat I want to be the POV hat #1, which is in my case hat #3. It works best for my smaller hands.

I've only had my Cougar for a day, and I will admit that I think the springs are really stiff. But since the springs on the Saitek X45 and the Combatstick are so wimpy, I guess anything would feel stiff in comparison.

Verm, I'm going to keep the CH gear as a backup for the Cougar, but I know of an X45 system I can sell you for cheap.

Don · « **Reply #20 on:** June 06, 2002, 12:33:08 PM »

Verm:
I'm with you re: my appreciation for CH products. My next setup will be the USB fighterstick and pro-throttle, they cost less than the cougar and from what I know are prolly just as reliable. Now, I know folks who have just gotten Cougars, at least one of them is an Old TM user. In that way I think there is a natural attraction for him. Now because I am a CH guy, I swear by their stuff, and have had my gear for years now. My interest is in cost, efficiency and ease of use. I figure I will get that and then some from the latest CH USB stuff for less.

popeye · « **Reply #21 on:** June 06, 2002, 03:41:04 PM »

Can't imagine needing more programability than the CH USB stuff has. Of course, I just use it for AH.

(banana, any hat can be programmed to be POV, with Speedkeys or Control Manager.)

Flossy · « **Reply #22 on:** June 06, 2002, 04:46:00 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by Vermillion
And again if your gonna be honest, at least mention the fact that alot of Cougar owners are very unhappy about the overly stiff springs, and the inability to get smooth control near the break point for this reason.

I keep hearing this about stiff springs, but quite honestly I don't think they are that bad! Heck if I can get used to them, surely you big men can!

I find the stick to be extremely smooth and can't fault the whole HOTAS at all.

I used to have an all CH setup too until I got the Cougar, but as I now use Windows XP, I had to have a separate partition with Windows 98 on it just to use Speedkeys! CH's answer to that problem is to buy the USB versions of the setup - not very helpful!

Anyway, time for my daily Cougar exercises in the MA!

Doberman · « **Reply #23 on:** June 06, 2002, 04:46:07 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by Revvin
Straffo> That's been part of the problem, people have been taking that measurement from different places hence the large differences reported, to get the most accurate measurement unscrew the handle from the base and take the measurement from the connector stem on the base.

I can't figure thse guys who are moaning about 1mm of free play. My Cougar had about that much outta the box. My CH Fighterstick USB was close to 4mm out of the box. I've got an unused Combat stick with even more than that. Every Siatek stick I've ever used has had a HUGE amount. And absolutely none of that free play in the sticks has ever had any affect on my flying at all. Sounds like people just looking for something to complain about.

As far as price goes, I'm not seeing the big CH advantage here. My CH USB stick/throttle/rudder setup cost me roughly $315. When I add the rudders into my Cougar, it's not gonna come up to much more than that.

popeye, there are some people who can't imagine ever driving above the speed limit. Does that make a Ford Pinto as good a car as a Ferrari Spyder?

D

SOB · « **Reply #24 on:** June 06, 2002, 05:06:39 PM »

I miss the action of my F22...much stiffer and more smooth through the entire axis of movement in each direction. Cougar gives a much better response in AH tho'.

I like the pointless and classic "my stick is better than yours" arguments, keep it going!

SOB

PS...Funked and Verm like CH because they're used to limp sticks!

AKWarp · « **Reply #25 on:** June 06, 2002, 06:16:17 PM »

Good lord....next we'll all be posting pictures of our noodlees and arguing the merits of fat, skinny, long short, et al.....

Really, there are some good points (and bad) about BOTH setups....but MOST of the stuff some of you are arguing is OPINION items. Weak springs, strong springs...geez...whatever floats your boat. I personally like the weaker springs of the CH stuff. (and before anyone cries foul, yes, I've owned TM sticks...I do NOT like their stiff springs)....but does that make the CH stuff better or worse? Neither really.

Can program digital and analog for one button simultaneously. While I am sure there really is some sort of use for this (not that I can think of any), it does remind me a lot of the petty political bickering that I see everyday at work and is to some degree representational of "normal" life in America (LOL!)...my widget X can do more than your widget y. Come on people. Get real. I'm as much a techno gadget freak as any before me, but frankly I've got gadgets and toys that have functions on them I have no fediddleing clue what they are for or when or of I would ever need or use them...but hey, they are there...it must be better, right?

But the cougar is more real to life of the F-16 stick and throttle....well, la tee fediddleing da....and this affects me how? The way I see it, the design is a big flaw....the only real problem is the U.S. Government hasn't called me to design a stick for them yet. What I really mean is, well.....so what? But hey, if absolute realism in shape and design are your priorities, then great, have at it. But that doesn't make it better....it makes it better for YOU (and that's really the key to it all).

Bottom line is simply this: The price for the Cougar and the CH setups is nearly the same. Both setups are excellent and both work well. It literally boils down to personal tastes. Either setup will make you smile..plain and simple.

SOB · « **Reply #26 on:** June 06, 2002, 07:19:25 PM »

Booo Warp! I demand you edit your post immediately...this could've turned out to be a fun thread to read!

SOB

AKWarp · « **Reply #27 on:** June 06, 2002, 10:00:46 PM »

Well....OK SOB, if you insist..........

Look, all you dork wanking, pilot wannabe's that think your phallic replacement...er, cougar sticks are better because they cause sensations in your groin (and god knows that's the only time it happens to you tards), then you're all a bunch of ignorant clueless neanderthals.

Any moron with half a brain synapse KNOWS that CH is the king of controllers....now, take your stiff springed, cast pot metal clunkers with the breaking switches and the laundry list of "needed fixes" and go sit in the corner, shutup and color.
(oh, and it's BYOC too! (Bring Your Own Crayolas))...

Whew.......how's that SOB? Think it might stir something up?

Sorry guys...I had a...erm...request.... lol.......

straffo · « **Reply #28 on:** June 07, 2002, 01:53:42 AM »

Quote

Originally posted by Doberman

I can't figure thse guys who are moaning about 1mm of free play. My Cougar had about that much outta the box. My CH Fighterstick USB was close to 4mm out of the box. I've got an unused Combat stick with even more than that. Every Siatek stick I've ever used has had a HUGE amount. And absolutely none of that free play in the sticks has ever had any affect on my flying at all. Sounds like people just looking for something to complain about.

Firstly it's not 1 but 5 mm on the Y axis and secondly my craptek didn't have any free play ... and the transition was so hard that I gived up ...

And lastly I've not afforded a rolls to have what I consider being a Yugo

Wanker · « **Reply #29 on:** June 07, 2002, 07:45:47 AM »

Ok, after getting my Cougar setup just the way I want it, I took it out for a spin last night online. All I can say is: WOW! This is by far the best HOTAS I've ever owned. The springs are stiff, yes, but easy to get used to. The crisp response and smooth control has won me over completely.

One last thing I'm going to do is remove the detents from the throttle. I prefer a smooth action in my throttle, so this little operation will complete my Cougar configuration.

Anyone who has been waiting on the sidelines, I can heartily recommend the Cougar HOTAS without reserve!