Author Topic: Why AH won't make it, Damnit  (Read 4401 times)

Offline Gadfly

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Why AH won't make it, Damnit
« Reply #45 on: January 30, 2000, 08:57:00 PM »
The problem is, 30$ for AH and 30$ for WB, when I barely find time to fly 30$ worth for either.

So far, I like the SL's and historical missions flown with Squaddies more than the fantasy arena of AH.

I guess I'll have to wait on AH, which I think may somewhat bolster Pasquale's point.

Offline dolomite

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Why AH won't make it, Damnit
« Reply #46 on: January 30, 2000, 10:17:00 PM »
Let's not forget for some it isn't a choice. I would still be at iEN if I could connect. I never had a serious problem with the product or the community at iEN (in fact, had several friends over there). I hope iEN gets this straightened out, but until they do, there is only one choice for me.

I would add that I am a creature of habit. Once I get used to logging in and seeing the activity on a server, I grow kind of attached to it. I'm not likely to switch for any transient cause. I want to help the community progress in any way possible. I like to help the new guy. Once I'm at a place for a while it takes a crowbar to remove me. iKERNAL was that crowbar. Sorry to harp on that point, but I dearly loved DoA and WB prior to that iNFERNAL KERNAL.

WB 3.0 may save the BrandW boat, it may not. AH may make it, it may not. That's free market. I can't believe I am the only one who thinks as I do, and I firmly believe there is plenty of bang for $30.

It doesn't have to be an either/or for everyone, but for some it most definitely is. I personally wish both companies the best of luck, but for now, it is AH only for me.

Offline Swager

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Why AH won't make it, Damnit
« Reply #47 on: January 31, 2000, 11:22:00 AM »
Dolo,

One reason you keep flying AH.  Hoping to meet Swager in the air.  He is a rascal and a pirate and you want to kill him!    

Everytime you sign on you think to yourself,  "Now where is that little bastiage?" HA!!    

He has done a good job avoiding you!!    

NOTE: All this is only valid if you're not flying Knights, of course.

Keep on rockin HTC!!!!!!

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[This message has been edited by Swager (edited 01-31-2000).]
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Offline bloom25

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Why AH won't make it, Damnit
« Reply #48 on: January 31, 2000, 01:40:00 PM »
Well, judging by the current number of people currently signed up for Tour 1, (which I obtained by looking up the score of a certain former AH player who accused all of us of cheating...any guesses?   ), there are currently 1478 people playing the 2 week free trial.  Now, lets do some very simple math.  Assume half of them stay (low estimate IMO), why low and behold, that's 739 people.  Based on those original numbers at the top of this thread, it looks to me like HTC has a bright future ahead of it.  


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Offline K-KEN

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Why AH won't make it, Damnit
« Reply #49 on: January 31, 2000, 06:24:00 PM »
 
Quote
Originally posted by pasquale:
I hope it does, but I don't think it will.

Just some W.A.G 'es here, but I would say they are in the (low end)ballpark.

6 persons employed=$15,000(6x$2500 which is pretty damn conservative)
Server costs=$5,000(This is a real WAG, and includes line charges and hardware amortization)

So at it's most crude, HTC has a $20,000 per month nut.

$20,000/$29.95=667.78 Paying players(We will call Fallen the .78 of a player).


Anyone want to bet that HTC doesn't get 667 paying players in the first 6 months?

Sadly, the only reason it won't......is because you.... and folks like you won't give it a chance.  But of course, I think you are wrong.  Folks like me like it, want to play it, and enjoy it.     Sure it isn't perfect.... what's the point!  It IS fun.  It's still in Beta!  I guess your Brand W CD is more realistic.  Go figure.....and I didn't say AW, cause it's better than your brand W.
K-KEN.....the other White Meat!

Offline Gadfly

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Why AH won't make it, Damnit
« Reply #50 on: January 31, 2000, 06:40:00 PM »
umm, I hate to be the one to break it to you, Ken, but it is not in Beta anymore, so you will have to pony up your 30 dolla like the rest(Cya back in AW).

Offline Aussie

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Why AH won't make it, Damnit
« Reply #51 on: January 31, 2000, 08:13:00 PM »
I dont see any reason why AH shouldnt get plenty of players signed up. Theres a HUGE number of players out there to be poached from other sims. A large number of the players here are from AW and FA who have finally found an affordable REALISTIC dogfighting sim. They can now get top rating flight models and great graphics without it costing them an arm and a leg. Id suggest most of the AW and FA pilots havent moved to WB in the past because they like to spend a LOT of time on their preferred sim and cant afford the hourly charges of WB. AH offers them an alternative and I think they'll come over in droves (as they already seem to have done).

Add to that the small number of disgruntled WB people who for one reason or another want to punish iEN for not providing them with the features they demanded and you easily have a user base capable of keeping AH economical.

Personally, Ive never played AW but I tried FA and thought it was a bit arcadish. I like WB and Im comfortable with it. Ive tried to spend more time on AH recently, expecially with version 1 and Ive grown to like it a lot. However, I dont want to drop WB and I cant afford both (especially with the exchange rates in Australia) so I reluctantly have to drop AH  at pay time. That doesnt mean I wont be keeping an eye on its progress and Im open to be poached from WB to AH at any time if the circumstances suit me - the customer. I consider myself average so I suspect there are plenty like me who are in WB or FA or AW and will stick to it for now but will keep a finger on the flight sim (or WWII sim) pulse, with a view to changing when or if the time is right for them.

So AH will probably have little trouble getting a firm customer base, and theres plenty more in the wings who are prepared to make the move given the right circumstances. Pyro has done well to get everything running so well so soon. He's drawn players from several different areas who've now met up, made friends, created squadrons, had social meetings and such. AH is now its own community and that alone will help to hold the players together.

Good luck Pyro. Youve worked hard for it. But I suspect luck doesnt play to much of a part in your plans - people like you make their own luck and you certainly have the ability to make it work.

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aussie
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[This message has been edited by aussie (edited 01-31-2000).]

Offline Westy

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Why AH won't make it, Damnit
« Reply #52 on: February 01, 2000, 09:01:00 AM »
" Id suggest most of the AW and FA pilots havent moved to WB in the past because they like to spend a LOT of time on their referred sim and cant afford the hourly charges of WB"

 Bingo Aussie. With two car payment, a decent mortgage, etc etc (ends list before the small violins get dragged out) I could not afford to pay the hourly fee for the time I spent online flying. And I did not want to watch a clock and fly less.

 -Westy

Offline jedi

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Why AH won't make it, Damnit
« Reply #53 on: February 01, 2000, 10:37:00 AM »
Well, I think Pyro and HT are smart enough guys to learn from their mistakes.  Without being privvy to their business discussions, I think in hindsight one of the things they probably regret is that they had to, to some extent, "sell their souls" to ICI/iMOL back when WB was in fledgling status.  Although the repercussions were not immediate, and their creative input was not necessarily stifled, in the end, it was Pyro and HT (and Mo and Hoof and...) who ended up leaving, and iEN who ended up with Warbirds, something iEN didn't create, and something, IMO, they don't fully "appreciate" or even understand.

So wouldn't HTC remember that particularly bitter episode, and have a plan for avoiding it this time?  I suspect they would, and I suspect their reputations and performance probably earned them some financial backing that enable them to proceed at their current pace without necessarily being in a "make-or-break" situation YET.

But, that said, just how big IS the "hard-core flight sim community's" niche?  Are there vast untapped supplies of customers just waiting to experience takeoff torque, adverse yaw, and snap-spins into the beautiful Rolling Terrain (tm)?  Or is that niche too small to be spread amongst 3 or 4 multiplayer sims?  If so, AH's customer base will rely on enticing players away from AW, FA, and WB more than it will on finding that untapped reservoir of newbies.

To that end, they have, IMO, made a bit of a mistake.  They have forced me to make a decision.  Without dwelling on the reasoning, let's just say that everyone like me who decides to stay where they are instead of switching to AH represents lost revenue until AH proves to US that it is a superior product.  For me, they haven't done it, so they lose my money until they do.

Contrast that to the beginning of CK.  I was unconvinced that CK was "superior" to Air Warrior when CK first appeared.  I remained unconvinced for over a year.  I kept my AW account current, but I ALSO kept a basic CK/WB account going.  At $20 for AW and $10 for WB (plus any extra WB I wanted to play) this was financially acceptable to me, and allowed WB to keep my interest until (with version 1.11-2.0) I was finally convinced, and switched to WB.

AH does not give me that option.  To "keep my hand in" AH without giving up the (IMO) superior product (WB) is only possible if I'm willing to spend a combined $60 or reduce my WB account to a minimum level.  The quality of AH doesn't meet my requirements yet to do either of those.

Flame away, tout AH all you want.  Give me an option to play AH at a "limited" level of some kind, or you won't see any of my money until you're CLEARLY the superior product to folks like me.

You made us choose too soon  

 

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Offline dolomite

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Why AH won't make it, Damnit
« Reply #54 on: February 01, 2000, 11:06:00 AM »
Jedi-

Nothing wrong with respectfully stating an opinion, and that is exactly what you've done. S!  

Offline fd ski

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Why AH won't make it, Damnit
« Reply #55 on: February 01, 2000, 12:26:00 PM »
This is a simple question of balancing:

a)smaller fee=more players
b)higher fee=less players

Now you figure out which equation beings more money - and there you have it.

Quick question:
Does 30$/month have this thing about it... like it's a lot ...
19.95$ on the other hand is a one little bill in your wallet... like a .... waste away money...

Still would keep kids away...

Just wondering..

I'll pay 30$/month - cause i believe in the crew and i support their dedication...


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Offline BigJim

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Why AH won't make it, Damnit
« Reply #56 on: February 01, 2000, 12:27:00 PM »
AH will succeed for a very obvious reasons,

1.  Game has appeal

2. Game is affordable and will draw all those 200 a month WB players sooner or later

3. Game continues to improve on almost a daily basis

4. Producers are also game players and listen to the other folks and work on doing something about it.

5. Human nature dictates that you will pay the lower price for a simular product and this one is by far superior at the moment

Offline wabbit

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Why AH won't make it, Damnit
« Reply #57 on: February 01, 2000, 12:55:00 PM »
Although, I'd like to see $19.95 a month, for us poor slobs, both the connect and the flight model will make me stay with AH.
The planes will keep coming in.  Hopefully a realistic map, Europe, Med, Pacific, or all will show up. Either way, I'm here to stay and the entire squad will be staying too!

Player #1001, (right after my bro)

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Offline Mighty1

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Why AH won't make it, Damnit
« Reply #58 on: February 01, 2000, 01:07:00 PM »
Well I believe in the game enough that I'm going to sign up even tho my joystick is broken and it'll be another week or 2 before the new 1 comes in.



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