Author Topic: Question.  (Read 4768 times)

Offline WldThing

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« on: October 12, 2002, 12:33:27 AM »
I always wondered why we cannot kill our engines in a fight, when we fly in KOTH... Would someone mind explaining this.  We all have a different way of flying this way.  In that one night we have to switch to doing throttle control that we normally would do 98% of engine cutting in the MA?

Why cant we fight the way we are use to fighting???

Offline Shane

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« Reply #1 on: October 12, 2002, 12:37:07 AM »
i'd imagine to prevent people from using it to extend fuel... even at 0 throttle, engine will consume some fuel.

personally i never cut engine in MA... i use throttle... but there are those gamers who do kill engine to decelerate rapidly...

if it were a real engine, that kind of thing would really mess it up... but... ...
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Offline Tumor

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« Reply #2 on: October 12, 2002, 06:07:27 AM »
Quote
Originally posted by Shane
i'd imagine to prevent people from using it to extend fuel... even at 0 throttle, engine will consume some fuel.

personally i never cut engine in MA... i use throttle... but there are those gamers[/color] who do kill engine to decelerate rapidly...

if it were a real engine, that kind of thing would really mess it up... but... ...


Just my humble opinion but.. I do appreciate the rule.
"Dogfighting is useless"  :Erich Hartmann

Offline Wotan

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« Reply #3 on: October 12, 2002, 06:37:12 AM »
turnin your engine off in any fight is dweeby as hell imho.

Every other person in the main does that. Its up there with opening  your gear and flaps at any speed in il2 to cause an over shoot. They had a problem with folks turnin their eng off in il2 to cool umm down fast. They fixed that, your eng wont restart.

I know ah is a game but still. 1 button push instantly restarts an eng and you see folks togglin the eng on off otd.

But theres lotsa stuff thats as equally "dweeby". Its your game play how ya want :)

Offline BigMax

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« Reply #4 on: October 12, 2002, 01:55:18 PM »
My only arguement is that I don't believe the WWII planes, to the best of my knowledge, could do it at all...  I'm not quoting any sources other than comparing the little I know about todays aircraft. Specifically that a lot require and external 24VDC power source to turn their starters.. Some can use a 400Hz source but I don't believe their onboard charging circuit would produce enough amperage to start the engine reliably.  I think HTC should write a code to prevent mid-air restarts...

  From the CM perspective, whether we agree or disagree, the rules are the rules.  We must interpret and enforce fairly so ALL participants have a fair chance.

Offline WldThing

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« Reply #5 on: October 12, 2002, 02:25:29 PM »
But i dont see how its fair to the people that do cut their engines... isnt it unfair to them? An unadvantage to them?

And IMO fighting Nikis in the P51 isnt real life either, just like cutting your engines wasnt in the war.

Offline Wotan

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« Reply #6 on: October 12, 2002, 03:02:28 PM »
wildthing planes with good accelleration, like an la7, cuts his eng and the increased drag stops him from overshooting. He kills the eng, then turns eng back on and accellerates.

The 109 and 190 you see this as well, same with the f4u and jug.

I admit that you dont see alot of 51 pilots doing, well lets not get into that :)

Like I said this is just another in the list but who am I to tell some who to fly.

I just see the point of getting things correctly modelled if we just look for ways to get around it.

The plane v plane match ups we see in AH may not be what faced each other in the war, but AH aint ww2. However, I think most of us want planes are perform as close as possible to the real thing.

I see the reason for the one button push eng start, who wants to sit otr and run down a check list everytime they wanna fly. But when in a fight thats different because it takes advantage of something that is only there as a gameplay concession to begin with.

Offline Shane

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« Reply #7 on: October 12, 2002, 04:06:01 PM »
i never cut eng... it's all throttle control....  but then i guess real planes probably didn't like having their throttles maxed/min'd out all the time either.

:rolleyes:


 if it's a rule, it's a rule... learn to deal with it in that situation.
« Last Edit: October 12, 2002, 05:59:16 PM by Shane »
Surrounded by suck and underwhelmed with mediocrity.
I'm always right, it just takes some poepl longer to come to that realization than others.
I'm not perfect, but I am closer to it than you are.
"...vox populi, vox dei..."  ~Alcuin ca. 798

Offline WldThing

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« Reply #8 on: October 12, 2002, 04:08:00 PM »
Even tough i think the rule is very stupid IMO, i guess i have to live with it  

And its not easy to toggle on/off in a fight, no matter how easy people think it is.

Offline Dowding

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« Reply #9 on: October 12, 2002, 04:46:29 PM »
Gamers. Who needs them. Cheating tards.
War! Never been so much fun. War! Never been so much fun! Go to your brother, Kill him with your gun, Leave him lying in his uniform, Dying in the sun.

Offline hblair

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« Reply #10 on: October 15, 2002, 04:43:02 PM »
After getting killed by nath with the engine chop many a time, I adapted it myself. :) It works, your plane does slow down faster killing the engine. It's no more gamey than stallfighting at 100 mph flaps down dragging a wing in the dirt. It's just something some of you haven't heard of, therefore it is, of course, gamey. ;)

Offline BigMax

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« Reply #11 on: October 15, 2002, 07:05:05 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by WldThing
But i dont see how its fair to the people that do cut their engines... isnt it unfair to them? An unadvantage to them?

And IMO fighting Nikis in the P51 isnt real life either, just like cutting your engines wasnt in the war.


Again, you seem to be the only one that has a big issue with this...  I personally don't care either way... But KOTH is designed to provide a level playing field for ALL participants and one of the provisions is that no one can cut their engines.

If there were lots of participants with similar complaints, then I imagine the designer would bough to the populous.  However, everyone else seems to be able to manage with their engines on...


As to your second point:
KOTH is a same plane competition, so the NIKI/P51 thing would never happen.  As I said before, my opinion that planes shouldn't be mid-air restartable is based on my limited knowledge of planes' electrical systems and will hopefully be factorred into the game in a later revision and apply to all arenas.

--All playing by the same rules is as fair as it gets... I'm sorry if the rules don't suit your personal flying style.---

Offline Manedew

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« Reply #12 on: October 16, 2002, 11:19:34 AM »
Fought AKNimitz in a KOTH when it was WildWensday ... he used it (turned off engine) as CM of event didn't mind it then myself (just cut throttle hit the rudders hard ..... But rules are rules (just make sure you don't rearm on a cv in a p38 :rolleyes:

Offline Wotan

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« Reply #13 on: October 16, 2002, 12:15:16 PM »
Quote
It's just something some of you haven't heard of, therefore it is, of course, gamey.


Its alot more then that,  you want to list the restart sequence. Killing your eng is as gamey as it gets. Stall fighting while not advisable at lo alts isnt "impossible" But turnin your eng off under 1000ft would be.

Thats may be why a lotta folks gave up on events like this. But what do I know........

Offline hblair

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« Reply #14 on: October 16, 2002, 01:05:21 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by Wotan


Its alot more then that,  you want to list the restart sequence. Killing your eng is as gamey as it gets. Stall fighting while not advisable at lo alts isnt "impossible" But turnin your eng off under 1000ft would be.

Thats may be why a lotta folks gave up on events like this. But what do I know........


Would a real pilot fire off most of his ammo to lighten his plane?
 
Would he sit with his head up against the cockpit glass so he can see down past the nose of his plane?

These are common things some people do to get an edge.

Do you think they're gamey wotan? :)