The single most important feature of 1.08..

[highflyer]

hmm 250mph... I was hoping that if you had been in a diving turn you would have been upwards of 300+ then settled out at around 320 or so on your egress.

Meanwhile, if the n1k was  Turning hard for you as you zoomed passed and he had already been slow say (150-250mph) then no he should have not caught up to you.

Due to the n1ks Ability to accelerate however he could have easily sped up to around 300 (energy FM faluts eh?)

The whole problem with this is How much of his speed did he KEEP as he turned throughout his 360. (FM faults with energy retention)

It sounds like you were going slow however if you have only gotten up to 250mph on the deck. The n1k would most likely at this point just accellerated up to you.

Summary: ya seemed to be going slow for a Dive, and although the distant gap of 2.5 was there, it may have been closed due to the energy retention faults of the n1k, and the overall better n1k ability to accelearte over an A8.

[R4M]

Todd: Ok with me   but I've seen (and suffered) quite many times the problem with the N1K E-retaining (mostly in zooms)


Highflier: 250-280, cant recall exactly. Anyway that Niki was definitely way slower than me when I levelled, and he was pointing the other way with 180 degrees still to turn before facing me. He got out from a 360degree turn and then caught with a faster plane.

The run wasnt on the deck. It was around at 2-3K, where the 190A8 tops its speed at lower altitudes. At those alts the A8 is FASTER than the N1K2. Even with a rocket in his prettythang he shouldn't have caught with me.

About the dive itself dont be surprised. When I saw him start the close flat turn I cutted throttle for a couple of seconds to reduce my speed a bit and reach the 190 corner speed a bit before, and thus helping me to win a deflection shoot before. Still, I insist, I was NOTABLY FASTER than the N1K2.

We can always ask Apar about their speed when the nik killed him. As I said, immediatly after he was killed, I bounced the N1K2.

[ 10-03-2001: Message edited by: R4M ]

[Am0n]

Im no air craft buff, but was the N1K carrying that much ammo in its time?

I got some film my self of a N1k doing some unbelievable things!

had one on deck TNB with another AC, i zoomed in (p47-11) from 5-7k above, took some shots and kept going. the nerd followed me i dove more and got to 500+ mph and leveled. after he got closer i pulled up hard into a black out manuever, stayed blacked out for a good time, when i came to he was aimlessly heading away from me, i sixed him and blew him to toejam..  

Unbelievable eh????
 
 Ohh wait wasnt supposed to end like that.
 
 He should have used his tractor beem to latch on to me in my black out manuever.  

[Urchin]

Yea, Ram, my guess is that the N1K2 just plain outaccelerated you.  A dive of 2k really isn't all that much of a dive, coupled with the fact that you chopped throttle and turned to go for the snapshot (no matter how fast you were going before, you just chopped 100mph off your speed with that move), and once you missed you said you continued to turn until you were pointing home (don't know how large a turn this was)- and levelled out to run.  A N1K can be going 200 when you are going 300 and more than likely he will hit 350 before you do.  The 190A8 will get its bellybutton handed to it in a fight with a N1K if it has to run.  The N1K will outdive the 190 and it will retain its speed better than the 190 will.  I honestly think that once you missed the shot you lost the fight.

[highflyer]

Ya know what I really hate though  

Those guys that are in your dead 12.. Getting waxed by your 50cals.. and all of a sudden they turn into floating space craft!

All of a sudden, they are Floating away as if they had hit some zero G world ,... THEN suddenly ZOOOOOOOOOoooOOOOoooOOMMM around to your Rear and start shooting!

NOW that is some UFO! CRAP!    

hehe Iknow i know its called LAG.. but I think that things like that should be adressed.

how about, if the guy warps away like this, Your FE keeps him at his current position until you finish blasting him !  

Anyway.. R4M. I understand.. I too think that the n1k has problems.. but thats Why Hitech is looking inot changing all that right?  

Fear not, for the UFO-Like-Anti-G-Ride may no longer perform the way that it does in some aspects.

[R4M]

Originally posted by Urchin:
Yea, Ram, my guess is that the N1K2 just plain outaccelerated you.  A dive of 2k really isn't all that much of a dive, coupled with the fact that you chopped throttle and turned to go for the snapshot (no matter how fast you were going before, you just chopped 100mph off your speed with that move), and once you missed you said you continued to turn until you were pointing home (don't know how large a turn this was)- and levelled out to run.    

So, let me get this straight...A N1K2, just out from a CLOSE STALLFIGHT (likely starting speed being lower than 150mph), should catch a 190A8 wich bounced it, and is egressing more than 100mph faster, with a desviaton of 180 degrees (the N1K2 was moving away when I levelled the plane)...because what?...you must be kidding.


I didnt say I was turning until I pointed home. I said I kept the deflection shoot UNTIL I was heading home, and AT THAT SAME MOMENT I levelled and headed home, speed around 250-280mph IAS.


"A N1K can be going 200 when you are going 300 and more than likely he will hit 350 before you do."

Really? even when it is pointing the other way and has 180 degrees to turn while the other plane is moving away?  

dont think so


The 190A8 will get its bellybutton handed to it in a fight with a N1K if it has to run.

Completely false. check HTC's charts if you dont believe me. The Fw190A8 is faster than the N1K2 at the alt we were.

The N1K will outdive the 190 and it will retain its speed better than the 190 will.

Now ,lets see. A plane wich fully loaded weights something like 8000-9000lbs (have no idea on the real weight of the N1K2 so I might be in a mistake here) outdiving a heavyweight like the 190A8 that weights that UNLOADED??.You must be kidding.

 But anyway this is not of interest here, because I didnt dive at any moment after the trackin gshot and levelling the plane. I egressed at 2-3K of alt and kept that alt until I got my rudder kicked away.

  I honestly think that once you missed the shot you lost the fight.


True. That was the reason I went towards home and didnt stand to fight. But he shouldnt have catched me, and that is MY point.

BTW and just FYI: Dont underestimate the Fw190A8's acceleration under 5K. A plane wich climbs 3500fpm at full load at that altitude is not that bad, and can give you some nasty surprises.

[ 10-03-2001: Message edited by: R4M ]

[JimBear]

The single most important feature of 1.08..

Will be a new Map with Beer and Pizza somewhere on it again  

[Karnak]

Am0n,

Some Japanese guys posted a whole bunch of info that convinced HTC that the ammo on the N1K2 needed to be ajusted upwards.  Thus we have an aircraft with gobs of ammo.

The amount of 20mm ammo carried by the N1K2 (900 rounds) and F4U-1C (924 rounds) is incredible.  However, I have never found any info to contradict it.

[Blue Mako]

R4M,

Take a chill pill man.

I didn't get personal with you so why do you feel the need to get personal with me?  Take it easy before you blow an o-ring or something.

My post was trying to point out that you didn't give us the complete story.  Don't expect everybody to take your word as gospel when you don't give us all the facts.  Explain yourself, no need to get worked up though.  Re-read what I said, I stated that I think the n1k FM is in need of work but my opinion is that it is not a UFO.

And the whiner comment was directed at the board in general...

[airspro]

"There was a massive furball there between knits and bishops. I had already 7 kills when I saw apar low tangling with a N1K2. I made a pass and missed the shot. Did a loop and came in again and found that Apar was already dead. I fired at the lower/slower nik, wich was doing a close-to-right turn, using the 190's instantaneous turnrate to win a deflection shot, but I missed. I levelled pointing towards home because low fuel. The N1K2 completed his 360deg turn, levelled behind me. All this at some 3K of alt.

3 minutes later I was dead. The %!"$ing UFO caught me even when I dived on him, fired, and made him turn 360 degrees while I was already egressing."

I seen the very first problem right off >

apar + massive furball + low tangling with a N1K2

You better get used to it (dieing trying to save his ass), or teach him better .

I said enough , have a nice day
 

[Urchin]

Originally posted by R4M:



So, let me get this straight...A N1K2, just out from a CLOSE STALLFIGHT (likely starting speed being lower than 150mph), should catch a 190A8 wich bounced it, and is egressing more than 100mph faster, with a desviaton of 180 degrees (the N1K2 was moving away when I levelled the plane)...because what?...you must be kidding.


I didnt say I was turning until I pointed home. I said I kept the deflection shoot UNTIL I was heading home, and AT THAT SAME MOMENT I levelled and headed home, speed around 250-280mph IAS.


"A N1K can be going 200 when you are going 300 and more than likely he will hit 350 before you do."

Really? even when it is pointing the other way and has 180 degrees to turn while the other plane is moving away?  

dont think so

I do.  The 190A8 doesn't have earthshaking acceleration.  How far away was he when he was pointing "180 degrees" from you?  I'm guess under d1.0, furthermore, he was still turning, so he probably only had about 90 degrees left to go on his end.


"The 190A8 will get its bellybutton handed to it in a fight with a N1K if it has to run."

Completely false. check HTC's charts if you dont believe me. The Fw190A8 is faster than the N1K2 at the alt we were.

Completely true.  The 190A8 is faster by 5-10 mph at 3k.  The N1K2 WILL accelerate to its top speed faster than the 190A8.  Furthermore, just about the only way you are going to get away from a N1K2 in a 190A8 is to run until his WEP runs out, because you won't be gaining very much ground (you'll be losing ground if you start slow).

" The N1K will outdive the 190 and it will retain its speed better than the 190 will."

Now ,lets see. A plane wich fully loaded weights something like 8000-9000lbs (have no idea on the real weight of the N1K2 so I might be in a mistake here) outdiving a heavyweight like the 190A8 that weights that UNLOADED??.You must be kidding.

No, I'm not kidding.  The N1K2 will outdive the 190A8, and it WILL hold its speed better once both planes level out.  I know it is lighter, perhaps that is part of the 'bug' in the Flight Model.

 But anyway this is not of interest here, because I didnt dive at any moment after the trackin gshot and levelling the plane. I egressed at 2-3K of alt and kept that alt until I got my rudder kicked away.

You are damned if you do and damned if you don't in that situation.  IF you dive to build up speed faster, you give the N1K2 room to do the same thing, which it does better than you do.  If you stay level and try to outrace it, again you lose, because it accelerates better than you do, and the top speed is not that much below yours.  You ever run down a pony in a 109G10?  I'm sure you have, I know I have.  This is despite the fact that the pony has a faster top speed on the deck by a few mph on HTC's charts.  The way I normally do it is to do a shallow dive to speed up, followed by a very very shallow climb to get my altitude back, followed by a dive, until you are close enough to fire and make him break, sort of like how you spent your last minute in your words.

 " I honestly think that once you missed the shot you lost the fight."


True. That was the reason I went towards home and didnt stand to fight. But he shouldnt have catched me, and that is MY point.

You aren't flying a Dora here Ram.  The N1K2 is 5 miles an hour slower than the 190A8, maybe 10 TOPS.  Given his better acceleration, I am not surprised he caught you.

BTW and just FYI: Dont underestimate the Fw190A8's acceleration under 5K. A plane wich climbs 3500fpm at full load at that altitude is not that bad, and can give you some nasty surprises.

Whats the N1K2's climb rate under 5k?  It is a damn sight better than 3500 feet I'd wager.  In practice, I've not gotten anywhere CLOSE to 3500 FPM in a 190a8, unless I'm at 50% gas right off the runway.

[ 10-03-2001: Message edited by: R4M

[ 10-03-2001: Message edited by: Urchin ]

[ 10-03-2001: Message edited by: Urchin ]

[DanielMcIntyre]

Your all utter utter, UTTER Bastards!!!!!  

[Montezuma]

Originally posted by R4M:

(have no idea on the real weight of the N1K2 so I might be in a mistake here[ 10-03-2001: Message edited by: R4M ]

Does anyone else notice how the luftwhiner N1K2 witch hunt is missing facts?

[ 10-04-2001: Message edited by: Montezuma ]

[DanielMcIntyre]

 

originally posted by Dead Man Flying

I find it amusing that those who seem to be complaining about N1Ks also qualify their complaints by demonstrating how much success they have while flying against them.

DMF you misunderstand my reasons for posting my kill stats vs N1K.  I got the impression that both you and Karnak thought I was unaware of how to engage the N1K in a Typhoon.

So I posted my stats, I make no claim to be anything but at a average player in the MA, have only been playing AH for a couple of months.  

When I meet people like SirLoin, Lev, GTR, Fester, Ripsnort etc I get my bellybutton kicked severely, as I should.  What irkes me is getting my bellybutton kicked by a plane, not a person.


<S>

BTW This my last N1K post till 1.08 <G>


         

[Dead Man Flying]

Originally posted by Zygote:
When I meet people like SirLoin, Lev, GTR, Fester, Ripsnort etc I get my bellybutton kicked severely, as I should.  What irkes me is getting my bellybutton kicked by a plane, not a person.

If you'd met any of them with you in a N1K, do you think the outcome would be any different?  

And I hope you post again... say... tomorrow?  <crosses fingers>

A man can dream!

-- Todd/DMF