Author Topic: Perk Planes?? Is this becoming Air warrior Relaxed Realism??? (Read 2146 times)

Hajo · « **on:** January 13, 2001, 01:16:00 AM »

The more I think about the subject "Perked Planes" I wonder why a community such as Aces High, that prides itself in correct FM, Lethality of weapons etc. is even thinking about "Perk Planes?" I've heard many times suggestions to HT online that the fM of this aircraft is not correct, this should be changed, it didn't bleed e this badly etc.it holds it's E to well etc.is taking an "about face" and introducing "Quake Planes" into the mix? Are we turning Aces High into Air Warrior Relaxed Realism? Most of us I think are "die hard" flight simmers. We want correct performance, FM etc, and now we want a quake plane? The advancements of technology during world war II were such that aircraft design and technology advanced quickly. There are planes that are prop driven in some instances that a far superior to what we have in the MA at this time, can't we just introduce them? NOT the Me262 or the 163! Air warrior let us use Me262s one day a month and it turned the place into Jet Warrior, talk about boring! And who the heck is going to evade a 262 coming at 500mph with 4 X 30mm cannons? It will be on you, by you, and you'll be seeing it in your chute if you are still alive. that's just one example. How are we going to keep "newbies" who are expected to pay 30 dollars a month to fare, when any aircraft with a seasoned AH pilot is more then likely going to shoot them down with a "regular" craft, let alone a craft that is not realistic in performance. If I were on a two week trial period, got my butt kicked on a regular basis, and found out that not only did I have to defeat that pilot, but also an unrealistically performing aircraft, I don't think I'd spend 30 dollars a month for the aggrevation! I want to have fun, which means at least a level playing field, not one tilted to an already experienced pilot flying a craft that is performing unrealistically, lessening my chances of even pinging him let alone getting his or her sights on him.
As stated above, I was just using the Me262 as an example. even if one "perks" the C-hog, Nik, or even P-51 it lessens the realism of the game. I do not fly the c-hog, and I see nothing wrong with it, as it is at this time. As long as it's performing correctly let it be! One doesn't have to go HO with it! there are ways to merge with it avoiding the HO, and if flying a less maneuverable craft such as the fW etc, all I can say is this. If pilots spotted a craft with superior qualites, and an advantage, they avoided combat! simple, they wished to live! there are prop driven craft that have yet to be introduced into the MA that are supereior to what is there now. Let's just take the natural course, and let craft like the dora, as an example etc. be introduced into the mix. Lets' not do something that is totally uncharachteristic of a game and community that prides itself on the realism of this combat flight sim. "Perk" is not real, It's just "Quake" spelled a different way. I left Air warrior because of the realism founded in this flight sim. I do hope that the realism stays, and "perk" is forgotten. If anyone would need a "perk" plane, give them to the newbies, at least they'll have some fun <G>

Karnak · « **Reply #1 on:** January 13, 2001, 01:40:00 AM »

Hajo,
Where did you get the idea that HTC is going to introduce aircraft with "unrealistic" flight models?

The idea is that we are using reasonably accurate simulations of WWII hardware in a massively multiplayer online game. We are not re-fighting WWII.

In the context of the game it would not be possible to introduce aircraft like the Spitfire F.MkXIV, F4U-4, Ta152, A7M2 or Tempest, let alone an Me262a or Me163 without making things like the Spitfire MkIX, F4U-1D, Fw190A-8, A6M5b and Typhoon pointless, let alone older stuff, without a control mechanism. The perk system is that mechanism.

Further, HTC can set the perk price wherever it needs to be to keep the best players from constantly tooling around in Me262s.

You can have realistic equipment without redoing WWII.

------------------
We few, we happy few, we band of brothers;
For he to-day that sheds his blood with me
Shall be my brother

Sisu
-Karnak

[This message has been edited by Karnak (edited 01-13-2001).]

Midnight · « **Reply #2 on:** January 13, 2001, 02:08:00 AM »

EDITED WRONG.. SEE BELOW

[This message has been edited by Midnight (edited 01-13-2001).]

Midnight · « **Reply #3 on:** January 13, 2001, 02:10:00 AM »

Hajo, no one said the perk planes are going to be unrealistic. They will be modelled as realistically as the rest of the AH plane set. The perk planes will just be some of the more high-performance planes that maybe were late-war or something. I am sure that none will be "Quake" modelled. They will all have their weekness. Like the Me-262.. Sure it was fast, but it didn't take many bullets to put one of those jet engines out of commission. See?

As for newbies. It is the same in any sim. If they want to live they will get to know who their countrymen are and hang with them. If they can't handle the way AH works, then they can go play AW.

And again, let me restate what I have said in a couple other posts already. Quit whining about what perk planes do and don't do, how people fly them, how much they cost, whn they should be available and all that other garbage. Wait and see what happens after they are introduced. If the majority of players sees something way out of whack, I am sure HTC will make whatever corrections are needed. So enough already.

[This message has been edited by Midnight (edited 01-13-2001).]

Tyro48 · « **Reply #4 on:** January 13, 2001, 04:29:00 AM »

What the perk system says is we want to be a Paul Tagalbue and make this a "on any given Sunday" flight sim. Let the game develope its own character and quit regulating everything to death. HTC make it realistic and let the people who lay their $30 bucks down sort it out, country to country, head to head whatever but lose the perk idea quick.

Dowding · « **Reply #5 on:** January 13, 2001, 04:50:00 AM »

Absolutely inane Tyro.

Have you played 1.05 recently? Nothing but F4us and spits, because they are perceived to be the strongest planes. Do you really think that if we have Tempests and Spit 14s that these won't become the most abundant planes in the sky?

Self-regulation my arse.

Tyro48 · « **Reply #6 on:** January 13, 2001, 05:25:00 AM »

Then thats what the community wants you/we dont need HTC telling us what our $30 bucks can or cant fly, inane I dont think so, let HTC model the plane if you want to fly it fine if not fine thats your choice, we dont need a perk sys, three in humane dynamics gets us exactly what we have, and you beleive HTC didnt know this would happen and then we roll out the saving perk sys, B. S.

You want balance in the MA then reduce it to two countrys or up it to four.

If you wnat your "arse" regulated fine for you, I on the other hand rather make my choice freely, just slide your canopy shut pick your plane and take your chances or go play quake!

Was just on today in fact to satisfy your inquiring mind, and there to your surprise were A6m's, Niks, P-38, F4-U's, spits, yak, and P-51's, so that flys in the face of your facts about spits/F4U's only, the real question is do you see whats really around you or must what you see be regulated also?

Democracy make your own choice and live with it!

-tronski- · « **Reply #7 on:** January 13, 2001, 06:23:00 AM »

Can we all say....RPS

-tronski-
486 Sqn (NZ), "Hiwa hau Maka"

Westy · « **Reply #8 on:** January 13, 2001, 08:29:00 AM »

This is to no one in paricular but rather to alot of folks in general:

It is getting more apparant every week that folks just don't think before they post, or if they do they have a hard time expressing what they really mean. Because they just don't know what the fediddle they're talking about and it's more than obvious that they don't read what Pyro or HiTech write.

-Westy

[This message has been edited by Westy (edited 01-13-2001).]

fats · « **Reply #9 on:** January 13, 2001, 08:49:00 AM »

Everyone will be able to dodge a Me 262. It's just a nuisance when you are fighting with other air craft.

// fats

Lance · « **Reply #10 on:** January 13, 2001, 09:00:00 AM »

Blah blah blah.

Hajo · « **Reply #11 on:** January 13, 2001, 09:53:00 AM »

<phew> I misunderstood, my bad, aircraft will be realistic (perk) in modeling, not unrealistic. but I still feel the same way about letting one have an advantage in greater degree, then is already possible in the game. Let me try to explain. We chose the aircraft we fly. There is a margin of performance disparity already configured within the game simply by looking at the aircraft already available. for instance, and in my case I fly th A5 probably 75% of the time. I know as far as speed goes, it's in the middle of the pack or lower. Turning and E retention at the bottom of the food chain. Climb rate, well lets just say it is also placed at the bottom of the list. It does however roll well, has fair lethality with it's 4 20mm cannons, but in my opinion the spitIX is more lethal with the two 20mm and 2 .50 cal option. My thoughts about this are for game play only. A newbie trying out the game, as I said, might be easily discouraged from signing on because of his greater chances for failure then success caused by a "tilting" of the playing field in the direction of an already experienced player. Technology advanced during WW2, and in a post I read already about this subject stating we aren't replaying WW2, my answer is simply why are we flying WW2 aircraft then? This ain't Crimson Skies. I would prefer the simple course by just permitting the later war years planes be introduced, and available to all on an even basis, not a selective one.

[This message has been edited by Hajo (edited 01-13-2001).]

Tyro48 · « **Reply #12 on:** January 13, 2001, 10:03:00 AM »

Enlighten us Westy! Be succinct!

Tac · « **Reply #13 on:** January 13, 2001, 10:13:00 AM »

Hajo, no matter what plane a newbie flies, no matter what his veteran opponent flies, that newbie has a very low chance of surviving anyway. AH has a collection of very skilled pilots, which was something that really ticked the hell outta me when I started here. After 2 months I "got it" and began to enjoy the game and rise in the food chain for a change.

If the perk system had been in place when I was a newbie it wouldve been the same thing. If the me-262 and other "perk" planes had been avaliable and UNPERKED when I was a newbie you can bet your bellybutton that I wouldve flown it exlusively.... and get shot down in it in the same way as I got shot down in the p51/109/p38.

The problem with what you suggest, the no-perking of any craft is that people will ONLY fly the late war planes and thus HTC wouldve wasted its efforts in modeling the early war planes like the p40, p39, bf109e, etc. Not to mention that the ONLY thing you would see in the MA would be Me262's.

In the MA right now you will see a sickening % of F4's and Spitfires. Maybe because they are carrier based... but in most field vs field you will still see them. Now compare that to v1.04, where F4's were seen every now and then and you got to fight against all AC almost all the time (though spits were annoyingly regular back then too). Now its just F4's and spits almost all the time.

Pork! Its what's for dinner!

lazs · « **Reply #14 on:** January 13, 2001, 10:30:00 AM »

I love early war and late war bores me others have different preferences. Most will just wander away when they can't grab their favorite plane for a day, a week or even most of a tour so.... RPS is allways bad. Those flying early and late will be fewer than mid and a good percentage of those will be squeaking as they fly.

Mid war only like current AH, like we have now is the most popular/least offensive. Lots of planes to choose from. Parity, choice, fairness but.... lacking a way to use early or late war planes.

Idiotic "perk" system is the worst of all worlds... 10-50% of all the planes in the arena will be noticiably or percieved better than the rest and will not be available to the new or casual flyer.... He won't care why,, he will just know that he is getting stomped by good pilots in ac that are unavailable to him. There is also no way to introduce early war planes. It's backwards... It is custom made for animosity, and it is an incomplete and unworkable solution so far as early war is concerned.

There is of course a solution that would allow everyone to fly anything, early, mid and late, they wanted at any time against planes of equal ability.
lazs