Author Topic: Insufficient perked Tiger  (Read 647 times)

Offline Widewing

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Insufficient perked Tiger
« on: February 24, 2003, 08:29:58 AM »
I have not enjoyed the Rhine set up. Why? Because the arena is loaded with Tigers milkrunning fields. Historically, Tigers were as rare as chicken's teeth. This is not the case in this set up. I have watched Tiger after Tiger spawn and respawn over and over. It takes a considerable effort to kill these over-modeled beasts (a close hit by a 1,000 lbs bomb would toss a Tiger around like a rag doll, except here they do nothing). So, when you finally kill it, and before you can land, the same guy has spawned at yet another field. Furthermore, to get the required 10 perks, all one has to do is spawn at a Strat base and shoot it up with a panzer.

Please, apply a higher perk requirement for the Tiger, or enable them for the Allies. The time frame of this scenario would be  January/February 1945. At that time the Allies had several armored vehicles that could handle the Tiger I, including the M-26 Pershing and the M-36 Jackson being but two.

As it stands now, the low-cost Tiger has completely unbalanced the game.

My regards,

Widewing
My regards,

Widewing

YGBSM. Retired Member of Aces High Trainer Corps, Past President of the DFC, retired from flying as Tredlite.

Offline Arfann

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Re: Insufficient perked Tiger
« Reply #1 on: February 24, 2003, 08:35:04 AM »
Quote
Originally posted by Widewing
I have not enjoyed the Rhine set up. Why? Because the arena is loaded with Tigers milkrunning fields. Historically, Tigers were as rare as chicken's teeth. This is not the case in this set up. I have watched Tiger after Tiger spawn and respawn over and over. It takes a considerable effort to kill these over-modeled beasts (a close hit by a 1,000 lbs bomb would toss a Tiger around like a rag doll, except here they do nothing). So, when you finally kill it, and before you can land, the same guy has spawned at yet another field. Furthermore, to get the required 10 perks, all one has to do is spawn at a Strat base and shoot it up with a panzer.

Please, apply a higher perk requirement for the Tiger, or enable them for the Allies. The time frame of this scenario would be  January/February 1945. At that time the Allies had several armored vehicles that could handle the Tiger I, including the M-26 Pershing and the M-36 Jackson being but two.

As it stands now, the low-cost Tiger has completely unbalanced the game.

My regards,

Widewing


Better yet, eliminate "Aces Low" completely. Or create a separate area/arena for nose pickers to ground pound in.

Offline Corwin

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Insufficient perked Tiger
« Reply #2 on: February 24, 2003, 08:46:21 AM »
As a nose miner, I have to say I agree the Tiger needs to be increased in cost.  Last night I rolled one onto a base and  trashed it.  I then proceeded to vulch P-51's taking off to my hearts content (lots of mg ammo in that bugger).  Several rockets attacks, near direct hits w/ 100lbers and lotsa .50 cals did no damage.  Finally a direct hit from a pair of 1000lbers took me out.  

By then I was tired and embarrased.  As the bombs fell I opened the hatch and spreads wide my arms beckoning them to end my oafish reign of terror. Actually, I was picking my nose with my left hand and machine gunning ponys with the right.  I had one of those modified tanker helmets that hold 2 Lowenbrau and has a straw that goes down the chin strap...

Horrido, indeed.:p

Offline GRUNHERZ

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Insufficient perked Tiger
« Reply #3 on: February 24, 2003, 08:55:08 AM »
Lemme see, yesterday in the CT  the germans gave the allies fits with Tigers while the allies apparently had dominace in the air with a big numbers advantage, sounds pretty accurate to me... :)

Offline Sakai

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Insufficient perked Tiger
« Reply #4 on: February 24, 2003, 08:56:04 AM »
Quote
Originally posted by Corwin
As a nose miner, I...

Horrido, indeed.:p


Bwahahahahahahahaha!

If those dupes had simply upped a Panzer 4 they could have ended you quickly.

Thanks for the writing, great stuff.

Sakai
"The P-40B does all the work for you . . ."

Offline Arfann

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Insufficient perked Tiger
« Reply #5 on: February 24, 2003, 10:37:45 AM »
Quote
Originally posted by Corwin
As a nose miner, I have to say I agree the Tiger needs to be increased in cost.  Last night I rolled one onto a base and  trashed it.  I then proceeded to vulch P-51's taking off to my hearts content (lots of mg ammo in that bugger).  Several rockets attacks, near direct hits w/ 100lbers and lotsa .50 cals did no damage.  Finally a direct hit from a pair of 1000lbers took me out.  

By then I was tired and embarrased.  As the bombs fell I opened the hatch and spreads wide my arms beckoning them to end my oafish reign of terror. Actually, I was picking my nose with my left hand and machine gunning ponys with the right.  I had one of those modified tanker helmets that hold 2 Lowenbrau and has a straw that goes down the chin strap...

Horrido, indeed.:p


Sinus Oysters are over modelled!!! Perk 'em!!!

Offline Sakai

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Insufficient perked Tiger
« Reply #6 on: February 24, 2003, 10:51:08 AM »
Quote
Originally posted by Arfann
Sinus Oysters are over modelled!!! Perk 'em!!!


I for one am sick of my tank exploding when I run over old nose candy left behind by some Tiger jerk.  HiTech overmodeled the nose and everyone knows it--everyone.  In Air Warrior, nose picking was properly modeled on the Denton-Hansen wet/dry nasal cavity research dating back to the 1950s which was corroborated by testing on effeminate arts-school students in the 1975 classic by Fortwith et al.  This data was even used to augment the Pica behavior for EPA Risk Assessments.  Even the Luftwhiners agree that this has always been the best data to "pick".

Sakai
"The P-40B does all the work for you . . ."

Offline Arfann

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Insufficient perked Tiger
« Reply #7 on: February 24, 2003, 01:01:14 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by Sakai
I for one am sick of my tank exploding when I run over old nose candy left behind by some Tiger jerk.  HiTech overmodeled the nose and everyone knows it--everyone.  In Air Warrior, nose picking was properly modeled on the Denton-Hansen wet/dry nasal cavity research dating back to the 1950s which was corroborated by testing on effeminate arts-school students in the 1975 classic by Fortwith et al.  This data was even used to augment the Pica behavior for EPA Risk Assessments.  Even the Luftwhiners agree that this has always been the best data to "pick".

Sakai


What he said!!  :eek:

Offline brady

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Insufficient perked Tiger
« Reply #8 on: February 24, 2003, 01:25:22 PM »
Well in The January time frame their were jardely any Tigers operating at all, in the Bulge for example their were only 1 or 2, the reast were all King Tigers which at this point were about the only Tigers on the Battle field, their were of course tons of Panthers roaming around, which were better tanks than the Tigers. It is fair to say that for the most part the Germans had Much better Armor than the allies did, the Tiger is representive of that.

  Their were I beleave only 7 pershings in Europe in WW2 while their were Fireflys and Some US TD units with 90mm guns, these are representd by the 37mm manable field gun that can kill tigers prety easy:)

 I also seam to remember one night whear Widewing killed me several times by droping 1000 pound bombs on my Tiger, I have killed several myself with just one 500 pound bomb, I think it is kinda funny that one of the best diver bombers in the game is complaning that he cant kill tigers when he has given me great pains in doing so.:)

Offline Widewing

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Insufficient perked Tiger
« Reply #9 on: February 24, 2003, 02:28:59 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by brady
Well in The January time frame their were jardely any Tigers operating at all, in the Bulge for example their were only 1 or 2, the reast were all King Tigers which at this point were about the only Tigers on the Battle field, their were of course tons of Panthers roaming around, which were better tanks than the Tigers. It is fair to say that for the most part the Germans had Much better Armor than the allies did, the Tiger is representive of that.

  Their were I beleave only 7 pershings in Europe in WW2 while their were Fireflys and Some US TD units with 90mm guns, these are representd by the 37mm manable field gun that can kill tigers prety easy:)

 I also seam to remember one night whear Widewing killed me several times by droping 1000 pound bombs on my Tiger, I have killed several myself with just one 500 pound bomb, I think it is kinda funny that one of the best diver bombers in the game is complaning that he cant kill tigers when he has given me great pains in doing so.:)


Sorry to have been such a source of suffering to you!!! :D

There were a great many more than just seven M-26s in service. Several companies of M-26 tanks were involved in the capture of the Ludendorf railway bridge at Remagen in February of 1945. By the end of he war, well over 200 M-26s were in combat with more arriving every day. In addition, over 300 M-36 90mm TDs were in frontline service. Add to those the M-18 Hellcat (probably the best tank destroyer built by any nation in WWII) and the much improved 76mm gunned Shermans (the Easy Eights being the best of them). So, there were some excellent armored vehicles in service during the last four months of the war.

In this scenario all the allies have is the Panzer Mk.IVH which has little more than a decent gun going for it.. As for the 37mm field guns killing the Tiger, yeah, sometimes they do. But, they are immobile, of short range and easily destroyed by virtually any thing.
 
As to dive-bombing Tigers: Easy enough except for several things.

1) A direct hit is required, not so easy when it’s moving. If you miss, you must then land and rearm, takeoff, climb and try again. All very time consuming.
2) They are not already on your airfield, requiring you to take off from at least a sector distant.
3) They respawn in seconds, whereas it may take several minutes to land and either rearm or grab another aircraft.
4) If more than one Tiger spawns, you will have a very difficult time keeping them at bay flying alone. Especially if the field is porked or a Tiger is parked on it.

I would rather see the Tiger perked so as to represent reasonable availability (Panthers made up only a relatively small minority of the German’s armor). Either that or offer it to the Allies who had an ever increasing number of 90mm armed vehicles during the period in question. Better yet, do both.

I do have the complete Order of Battle for the American Armies at the time, showing the allocation of M-18, M-26 and M-36 throughout the various units, should anyone need to see it.

My regards,

Widewing
My regards,

Widewing

YGBSM. Retired Member of Aces High Trainer Corps, Past President of the DFC, retired from flying as Tredlite.

Offline brady

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Insufficient perked Tiger
« Reply #10 on: February 24, 2003, 03:05:21 PM »
Ya post it, I was under the impreshion that only 7 actualy saw combat(M 26). It would be nice having one of those open toped american TD's they be prety easy to kill, what with their light armor which was easly penatrated by most all German guns, kinda like the Panzer IV armor is by the Tigers gun, although I have experanced times when i have hit Panzer IV's like 8 or more times with the 88 to no avail.

 davitpt40 said this in another thread:

 "Pershings fought in only 1 major battle. I'm sure everyone has seen the Pershing kill the Panther on the history channel. A couple of Pershings were lost in combat. At least 1 was destroyed by a tiger, another by a Jagdpanther."




 
 Panther's,Tiger's,King Tiger's, Jagdpanther's, Elephants, Jagdtiger's, even Panzer Jadjer IV's, and Hertz's inflected huge cashualities aganst most all American armor their effect's in this regard is legendary, the present set up is intended to reflect this.
« Last Edit: February 24, 2003, 03:26:47 PM by brady »

Offline CROOKS

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Insufficient perked Tiger
« Reply #11 on: February 24, 2003, 04:18:54 PM »
Perks wreck game play !

CROOKS

Offline eskimo2

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Insufficient perked Tiger
« Reply #12 on: February 24, 2003, 05:23:51 PM »
I don't like limiting GVs or planes with perks, it doesn't work well IMHO.  It's better to limit the bases that they are available from.
This is coming from a guy with over 8,000 fighter perk points...

eskimo

Offline brady

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Insufficient perked Tiger
« Reply #13 on: February 24, 2003, 07:10:13 PM »
One nice thing about this map is that you cant run it with GV's thier are points that you can only take with planes.