Author Topic: Iraq underestimated ? (Read 1892 times)

Batz · « **Reply #15 on:** March 24, 2003, 10:14:19 AM »

only an idiot would come to that conclusion after 5 days of war.

The Coalition has already advanced much further then in Gulf 1. And if you understand the type of mobile thrusts that the Coalition seems to be following you would know the lead elements are pushing rapidly in country while leaving and / or avoiding certain pockets that are left to be cleaned up by follow on forces.

What inside info do you that makes you assume the Coalition is rinning of time of that anything they have faced was "unexpected"?

Contrary to what you may think the US took casualties in Gulf 1 and in Afghanistan. They will take casulties in this war.

By any messure or any comparison to previous wars this Coalition has made great progress.

As others have pointed out there was no "under estimating" this war. We all know that Saddam has his fanatics and those whos only choice is to defend this regime. We all know that these types of folks will use civilians and any method of warfare to try to hang on. The reality is it wont work.

As to being seen as liberators that will come when the population is sure that Saddam and his regime can no longer reach them. Removing that fear and providing humanitarian aid to the Iraqis will work to the Coalitions favor. Getting a secure port to begin unloading and delivering aid is a priority.

GrimCO · « **Reply #16 on:** March 24, 2003, 10:17:45 AM »

As much as I hate to admit it, many Americans are ignorant. They've all but forgotten that people die in wars. This is what wars do, they kill people... Including Americans...

The tree hugging peaceniks will of course wave their peace signs ever higher with each American that dies and try to say I told you so. The news media is of course no help in this matter.

A media spectacle is made of each American soldier that dies, which in a way is a credit to the way the military is running things. Rather than reporting hundreds of casualties at a time, we hear about one or two.

Although I feel we will lose quite a few soldiers when we enter Baghdad, I certainly don't feel this will be another Vietnam.

davidpt40 · « **Reply #17 on:** March 24, 2003, 11:05:48 AM »

Urban fighting is rough, but if you use the Battle of Mogadishu as reference, taking Baghdad wont be as bad as you think.

mauser · « **Reply #18 on:** March 24, 2003, 11:06:23 AM »

Quote

Originally posted by Saurdaukar
Bush never underestimated the fighting. He's reported every night as saying something to the effect of "it will be a long, hard fight."

Its the media that underestimated the fighting.

I agree.. it's the media and it's constant speculation over
everything. During the Centcom press briefing, I heard many
stupid questions being asked by the press. Some guy from Hong
Kong asking the general there what would you say to the family
of an innocent civilian killed after we attack a city or something
along those lines. Someone else asked the same question about
underestimating the Iraqis. I guess it could be that they're told
to ask these questions by their bosses or something, but that
doesn't make it less stupid. I'm sure most generals have
studied their history well enough to realize that the stuff
happening isn't very surprising. However, I can't say the same
about the press so far, if I judge them solely by their questions.

mauser

midnight Target · « **Reply #19 on:** March 24, 2003, 11:11:02 AM »

My God!

We have taken 2/3 of the country of Iraq, we have moved entire armored columns hundreds of miles and brought a force to bear on a well armed enemy with less casualties than we have on a normal rainy weekend in California.

People who think this is anything but a triumph of the greatest military power on Earth are just misinformed.

Mathman · « **Reply #20 on:** March 24, 2003, 11:12:48 AM »

The US has lost a total of around 30 troops in 5 days and you are saying that we underestimated them? OK, if you say so.

Defiance · « **Reply #21 on:** March 24, 2003, 11:18:36 AM »

Hiya's,
This aint a darn video game

It was stressed from the start of the conflict it would'nt be a quick thing

Seems some assume it's running like a damn train timetable

It's like shifting sand, Things change all the darn time

Iraqui's in grid 240A one night, Ok guys lets goto 240a hmmm seems enemy has moved, This is real not something you can plan and stick to 100% of the time

Let's give the guys in the front all the time they need, Let em pinpoint targets with as much accuracy and least loss of live to civs as possible

This has got to be fought very carefully as not only is the rest of the world watching afterwards the people of iraq will be asking questions on all aspects of their cassualties

Best have a long slog that results in very minimal forces/civ loss of life than a quick-blow everything up kind of affair don't ya think

If some want a quick battle/war i suggest america's army online or OFP or maybe Mohaa etc

fffreeze220 · « **Reply #22 on:** March 24, 2003, 11:34:47 AM »

If Bagdad (the town) doesnt surrender when US/Brits arrive it will be Saigon #2 for the coalition forces

AKIron · « **Reply #23 on:** March 24, 2003, 12:12:55 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by fffreeze220
If Bagdad (the town) doesnt surrender when US/Brits arrive it will be Saigon #2 for the coalition forces

I'm betting Bagdhad will fall within a week of the start of the seige. It may require an extensive air assualt first though. We'll probably find Saddam sooner than that once our forces arrive.

I really hope France, Germany, and Russia continue to oppose our efforts in the UN. I'm ready to see the creation of a new world body.

Frogm4n · « **Reply #24 on:** March 24, 2003, 12:18:11 PM »

80 percent of their military was destoryed in the first war, and whatever was left over was bombed on occasion by the UN. To think they would put up any kind of resistance besides guerilla is silly. They really should rename the operation thought. Kinda hard to liberate a people that dont want to be.

Wlfgng · « **Reply #25 on:** March 24, 2003, 12:28:39 PM »

12 years is a long time to rebuild...
I doubt the Iraqi's will go down easily.. they learned a thing or two since the last war with the US.

Hopefully we can get this over with soon or the looong looong supply line to Bahgdad will be difficult to protect.

Siaf__csf · « **Reply #26 on:** March 24, 2003, 12:35:03 PM »

If the people want to fight and Saddam really has those 7 million assault rifles he bragged about, taking baghdad can indeed be very difficult.

You have to remember that the culture allows sending 10-year old boys harvesting mines with a keychain to 'heaven' around thier necks. They think dieing as a martyr is something to look forward to.

batdog · « **Reply #27 on:** March 24, 2003, 12:35:08 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by Frogm4n
80 percent of their military was destoryed in the first war, and whatever was left over was bombed on occasion by the UN. To think they would put up any kind of resistance besides guerilla is silly. They really should rename the operation thought. Kinda hard to liberate a people that dont want to be.

Where have you heard they have no desire to be free of Saddam?
The only ones who are going to stick w/him are those who have tied thier futures w/his.

It'll be interesting to see what the people say after this is over.

Oh and as far as "learning anything"... this conflict is way different than the first gulf war. There we bombed them for weeks and cut them off from Iraq. Now we are psuhing into area's where static defense's w/fresh troops is possiable. Especialy if they are dug into civilian areas..areas we have no desire to level due to the body count that will be upped w/such an action (civilian bodies)

Hristo · « **Reply #28 on:** March 24, 2003, 01:30:25 PM »

A 2,000,000 populated, multiple division defended "pocket" ? Hmmmm.

narsus · « **Reply #29 on:** March 24, 2003, 01:57:51 PM »

Well during the first gulf war, many of the surrendering iraqis were bombed for 3 months straight of course they didn't want to fight. With the ground war starting immediately this time it is a totally different story.

Every briefing I saw said that the war would be tough going, the republican guard being the hard nut to crack. The war is progressing (as well as wars can i guess) rather well.