Now this is why FB is so great...

[Kirin]

http://mywebpages.comcast.net/Tailspin/documents/CEM_IL2FB.pdf

Although there are some mistakes in the "manual" it shows what depth lies within the CEM of FB!

Thank god (aka Kurt Tank) for the Kommandogerät in my 190...

[Hristo]

You mean you don't like 109E engine management ?

That is some serious challenge !

[Creamo]

CEM will never work in AH, although I truly enjoy it in FB. Simulations and gameplay oriented software like AH just don’t mix.

[Hristo]

One of best the looking skins so far

[Hortlund]

heh, its back to the schoolbench for me. I have been spending the past two days familiarizing me with the game...you know configuring the joystick (took me about a day...for some reason my stick was hyper sensitive, the slightest touch would send me into a mad spin almost like the joystic sensors was binary or something...odd)...then another couple of hours to remap all the keys...

So I decided to take an 109E7 up for a spin against an IL2 without tail gunner...seemed to be a good first flight. Well...I missed my first pass overshooting him, then it took a couple of minutes to reaquire him (green aircraft is bloody hard to spot vs a green ground), so I was closing in on him when my engine started to sound like a broken bicycle. Then I saw the IL2 starting to pull ahead, and my engine was giving more and more odd sounds. I tinkered a bit with the throttle, lowerd it, changed prop pitch (for some reason not even I know), opened the cowl flaps about halfway, and changed the mixture to 120%...still no luck. By now I was doing 240something at full throttle and max pitch and the engine sounded horrible. Anyway...after a couple of minutes flying at 80% throttle with 100% mixture, open cowl flaps and 70% pitch, the engine started to sound normal again. The IL2 was a mere speck on the horizon, so I increased pitch and throttle again, closed the cowl flaps down to 2 or something like that, and I could see I was gaining on him again.

But alas...after another 5 minutes the engine noise returned, and I decided to hit the schoolbooks on engine management instead...

This is an awesome game

[Kirin]

Originally posted by Creamo
CEM will never work in AH, although I truly enjoy it in FB. Simulations and gameplay oriented software like AH just don’t mix.

Actually for me there is no difference between gamplay and simulation. I am  a sim freak - the more realistic the better! Those so-called "gameplay-consessions" rather ruin a game for *me* than make it more enjoyable. But everyone has to decide that for themselves. CEM wouldn't work with AH because AHs target clientel does not want the extra workload. AH kinda depnds on pleasing the most part of the croud with one setting ("gameplay" vs. realism, plane-set, arena etc.) whereas IL2/FB has the luxury of covering the whole range of cyber-pilots - from the arcade-Crimson-Sky-type guy to the die-hard-let-me-turn-every-dial-in-the-plane freaks - everyone can set the difficulty he want! Nevertheless there is a hand full of go-all-the-way pilots whom I enjoy to fly with!

Well, I think CEM adds a ton to gameplay in terms of challenge and enjoyment - not to talk about historical accuracy. People in AH argue over planes being 10mph to slow and stuff like that ignoring the fact that more specs than speed, climb, turn etc. make out a plane - amongst others these are engine management and workload for the pilot (trim etc.). Some planes, like the 190s, profit tremendously from CEM, since they got everything automated. That's what is was like in RL - and that's what I want to have it like in my sim! So for *my* enjoyment of gameplay I need these things...  

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Oh, Hristo. I CANNOT wait!!!!

p.s.: for some reason my mail server is acting up: I already applied Kukys Mod - it works like a charm! But I think I gonna try your idea of sanding down the springs. Haven't heard a word from CubPilot yet - built in the stock pots from TM meanwhile. Got em from TM Europe support, took em 10 days but all free. Thinking of building a CEM console out of some mechanicals toys.

[Kirin]

Hey Hortlund - wasn't Ubisoft on Hangtimes list? I hope your friends don't read the praise you give FB or they gonna support the freedom fighters in the end...  

[Hristo]

Kirin, be sure to read Guillaume's article here:

http://cougar.frugalsworld.com/unsupported.php

It covers most types of play, including the mentioned center play.

[Hortlund]

Originally posted by Kirin
Hey Hortlund - wasn't Ubisoft on Hangtimes list? I hope your friends don't read the praise you give FB or they gonna support the freedom fighters in the end...  

I dunno Kirin, for some reason I get the feeling I shouldn't expect you to keep your word on me returning to fly with JG54 when I get this computer all sorted then...

[Batz]

Hortlund on the 109s

1. There no mixture control in 109s they are fuel injected

2. at 100% pitch the prop takes the smallest bite of air. So its sorta of like gears in a car. On take off 100% prop pitch. Once up you reduce throttle to about 70% (i do 65 for cruise) then pull prop pitch back. As you reduce prop pitch you take greater bites of air. Like a higher gear in a car. You eventually end up cruising with prop pitch at 0 and throttle at 70%.

At 0 you are taking the biggest bite of air so you dont need as much throttle.

While climbing (depending on the angle) its like going up hill in a car you "down shift" adjust prop pitch then give it more throttle. 90% prop pitch is usually enough to maintain decent climb.

Now in dives reduce throttle to 60% or so then adjust  prop pitch to keep from over revving (in the 109es dont go over 3000rpms then reduce throttle to say 60%).

The way adjustments should be made by is reducing throttle 1st then prop pitch.

Then the opposite increase prop pitch 1st then throttle. This will keep you from overrevving. As startup rpm should be max.

On the other 109s F-k you can set prop pitch to auto (shift 0 x 2; default). However the auto adjustments are extremely slow.

As for the 190s I dont see the  Kommandogerät  work.

It seems that its a regular constant speed prop. You just set a desired rpm setting then the prop pitch automatically adjusts to maintain rpms.

I had thought that in 190s by just using the throttle rpm would be set to given throttle position. It doesnt rpm stays at what ever position you set. Right now the 190s work the same as the most vvs planes and the p47. You can still over rev the 190 but its not likely. If you enter a dive at max rpm the at certain point prop will reach a point where it cant be reduced any more to maintain a constant rpm. If you dont adjust throttle you may over rev. But you most likely will rip a wing off by then. You can usually leave the 190s at max rpm.

In the 190s you adjust fuel mixture. Depending on alt, but you can test it by reducing mixture until you see rpm drop then go up 1 setting. You can also hear the eng change pitch.

120 mixture is never needed except on winter maps for take off and otd flying.

MW50 should be primed at idle. Idealy while otr waiting to take off. It doesnt activate until you go beyond 100% throttle. But even so if you run out of MW50 and are above 100% throttle you will burn your eng up. At lower alts max is 5 min of mw50 then reduce throttle below 100% and allow 5 min cool down. Higher up 10 min mw50 5 min cool down.

I dont think the CEM adds much. The problem with FB was incomplete documentation. Real pilots would have been trained on proper power settings. We have lots trial and error attempting to figure out what settings are best.

Also thats lots folks who assume they know something and they dont. The biggest is about mw50 and fuel mixture on 109s.

Theres only 3 setting you need to be concerned with

takeoff

climb/combat

cruise

figuring these out for each plane will reduce your work load. You wil need to make adjustments but you wont have fumble around wondering why you cant out climb a hurri in you 109e.

AH already models prop pitch and dont think adding a more complex eng management would be to much of a workload.

But what do I know.