Author Topic: Guns on aircraft, NOW!  (Read 277 times)

Offline StSanta

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Guns on aircraft, NOW!
« on: July 28, 2003, 09:13:34 AM »
Heh, bear with me; this might be entertaining.

Some argue that more, not less, guns will help lower deaths where firearms are used. The logic behind being that criminals will have to be more careful. A few disasters, such as the shooting at a restaurant (Lubys, rudys, something like that) are used as supporting evidence.

Another argument is that there is a right to bear arms and to protect oruselves. If carrying or owning handguns is illegal, only criminals will have them. In other words, you'll have unarmed victims and armed perpertrators. In general, criminals do not play by the numbers so a citizen needs to be prepared.

Let's apply this logic to specific situations.

Situation A: aircraft.  The hijackings on 9/11 was a result of armed perpertrators/unarmed citizens. The airlines and the government take away the possibility of a citizen of defending him/herself as soon as he/she boards an airplane. 9/11 could have been averted if citizens were allowed to carry guns also on planes.

Someone think this is too dangerous? Why, if we let it be outlawed, the only people with weapons on planes will be terrorists! Oh and those marshals and maybe pilots. They might lose it too - and then you're in deep doo doo unless you're armed.

As has been pointed out many times from both pro and anti-gun people (but primarily pro), criminals will get hold of a gun, legally illegally. It has also been shown that a motivated criminal also can manage to get one aboard a plane or basically any place if they have some imagination.

Why should a LAW ABIDING citizen be denied his/her right to carry a gun on a plane? Because there are CRIMINALS that misuse that right - well send them to prison! We have the laws for that already. What other concerns are there?

Accidental discharge in the plane - well, causing that is illegal and it is the law abiding citizens duty to ensure proper firearm safety. No need to revoke the rights of the vast majority because of a few idiots, right?

What other concerns - oh maybe someone gets upset/drunk and decides to use his force multiplier (read: gun) to get his will? Well Mr, that is ILLEGAL! We already have laws for that too; send those dudes to jail and let us law abiding citizens keep our god given constitutionally guaranteed right. If someone breaks the law in this manner it is good to know the rest of the people on the plane can plonk him down in no time. If they weren't allowed to carry guns they'd be at his mercy! Wait, then he wouldn't be able to...never mind, they'd BE AT HIS MERCY!

NO ONE can argue that "you do not need to be safe in the plane" or "others guarantee your freedom while you fly". Why? Because this same argument can be used ANYWHERE - in your home, on the street and so forth. Only one person is responsible for your safety, and that is YOU. Taking away what is at the very least a small chance of survival and relying on a faceless collective is not the answer. No; if we are masters of our fate on the ground, we must also be allowed to be masters of our fate in the air. There are countless examples of situations where armed passengers would have prevented massive loss of life.

You are not 100% safe from assault and violence on a plane and you should be allowed to have an effective defense against other citizens and criminals - not to mention a potentially opressive government!

Next situation: bars. Again we're talking law abiding citizens. Bet that if everyone was armed, the guy who's totally drunk and really miffed because another guy has just shagged his gf on the toilet and then accidentally spilled beer over his latest issue of Hustler Magazine will be reasonable. Guns and alcohol mix just fine as long as we remain LAW ABIDING citizens. If someone breaks the law - throw him in jail. Everyone being armed will work as a deterrent, after all and bring rational thoughts automatically.

People should be allowed to be armed when doing tours in the White House as well - ****e happens everywhere. If we disallow this it'll mean that only assassins and criminals will have them. And the government Secret Service. Would YOU trust your life to a terrorist/murderer/criminal? And that's only the politicians; there are also ordinary criminals out there.

Basically, since we are to remain masters of our own destiny we will need to protect ourselves everywhere. Everyone should be legally obliged to always, with no exceptions, carry a gun.

Disclaimer:
'It's sarcasm, and a similar post can/should/will be made on behalf of the pro-gunners. That'll be even easier.'
There are no arguments in this post. If there are, they're there by accident and this poster shall not be held liable to followups or retorts. If this poster stumbles upon something golden, he maintains the right to claim it as a real argument, despite the initial sentence in this disclaimer. If this posts is found to be irritating, inflaming, non factual and biased, then those finding it so are clearly wrong and probably need to get laid.

:D

Offline StSanta

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Guns on aircraft, NOW!
« Reply #1 on: July 28, 2003, 09:18:14 AM »
Oh and I have no point, really.

Or I do. first; we cannot assume rationality and 'law abiding citizens' remaining so under all circumstances.

Second: real concern; why SHOULD you leave your personal safety in the hands of other because there are some idiots who misuse rights/privileges? It is true, even in the US, that there are many situations where a persons ability to effectively defend him or herself is taken away. **** happens all the time and relying on it not happening when you're unable to effectively defend yourself is leaving your fate in the hands of others unnecessarily.

That's it.

Offline Mickey1992

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Re: Guns on aircraft, NOW!
« Reply #2 on: July 28, 2003, 09:19:02 AM »
Quote
Originally posted by StSanta
Heh, bear with me; this might be entertaining.


Nope.  :p

Offline CyranoAH

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Guns on aircraft, NOW!
« Reply #3 on: July 28, 2003, 09:50:55 AM »

Offline StSanta

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Guns on aircraft, NOW!
« Reply #4 on: July 28, 2003, 09:52:37 AM »
Ah you're saying it might not be entertaining?

I will, Sir, postulate that it is as impossible for you to prove that it MIGHT not be entertaining as it is for me to prove that Nirfur, God Of All Things Yellow And Purple, does not exist :).

Guns on planes for everyone, now! Kiddies too; they have a right to life, no? (ooh, mebbe I can work pro-choice in there too!) :)

Offline medicboy

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Guns on aircraft, NOW!
« Reply #5 on: July 28, 2003, 10:32:49 AM »
I agree with santa for the most part, but it should only be the people that pass a background check and have a ccw permit.  now as far as packing ammo in your checked bagage, that needs to be changed.  As it sits now if you fly abroad to do some hunting it is almost impossible to bring ammo with you.  WHat if your gun is sighted for your handloads or your cal. is not widely available???