Author Topic: So how bout this for a way to make the maps fun for now... (Read 2757 times)

Toad · « **Reply #45 on:** August 07, 2003, 04:46:26 PM »

Yeah NB, I was thinking that the simple addition of an LST to the fleet and making the LST the "VH" of the fleet might do it.

You might have fleets with LST's and fleets without LST's. In any event, sinking the LST would be the same as killing the VH and it would make CV-based capture unavailable.

There are workarounds, I think.

However, I think we might as well all just wait until AH2: TOD debuts. It's meant to draw the strat types and if it does, that may be the solution right there.

JB42 · « **Reply #46 on:** August 07, 2003, 05:32:34 PM »

Here's the fundemental problem with CVs vs. Land bases. A CV will always retain 100% fuel, it's ord, its ability to spawn gvs and PTs. Land bases, however, can have those things destroyed. Now lets look at the more subtle differences:

Ack: CV seems like hundreds of super fast firing auto ack, 14 manable guns. Airfield, 6 to 9 slower firing auto ack, 3 tops manable guns. So getting to the CV is far harder than getting into the Airfield.

Fuel: CV never has to worry about it. Airfield, a couple of rockets or some intense gun fire, bang down to 25%.

Ord: CV, never has to worry about it. Airfield, nail 2 to 4 bunkers and, well, you get the idea.

GVs: CV never has to worry about it. Airfield, 2000 lbs and its over.

Ok enough is enough. So again, tell me where this great injustice is that requires the CV hardness to be increased. I lost sight of it whilst going through the tremendous advantages the CV has.

muckmaw · « **Reply #47 on:** August 07, 2003, 05:48:18 PM »

Well, here's the short answer in my opinion.

A CV can and will cease to exist after one accurate pass by a level bomber flight.

To take out all flight capabilites at an airfield requires 3 accurate drops, in 2 passes from a single bomber flight, and multiple bomber flights with accurate drops for larger fields.

So in essence, one good bomber pilot can shut down a CV. It takes 2 for a small field, and as many as 6 for a large one.

Forget about Jabos.

Maybe that's the answer. I don't know. Sounded good though.

Mini D · « **Reply #48 on:** August 07, 2003, 05:56:10 PM »

Tie the cruisers into CV supply. Loose a cruiser, lose 1/4 fuel. Have 5 cruisers to cover ord and fuel.... maybe the destroyer to cover ord and 4 cruisers for fuel. (or whatever the small ones are called).

Simple way to visuall see what is affected and actually make them viable targets.

I also like having the CV ride lower in the water as it gets damaged as an option too.

MiniD

Toad · « **Reply #49 on:** August 07, 2003, 06:20:52 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by JB42
Here's the fundemental problem with CVs vs. Land bases. A CV will always retain 100% fuel, it's ord, its ability to spawn gvs and PTs. Land bases, however, can have those things destroyed.

And CV fights are pretty widely regarded as the "most fun" and "best" fights available on any of the maps.

What a puzzle, eh?

JB42 · « **Reply #50 on:** August 07, 2003, 06:37:32 PM »

Muck, are you leading me to believe that a mobile, stealthy attack platform SHOULD be as hard to destroy as a non-movable, always visable airfield? The price you pay for the advantages a CV group has over its land based cousins is that it need to be watched and taken care of.

A properly executed CV attack should have the airfield suppressed and not allowing anything from the attacked airfield up to kill the CV. Thats when the clock starts ticking. Can the CV based attack capture the airfield and redirect the CV group BEFORE bombers from a distant airfield destroy it. Man thats good stuff. Sounds like something straight out of Hollywood.

But no, what the carrier dweebs want is to be able to vulch an airfield indefinantly. A harder CV means 10 more minutes of vulching.

Being in a squad that doesnt fly off carriers, I too appreciate the battle against a CV group. But I also look forward to it ending and hopefully being successful in the airfields defense. The idea of endless inbounds off the carrier with no end in sight is horrible.

Successful carrier based attacks can be done. Just get off the vulch and destroy wagon and do the things needed to capture a base.

muckmaw · « **Reply #51 on:** August 07, 2003, 06:54:05 PM »

JB42-

I'm not leading you to believe anything. You were talking about the advantage a CV has over a ground field. I was simply pointing out it's one disadvantage. Even a putz like me can sink it in one pass with a flight of B-26's.

Kweassa · « **Reply #52 on:** August 07, 2003, 07:00:15 PM »

Quote

But no, what the carrier dweebs want is to be able to vulch an airfield indefinantly. A harder CV means 10 more minutes of vulching.

Exactly.

It also means 10 more minutes of kamikaze from suicidal dorks, and two more attempts of CV hunting buff runs from us weenies.

Which, will sink the CV, and then people will come to these boards and start whining to double the CV strength and numbers yet AGAIN.

And then what? The whole process will repeat itself until a CV group becomes the Death Star, which wipes out every base in its path in invincibility. And then, people will come here and whine how CVs are ruining other bases and people can't enjoy a good furball between CVs and land bases, this time, whining that the land bases are too weak.

Great, a gigantic 500 man DA. That's what you guys want, isn't it?

But hey, we've already got the DA... if so many people agree to your criteria on MA fun, then gather them around and go play a gigantic furball battle in the damned DA where its meant to, sheesh, instead of trying to turn the MA into one.

DrDea · « **Reply #53 on:** August 07, 2003, 07:05:37 PM »

Ahhh but the DA doesnt give perks does it? Its not always about fun,score makes the fun for most.If DA gave perks you could bet your bellybutton they would go for it then

Kweassa · « **Reply #54 on:** August 07, 2003, 07:10:12 PM »

Right.

And these same line of people who are whining, are people who say they have either thousads of perks, or hate any super planes or vehicles that have to do with expensive perks?

Don't make sense, Dea.

The only thing the MA offers which the DA doesn't have, is a staggering vulch with shameless seal clubbing - parking the CV, letting the first few unwitting average skill defenders get up, and then blowing them out of the sky again and again and thinking "now this is a 'furball'".

The DA meets perfect criteria.. no buff weenies, no strats, fields really close together ranging from deck to high alts.. so why aren't they in there?

JB42 · « **Reply #55 on:** August 07, 2003, 07:11:16 PM »

DA? Perks? What do you need perks for in the DA? everyting is free

DrDea · « **Reply #56 on:** August 07, 2003, 07:17:56 PM »

That was a sarcastic comment.If all the people that loved the furball,and I like em alot myself,were to all go to the DA they could have a blast.The thing is the lack of 2 things keeps them from doing it.1 and the biggest,,,NO perks. 2 and almost as big I would wager.No organisation.If someone came into the MA and said hey,I have an arena in H2H or in DA need "X" amount of furballers I would bet alot went.

muckmaw · « **Reply #57 on:** August 07, 2003, 07:51:00 PM »

I don't know Dea. I really don't think perks matter to most Furballs.

For alot of folks, it's the comraderie. Some furballers are members of squad who play different aspects of the game. Half the fun in AH is flying with your friends.

Then you've got the fact that you'll have a smaller population in the DA which means killing the same folks over and over. Also, fewer noobs to beat into submission.

Then you've got the problem of lack of recognition. No scores for DA kills. No "Soandso landed 47 kills in his C.205". No ego boost.

Then you've got the problem that the map is always the same, which does not allow the challenge of fighting over unfamiliar territory.

I think those are bigger issues for many folks. More so than perks. And a dedicated furballer once said...I forget who it was, Furballers don't need organization.

That being said, I have seen numbers in the DA as of late. Not huge but 18-25 at prime time. Thats about 18-25 more than usual.

Steve · « **Reply #58 on:** August 07, 2003, 08:28:38 PM »

Kweassa get off your frikking whining kick. Because I like an idea that you don't like I'm whining?

Stuff it.

Steve · « **Reply #59 on:** August 07, 2003, 08:32:51 PM »

42... it's not just 10 minutes more of vulching.. that's silly to assume that is the case.
Every day I hear something like: Great fight at A59. too bad someone had to sink the cv.

That's right some strat guy comes along and ended a fight 30 people were involved in.

Make the fights longer, many people would love it