Author Topic: Legal quiz - can a rape victim be liable for child support?  (Read 1165 times)

Offline gofaster

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Re: Legal quiz - can a rape victim be liable for child support?
« Reply #15 on: September 24, 2003, 02:52:28 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by miko2d
If an adult woman rapes an underage boy (possibly drugging a victim) or an adult man (say, a disabled invalid) and is convicted of assault or statutory rape, is she entitled to receive child support payments from him?

 miko


How can a man ejaculate if he isn't "into it" at some point?

Offline gofaster

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Found the story about that Iowa boy...
« Reply #16 on: September 24, 2003, 02:59:26 PM »
The URL is http://www.dmregister.com/news/stories/c4780934/20588813.html

Boy ends up paying own child support
By BILL REITER
Register Staff Writer
02/26/2003
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
 Rylan Nitzschke might be the only 11-year-old in Iowa to pay his own child support.

The Department of Human Services earlier this month went after the wages of Keith Nitzschke, Rylan's father, to recover more than $2,000 in unpaid support. The state also took money from two bank accounts in Nitzschke's name.

But one of the accounts was his son's, holding $220 the Lehigh boy built up by shoveling snow and doing chores in Okoboji, where he sees his dad alternate weekends. The state took half. And only half, not the full amount as what was alluded in the earlier story.

A state official said parents are warned that bank accounts can be tapped when payments are late.

"We do not do any of these sanctions if the obligator makes his child-support payments," said human services spokesman Roger Munns. "We have no interest in a child's savings."

Rylan had hoped to buy a PlayStation 2 video console.

"He was a little shocked," his father said.

When Rylan found out some of his money was gone, he asked his dad who took it. Nitzschke explained that he was behind on child-support payments and that the state had taken the money.

"It's like a child-support thing," Rylan said. "The account was under my name and my dad's name. I heard they thought it was part of my dad's money and they ended up taking it. It sucked."

Nitzschke wasn't happy, either. He said he understands why the agency took the money. He got behind and he's more than willing to pay what owes, he said, but he wants his son's money left alone.

Kim Whitmer, Rylan's mother, declined to comment.
 
"It really doesn't involve me," she said. Whitmer referred questions to state officials.
Yeah, there's a good role model for mothers.  Her son's money is gone and she has no comment...


Munns also declined to comment on specifics of the case, citing privacy rules. The savings account lists both Rylan and Keith Nitzschke. Nitzschke owed $2,078.70 in support, documents show.

Nitzschke contacted his state representative, Democrat Greg Stevens. An appeal was turned down by the human services agency. Nitzschke said he's filed a second appeal in district court.

Stevens said he knows of one other case in which a child's money was taken to satisfy unpaid support. In that case, the money was later returned. Munns said he'd heard of similar incidents.

"It's a lot of money to a kid, but it's not much money to us," Stevens said. "I'm sure what they're looking at is, people have probably tried to hide money in their account. In both these cases it's obviously not the case."

Munns said parents can avoid the problem by keeping their children's accounts under the custodial parent's name. He said the agency has the best interest of the child at heart.

Rylan, meanwhile, is waiting for his money.

"I don't think I'm going to get it back," he said.
« Last Edit: September 24, 2003, 03:08:51 PM by gofaster »

Offline ra

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Legal quiz - can a rape victim be liable for child support?
« Reply #17 on: September 24, 2003, 03:09:46 PM »
Quote
The paternalistic state purpose is: a person can be made accountable for something if it helps promote the social welfare (as perceived by the rulers), regardless if he is responcible for the problem.

That sound more maternalistic to me.  Either way, it's liberals trying to save us from ourselves.

Offline miko2d

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Legal quiz - can a rape victim be liable for child support?
« Reply #18 on: September 24, 2003, 03:27:41 PM »
mietla: Originally posted by miko2d: liberals and their pc thinking
Bingo. They are going to bury this country.


 I did not say that. From where I stand, there is a difference between democrat-socialists and republican-socialists but one would need a microscope to see it.

gofaster: How can a man ejaculate if he isn't "into it" at some point?

 Apparently some men can.

 Secondly, an underage boy is legally not capable of giving consent, even when no druging is involved. An adult having sex with underage person is a rape.


gofaster: You got a case reference for that decision?

 Sorry, no. I've got it from a source I trust, namely Stephen Baskerville, PhD, who teaches political science at Howard University.
 It was a radio commentary http://ftp://mp3.fcfnewsondemand.org/baskerville-child-SB-07Mar03.mp3, so obviously no bibliography attached. I've sent him an e-mail anyway.

 miko

Offline mietla

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Legal quiz - can a rape victim be liable for child support?
« Reply #19 on: September 24, 2003, 03:36:33 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by miko2d


 I did not say that. From where I stand, there is a difference between democrat-socialists and republican-socialists but one would need a microscope to see it.



Yes, you did not. I was quoting you and then tried to quote Eagler. I did copy/paste, but forgot to edit the name.

Appologies for attributing this quote to you.

Offline gofaster

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Legal quiz - can a rape victim be liable for child support?
« Reply #20 on: September 24, 2003, 03:55:05 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by miko2d
[
gofaster: You got a case reference for that decision?

 Sorry, no. I've got it from a source I trust, namely Stephen Baskerville, PhD, who teaches political science at Howard University.
 It was a radio commentary http://ftp://mp3.fcfnewsondemand.org/baskerville-child-SB-07Mar03.mp3, so obviously no bibliography attached. I've sent him an e-mail anyway.

 miko


Yeah, I saw the transcript of his radio commentary on the web.  Can't remember the URL, but I found it while looking for the Iowa boy story.  Might have been the MensNewsDaily site.

Also, there really is a Nick Young who handles Virginia child support matters for the state.

Offline Hortlund

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Legal quiz - can a rape victim be liable for child support?
« Reply #21 on: September 24, 2003, 03:56:18 PM »
The purpose of child support is to ensure that the Child has a somewhat reasonable childhood, money-wise.

In Sweden, if the father cant be found or if he is unable to pay child support, the government steps in and pays the child support.

In the US I have no idea how the system works, but it should have a similar mechanism.

Child support is for the benefit of the child not the mother. Given that the child cannot influence events taken place before its birth, it would be odd to punish the child for the actions of the mother.
I dont know about the US, but in Sweden a mother who had been found guilty of rape or sexual abuse vs a minor kid would probably lose custody over the kid anyway, so this question seems very irrelevant. However the basical principle is there. Child support is for the benefit of the child, not the mother. And irregardless of the mothers action, the child has the right to a reasonable childhood.

Offline JB73

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Legal quiz - can a rape victim be liable for child support?
« Reply #22 on: September 24, 2003, 04:31:17 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by Hortlund
The purpose of child support is to ensure that the Child has a somewhat reasonable childhood, money-wise.

In Sweden, if the father cant be found or if he is unable to pay child support, the government steps in and pays the child support.

In the US I have no idea how the system works, but it should have a similar mechanism.
us give free money?!? are you nutz? (oops we already pay for crack potatos and junk... why not add another pay out)

my dad was a "deadbeat dad" according to the letter of the law. he didnt pay any child support for 2 years that he was un-employed. my mother recieved Zero money during that time. 20 years later he got a subponea and freaked out. he called us up pissed as heck only to find out the state had been going through old records and found him. they wanted $7,800 (None of which my mother or i would see.. it was late penalities and fines is all).

i have a good relationship with my father and hold no ill will towards him BTW. it actually po'd me that the state would do that. (also BTW Wisconsin has some of the absolute toughest deadbeat dad laws in the nation, alot of states adopted theirs from us.)

but back to hortlund.. you are a judge right?

anyway the way it works in sweden sounds like it would help the mothers... but almost sounds like socialism (equally distribiting monies to all)

the welfare system in this country (USA) is the system in place to supposedly take care of situations like a father killed in a car crash and mother can't work. problem is so many take advantage of it and abuse it that its out of control. welfare reform was a huge topic here in Wisconsin a few years back.. our governer Tommy Thompson developed the plans. then GW stole him from us lol.

im kinda of rambling here but just to sum up. no we dont have a replacement for child support if dad cant be found. the search him out as long as it takes.
I don't know what to put here yet.

Offline texace

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Legal quiz - can a rape victim be liable for child support?
« Reply #23 on: September 24, 2003, 10:19:11 PM »
When the government wants money, especially money they feel is rightfully theirs, they are going to take it no matter who they take it from. :)

Offline B17Skull12

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Legal quiz - can a rape victim be liable for child support?
« Reply #24 on: September 24, 2003, 10:46:08 PM »
this is a thread calling lock in:D
II/JG3 DGS II

Offline Montezuma

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Re: Legal quiz - can a rape victim be liable for child support?
« Reply #25 on: September 24, 2003, 11:11:32 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by miko2d
If an adult woman rapes an underage boy (possibly drugging a victim) or an adult man (say, a disabled invalid) and is convicted of assault or statutory rape, is she entitled to receive child support payments from him?

 miko


No, becasuse she isn't going to get custody as an inmate/registered sex offender.

Offline Gunslinger

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Legal quiz - can a rape victim be liable for child support?
« Reply #26 on: September 25, 2003, 12:09:00 AM »
Quote
Originally posted by gofaster



If it was true that the state seized the funds for back child support, then Rylan would indeed see his money again, since it was seized from his father for payment to his mother as child support payments, assuming his mother gave it to him.

 


Heres whats sad....In some cases a man and a woman seporate Even if they get back together the state will collect child support....and the kids will never see a dime it goes to the state to pay for the collection and state assistance funds.  There was an AWSOME article on this son SOME magazine a few months back...could have been maxim could have been time cant remember.

In some cases the woman will go on state assistance,  if that happens the state will collect child support from the father only to repay the state assistance she recieved.  THE CHILD NEVER RECIEVES A DIME.  

There was aslo a story of a man that was held hostage in Iraq for three months (he worked for an oil company Pre gulf war I)  AT HIS WELCOME HOME PARTY sherrifs came to collect three months of back child support or throw him in JAIL.

Another story of a man that went to prison for 10 years....was later aquitted and the day he got out was handed a bill for $14,000 or somthing like that.

http://www.cryforchildren.org/cfdocs/51cs.cfm

The above link is some good reading on the story...if your a man it will get your blood boiling

just my 2 cents...my wife better never leave me

Offline mia389

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Legal quiz - can a rape victim be liable for child support?
« Reply #27 on: September 25, 2003, 12:29:25 AM »
Quote
Originally posted by JB73
wtf is wrong with our country???


LOL I agree

Offline miko2d

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Legal quiz - can a rape victim be liable for child support?
« Reply #28 on: September 25, 2003, 07:37:27 AM »
Hortlund: The purpose of child support is to ensure that the Child has a somewhat reasonable childhood, money-wise.

 Sure. If society mandates that a child must get certain level of income, the people responcible for bringing a child into the world must pay for it.
 If that is not possibe, the society in general must pay for it as the one mandating the income standard.

 Unfortunately US and states legal systems often dump that burden on whoever they can grab.
 Like if you marry or live with a woman who has children and then divorce her - you are held liable for their support for ex-step-children.
 If you put you name on a birth certificate and then find out you are not the father - being a victim of a deceit by a mother or a mistake or a marital infidelity - you have no legal recourse and must pay.

 There is no set level of support, so a woman can ask for review as often as she wants while a man cannot do that.

 All those policies are incredibly destructive to the marriage.


Montezuma: No, becasuse she isn't going to get custody as an inmate/registered sex offender.

 Are you saying that anyone who is a registered sex offender has his/her children automatically taken form them? Even those born after the offence?
 Anyway, the victim of the rape is still held responcible for child support, even if the mother does not see any of it.

 miko
« Last Edit: September 25, 2003, 07:39:37 AM by miko2d »

Offline Scootter

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Re: Re: Legal quiz - can a rape victim be liable for child support?
« Reply #29 on: September 25, 2003, 09:03:02 AM »
Quote
Originally posted by gofaster
How can a man ejaculate if he isn't "into it" at some point?



I understand a man in a coma or brain dead can be "coaxed" in this event. Ever had a wet dream? this is an  unconchess event, at least from a physical standpoint. It is pretty much a physical event how do you think ugly chicks get knocked up?