Military family predicament.

[miko2d]

Both military and the court system derive their authority from the government, so I will refer to them as "the government" and do not give me that BS about them being different things.

 A husband is a 20-year service tank commander currently on duty in Iraq.
 A wife is a military medic reservist also serving in Iraq. Currently she is on leave statewide but is due to return.

 They have 7 children that are watched by the relatives according to the mandatory plan required by the military. So far so good.

 The government in the person of the military command tells her that if she does not return to duty in Iraq, she will be court-martialled and go to jail.

 The government in the person of a judge tells them both that if she returns to duty in Iraq, the couple would lose two of their children - by taking away their custody and giving it to the husband's ex-wife.

 Of course that's not really a choice because as soon as she goes to jail for the refusal to return, the judge will take away their custody anyway.

 Quite a fix.

 miko

[Sikboy]

Is this another birth control thread?

-Sik

[GtoRA2]

Miko
 That sucks, but maybe the kids would be better with their mother for the time being and when the dad gets back he can take her to court and get them back?

Still a crappy situation. Any judge who would do this is a jerk.

[wklink]

Originally posted by miko2d
Both military and the court system derive their authority from the government, so I will refer to them as "the government" and do not give me that BS about them being different things.

 A husband is a 20-year service tank commander currently on duty in Iraq.
 A wife is a military medic reservist also serving in Iraq. Currently she is on leave statewide but is due to return.

 They have 7 children that are watched by the relatives according to the mandatory plan required by the military. So far so good.

 The government in the person of the military command tells her that if she does not return to duty in Iraq, she will be court-martialled and go to jail.

 The government in the person of a judge tells them both that if she returns to duty in Iraq, the couple would lose two of their children - by taking away their custody and giving it to the husband's ex-wife.

 Of course that's not really a choice because as soon as she goes to jail for the refusal to return, the judge will take away their custody anyway.

 Quite a fix.

 miko

I am assuming that she has talked to JAG about this.  I am also assuming that she has talked to JAG about this as well.  

There are ways to get compassionate reassignments.  To be honest, she needs to do some footwork.  It is not hard getting out of a deployment if you have a reasonable reason not to go.  This seems pretty reasonable.  

I also advise her to get out of the Reserves.  This is not to be cruel but if she is not able to perform her military duties due to family problems then she doesn't need to be in the military.  This is spoken as a career military officer here.  I am not being mean or saying she is a bad person but this is not a temporary problem so all she is doing is causing an ultimate drain on the system.  The primary role of the US Army is to go to war and if she can't perform this duty, then she needs to get out and free up a slot for someone that can.  You can see how it is coming back to bite her in the butt.

If worse comes to worse, she should just fail to report.  Yes, she will face Article 15 hearings but to be honest, even if it goes to courts marshall she probably will get off with nothing more than less than honerable discharge.

Better than losing her kids.

[Rude]

The Government should not require both Father and Mother to serve actively, especially in a combat enviroment, at the same time.

I believe the Government will not follow thru with these charges.

[miko2d]

GtoRA2: ...but maybe the kids would be better with their mother for the time being and when the dad gets back he can take her to court and get them back?

 Right. Two people serving in Iraq and looking ahead to a painful, expensive legislative battle upon return to hopefully retrieve their children. And the longer they stay there, the less chance they would succeede.
 And if one of them dies, the other one would never get the custody back. Yeah, quite an insentive to risk one's life for their country.

Still a crappy situation. Any judge who would do this is a jerk.

 He is doing his duty. The children's mother applied for custody and he had no right to deny her hearing.

 I do believe the military will backpedal and not court-martial her for a clear derelictipon of duty. Which will be illegal, destructive to morale and very unfair to other people who left children back here.

 Whichever side you consider - judge, ex-mother, the family, the military - I sympathise with their position. Unfortunately they mutually exclusive.

 miko

[DmdNexus]

Is this a real situation?
Do you have a link to it?

And do they know that they can call their congressman, who will then call the base commander and get this matter resolved?

I know this from personal experience. We had a guy in the UK under correctional custody to avoid an Article 15, who called his mom, said the AF was making him go blind.... she called her congressman... the next day the base commander had this guy's entire chain of command in his office answering questions.

The guy was a goof ball.. glued his roomates shoes to the floor of his locker... he eventually was kicked out of the service... never went blind.

[miko2d]

I heard it on the radio. Must show on the web soon if not there by now.
 They can go to the congressman or wherever and probably get an exception, sure. I am not so sure it is good for a military/society to operate on exceptions. There is a reason we have laws. The bad laws must be amended, not ignored.

 miko

[Batz]

The military wife has no say in the status of the military male's children unless she has adopted them. If the male's ex-spouse (or "baby's mother"; what ever the case maybe) thinks it's in the best interest of her children for them to be with her she has a right to go to court to have that addressed.

The father's current wife has no right to claim anything in regards to his children. The 2 children in question have a mother and unless she has given up her rights her children are hers and the fathers responsibility.

So the current wife has no claim to hardship. This is between the father and the mother and their 2 children. If the mother is capable of providing quality care for her children while the father is away on deployment then the court will decide what's best. The court can't require the father's wife to do anything.


Sounds like bull**** to me. I dont know of any incident where a court threatened to take a child away from a parent if that parent's spouse refused to quit her job and take care of a child which isn't even hers.

[AKIron]

So, the ex-wife of the father is the mother of the children? Ex-wife is an interesting way to phrase it when the children are the subject.

Anyhow, I think there are extenuating circumstances not revealed here. I'd be willing to bet that the stepmother of these 7 children could ask for a discharge and it would be granted. I bet that solution has even been offered and rejected by her and her husband. If so, they have no complaint imo.

Also not disclosed is the position of the mother. Has she been actively seeking custody? That could be a big factor in this situation.

[capt. apathy]

That sucks, but maybe the kids would be better with their mother for the time being

without knowing the detail I could be way off but if I had to guess I'd say not.

from the cases I've seen a mother generally has to be doing a pretty lousey job not to get costudy of her own children in a divorce.  

especially if the father is in the military.  it makes it very easy for the mother to argue that she would provide a more stable home while the father could uproot the children many times as he gets bounced from post to post.

[Dago]

Are these people completely lacking in foresight???

If you are in the military, expect to be sent overseas, deployed in the time of war.  They should have expected and prepared for this.  Both of them being in the military while being responsible for 7 children is ludicrous and selfish.

Tell them not to whine when the easily predictable actually happened!

I sympathize if they really are in danger of loosing a child or two, that would be devestating, but would the children be in danger of anything by being place with their birth mother?  Not normally a worst case scenario.  

Best that one of them pleads a hardship case to the military and asks to be allowed to resign and return to civilian life for the benefit of the children.

dago

[Martlet]

Originally posted by Dago
Are these people completely lacking in foresight???

If you are in the military, expect to be sent overseas, deployed in the time of war.  They should have expected and prepared for this.  Both of them being in the military while being responsible for 7 children is ludicrous and selfish.

Tell them not to whine when the easily predictable actually happened!

I sympathize if they really are in danger of loosing a child or two, that would be devestating, but would the children be in danger of anything by being place with their birth mother?  Not normally a worst case scenario.  

Best that one of them pleads a hardship case to the military and asks to be allowed to resign and return to civilian life for the benefit of the children.

dago

We have a winner!  Thank you voice of reason.